Is it possible we could just use the netrunner card game to make a hacking mechanic out of?
To save time and make things quicker the runner would start with some icebreakers and software installed. Using hacking as your action would just let you take one in game turn.
The other side wouldn't have a deck or hand, they would just have ice unrevealed and nodes to do different things. They wouldn't need to pay to reveal ice as well.
So basically if the hacker decides they want to make a run on lets say the opposing guys gun they just need to make a run on it. They get one turn to draw cards, build creddits and finally make the run. If they are successful it will be counted as a successful run.
For more complex hacking attempts they might need several turns to build cards and bypass the ice (revealing it to see what they need to go through, etc.). More secure pieces would simply have better ice protecting them.
The hacking skill would limit how much the hacker starts with in play. Maybe one card per skill point. We could even work in a mechanic where the hacker has to buy his decks cards using nuyen.
Netrunner for Sahdowrun Hacking
Moderator: Moderators
-
Josh_Kablack
- King
- Posts: 5318
- Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm
- Location: Online. duh
I've heard nothing but good things about Android Netrunner.....
Until this you posted this stupid idea.
This in no way solves the fundamental problem of "the decker player gets their own minigame while all the other players do nothing" and the secondary problem of "putting chargen resources into the decking minigame makes deckers inferior at the other minigames; sometimes so much so that optimum decker chargen involves building a character who can skip out on the combat, legwork and social minigames -- thereby resulting in a decker player who does nothing when decking isn't happening and a non-cooperative story"
Here you are trying to make the minigame shorter, but if you are going for this radical a redesign of Shadowrun, you could actually fix the problem by making changes that actually resolve those issues. Such as:
And I'm sure someone who's played more than the handful of Shadowrun sessions I have could come up with better.
Until this you posted this stupid idea.
This in no way solves the fundamental problem of "the decker player gets their own minigame while all the other players do nothing" and the secondary problem of "putting chargen resources into the decking minigame makes deckers inferior at the other minigames; sometimes so much so that optimum decker chargen involves building a character who can skip out on the combat, legwork and social minigames -- thereby resulting in a decker player who does nothing when decking isn't happening and a non-cooperative story"
Here you are trying to make the minigame shorter, but if you are going for this radical a redesign of Shadowrun, you could actually fix the problem by making changes that actually resolve those issues. Such as:
- Hacking is part of the combat minigame. Hackers get to debuff enemies (via disabling their cyber gear), misdirect and change alligience of lower threat enemies (via altering communications or outright mindconrtol) and cause electrical explosions (via overload) during firefights.
- Cyberspace is just another location that uses the same resolution mechanics as real space, hackers get to bring the entire PC party along into cyberspace and then the party goes on a VR dungeoncrawl together.
- Hacking is not a distinct role. Either there are no hackers or everyone is some degree of Hacker (the way everyone is some degree of combatant.
And I'm sure someone who's played more than the handful of Shadowrun sessions I have could come up with better.
"But transportation issues are social-justice issues. The toll of bad transit policies and worse infrastructure—trains and buses that don’t run well and badly serve low-income neighborhoods, vehicular traffic that pollutes the environment and endangers the lives of cyclists and pedestrians—is borne disproportionately by black and brown communities."
-
TheFlatline
- Prince
- Posts: 2606
- Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:43 pm
The Netrunner reboot is pretty cool.
Using it to replace the matrix rules hurts my head.
There's nearly no way possible that you could make that play out faster than even the old SR paradigm of a virtual dungeon running parallel to the normal game. Not to mention that integrating the game into SR would create... interesting conflicts. Like the corporate cards that allow you to blow up the hacker in the real world for a relatively paltry amount of money.
I still say if you're going Hollywood hacking there are better systems out there. The choice is, do you want super-granular hacking games? If so, Frank's End of the Matrix is about as good as it gets. It also happens to be too detailed for me personally. Nobody pays that detailed attention to magic and mana in the game, and the entire metaplot basically sucks brown elf nipples it loves magic so much.
I argue that an abstracted "Hollywood" hacking system is more in line with rigging, combat, and magic. Make it fun and interesting with good decision points but not so detailed that you get shit like the Hall of Mirrors and the Agent Smith problem, and then technobabble the fluff in.
Using it to replace the matrix rules hurts my head.
There's nearly no way possible that you could make that play out faster than even the old SR paradigm of a virtual dungeon running parallel to the normal game. Not to mention that integrating the game into SR would create... interesting conflicts. Like the corporate cards that allow you to blow up the hacker in the real world for a relatively paltry amount of money.
I still say if you're going Hollywood hacking there are better systems out there. The choice is, do you want super-granular hacking games? If so, Frank's End of the Matrix is about as good as it gets. It also happens to be too detailed for me personally. Nobody pays that detailed attention to magic and mana in the game, and the entire metaplot basically sucks brown elf nipples it loves magic so much.
I argue that an abstracted "Hollywood" hacking system is more in line with rigging, combat, and magic. Make it fun and interesting with good decision points but not so detailed that you get shit like the Hall of Mirrors and the Agent Smith problem, and then technobabble the fluff in.
Last edited by TheFlatline on Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
basically what Josh said
I had this thought years ago, though
I had this thought years ago, though
For a minute, I used to be "a guy" in the TTRPG "industry". Now I'm just a nobody. For the most part, it's a relief.
Trank Frollman wrote:One of the reasons we can say insightful things about stuff is that we don't have to pretend to be nice to people. By embracing active aggression, we eliminate much of the passive aggression that so paralyzes things on other gaming forums.
hogarth wrote:As the good book saith, let he who is without boners cast the first stone.
TiaC wrote:I'm not quite sure why this is an argument. (Except that Kaelik is in it, that's a good reason.)
-
TheNotoriousAMP
- Journeyman
- Posts: 170
- Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2014 3:59 am
- Location: St. Louis
Sorry to mention Deadlands again (I tend to do it too much) but you could basically treat the matrix like they treat the Hunting Grounds (spirit realm). Basically what happens is that to enter the Deadlands, you need a shaman/magic person and to get around it and the like they are also crucial. However, the party during combat is pretty effective, meaning that they are sort of the bodyguard for the shaman.
Josh's idea of having the whole party enter the matrix is interesting in that regard. 4th edition already had the AR/VR rules, where the hacker could still be fighting in combat, though at mucho penalty. What you could have is a number of the party, depending on how ambitious they are feeling, could follow the hacker in (fluff wise they are "piggybacking" off of his signal) and then could support him, while also fighting in reality at a penalty. The hacker remains an important part of the team, because without him they can't piggyback in, so he remains a distinct character, but it also allows other people to help him out in his minigame. Not to mention, it adds a bit of team strategy, wherein the party divides its resources between dedicated matrix, AR taking penalties for both and full on reality where they are protecting the rest.
Still doesn't fully solve the in matrix hacker minigame (though out of matrix it should be as Josh says, debuff and the like) but it does allow more people to participate, and the rest of the party gets the feeling that they are an integral cog in the machine.
Not so thrilled about hacker not being a distinct role, though. Hackers are sort of a core part of Shadowrun and its a bit like a face or mage sacrificing combat skills for additional benefits and roles. They should be a specialized member of a squad, with others who can support them at times and be supported by them at others.
Josh's idea of having the whole party enter the matrix is interesting in that regard. 4th edition already had the AR/VR rules, where the hacker could still be fighting in combat, though at mucho penalty. What you could have is a number of the party, depending on how ambitious they are feeling, could follow the hacker in (fluff wise they are "piggybacking" off of his signal) and then could support him, while also fighting in reality at a penalty. The hacker remains an important part of the team, because without him they can't piggyback in, so he remains a distinct character, but it also allows other people to help him out in his minigame. Not to mention, it adds a bit of team strategy, wherein the party divides its resources between dedicated matrix, AR taking penalties for both and full on reality where they are protecting the rest.
Still doesn't fully solve the in matrix hacker minigame (though out of matrix it should be as Josh says, debuff and the like) but it does allow more people to participate, and the rest of the party gets the feeling that they are an integral cog in the machine.
Not so thrilled about hacker not being a distinct role, though. Hackers are sort of a core part of Shadowrun and its a bit like a face or mage sacrificing combat skills for additional benefits and roles. They should be a specialized member of a squad, with others who can support them at times and be supported by them at others.
LARIATOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!