Count Arioch the 28th wrote:This is a non US thing, and the idea popped in my head about the Women Against Pornography thing.
I have heard that if you're a woman on welfare or unemployment (or whatever the German word for that is, no doubt something with fifteen syllables), they can tell you to get a job at a legal brothel, and if you refuse they can take away their unemployment because she's refusing a job that is offered.
Can anyone more knowledgeable about Germany confirm/deny this?
A Technicality, but if you are forced to do it under threat of losing something you need to live, then it's not volountary anymore, and involountary prostitution is still illegal in germany, even if the state is the pimp in question.
Basically, you are allowed to become a prostitute if you want to, but nobody is allowed to make you do it under any circumstances. As an aside, if you do go that route, you are likely to make much more than you'd get on unemployment probably i guess . .
If we use 100 bucks as a flat fee, then at once per day you are looking at 2800+ per month, which is above average pay . .
Even if you leave out weekends for only 5 work days a week, you are still looking at 2000 bucks a month.
Minimum Wage that's coming for germany on january 1st of 2015 is something like 8,5 bucks or so per work hour. And at 40 hours a week, this then becomes 1360 bucks per month. and that is before you pay taxes . .
That's a complicated question though. I mean, if prostitution is legal, then it should be treated like any other job. If you are refusing the job presented to you, then you are unemployed out of your free will and shouldn't get any benefits for being unemployed. With legal prostitution, there shouldn't be a difference between "Go be a floor sweeper in the school or we'll take away your unemployment benefits" and "Go be a prostitute or we'll take away your unemployment benefits". A job is a job.
It doesn't seem complicated to me in the least. People in civilised countries* have a right to not be forced to have sex which overrides literally all legal duties in the - hopefully unlikely - event of a conflict.
If you really wanted to shoehorn in an ability to make a like for like comparison, clearly "willing to have sex with strangers in exchange for money under conditions compatible with the brothel in question" is a job skill without which you are not qualified and cannot be hired, rather than it counting as refusal as such. Sayeth the shitty mathematician turned trainee accountant rather than a lawyer though.
* this means this is a necessary and not sufficient standard for being a civilised country rather than being a well researched statement
Kaelik wrote:Because powerful men get away with terrible shit, and even the public domain ones get ignored, and then, when the floodgates open, it turns out there was a goddam flood behind it.
Omegonthesane wrote:It doesn't seem complicated to me in the least. People in civilised countries* have a right to not be forced to have sex which overrides literally all legal duties in the - hopefully unlikely - event of a conflict.
If you really wanted to shoehorn in an ability to make a like for like comparison, clearly "willing to have sex with strangers in exchange for money under conditions compatible with the brothel in question" is a job skill without which you are not qualified and cannot be hired, rather than it counting as refusal as such. Sayeth the shitty mathematician turned trainee accountant rather than a lawyer though.
* this means this is a necessary and not sufficient standard for being a civilised country rather than being a well researched statement
If you refuse a job offered to you while being unemployed you lose the unemployment benefits. Does this mean that you are forced to work under the threat of losing resources you need to live? Are you a slave? Can you dodge this by lacking a skill "willing to weave baskets in exchange for money"? Why do you consider prostitution to be unacceptable for an unemployed person to take*, but basket weaving to be acceptable?
* again, assuming that prostitution is a legal, recognised profession.
Hahaha, that is the funniest thing I've read all week. Elsevier is basically fox news. They still deny humans influence climate change for example.
Gary Gygax wrote:The player’s path to role-playing mastery begins with a thorough understanding of the rules of the game
Bigode wrote:I wouldn't normally make that blanket of a suggestion, but you seem to deserve it: scroll through the entire forum, read anything that looks interesting in term of design experience, then come back.
It's worth pointing out that in many places it's legal to fire people but it's not legal to threaten to fire them unless they have sex with you. I assume that there's an exception for prostitutes in Germany, but of course unemployed people have not yet volunteered to be prostitutes. Being a legal job doesn't make it the same as any other legal job.
DSMatticus wrote:It's not just that everything you say is stupid, but that they are Gordian knots of stupid that leave me completely bewildered as to where to even begin. After hearing you speak Alexander the Great would stab you and triumphantly declare the puzzle solved.
Omegonthesane wrote:It doesn't seem complicated to me in the least. People in civilised countries* have a right to not be forced to have sex which overrides literally all legal duties in the - hopefully unlikely - event of a conflict.
If you really wanted to shoehorn in an ability to make a like for like comparison, clearly "willing to have sex with strangers in exchange for money under conditions compatible with the brothel in question" is a job skill without which you are not qualified and cannot be hired, rather than it counting as refusal as such. Sayeth the shitty mathematician turned trainee accountant rather than a lawyer though.
* this means this is a necessary and not sufficient standard for being a civilised country rather than being a well researched statement
If you refuse a job offered to you while being unemployed you lose the unemployment benefits. Does this mean that you are forced to work under the threat of losing resources you need to live? Are you a slave? Can you dodge this by lacking a skill "willing to weave baskets in exchange for money"? Why do you consider prostitution to be unacceptable for an unemployed person to take*, but basket weaving to be acceptable?
* again, assuming that prostitution is a legal, recognised profession.
What makes you think I consider it acceptable to force unemployed people into work on pain of losing their benefits? I don't. It's nothing less than slavery.
And even if I did, the right to refuse sexual intercourse completely overrides the requirement to enter work when possible.
Also, earlier points about how it is illegal and unethical to require sexual favours in exchange for "not being fired" even though it's not illegal to just fire someone outright.
Last edited by Omegonthesane on Sun Nov 23, 2014 9:06 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Kaelik wrote:Because powerful men get away with terrible shit, and even the public domain ones get ignored, and then, when the floodgates open, it turns out there was a goddam flood behind it.
name_here wrote:It's worth pointing out that in many places it's legal to fire people but it's not legal to threaten to fire them unless they have sex with you. I assume that there's an exception for prostitutes in Germany, but of course unemployed people have not yet volunteered to be prostitutes. Being a legal job doesn't make it the same as any other legal job.
Sex is not part of the average person's job responsibilities. It's also illegal to threaten to fire people unless they paint your house. Does this mean that you can refuse being a painter because you don't feel like it, but still keep the unemployment benefits?
Omegonthesane wrote:What makes you think I consider it acceptable to force unemployed people into work on pain of losing their benefits? I don't. It's nothing less than slavery.
Wait, are you saying that a person shouldn't lose unemployment benefits no matter what kind of paid work they refuse? Prostitution, painting, basket weaving - doesn't matter?
Last edited by Longes on Sun Nov 23, 2014 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Longes wrote:Wait, are you saying that a person shouldn't lose unemployment benefits no matter what kind of paid work they refuse? Prostitution, painting, basket weaving - doesn't matter?
Longes wrote:Wait, are you saying that a person shouldn't lose unemployment benefits no matter what kind of paid work they refuse? Prostitution, painting, basket weaving - doesn't matter?
Is there a reason you think they should lose their benefits? Just to be clear, you're talking about a person losing the resources they need to live for choosing not to do some type of job (be it painting, prostitution, etc). Is there a case you want to make for doing that?
Last edited by MGuy on Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The first rule of Fatclub. Don't Talk about Fatclub..
If you want a game modded right you have to mod it yourself.
Ok, I'm not arguing with that. I was objecting to the idea "Reject prostitution - keep the benefits", "Reject basket weaving - lose the benefits". I have nothing against "keep the benefits" on both of those statements.
Sex actually is qualitatively different from nondescript labor like basket weaving, in a way that is recognized in many laws. Not just because it's risky in a way that most manual labor isn't, but because it's fraught with cultural baggage. You will find a *lot* more people who will have some sort of nervous breakdown if they have to have frequent sex with strangers than you will people who will have that response if they have to frequently weave baskets for strangers. The only comparable thing I can think of is slaughtering cattle; which is also not-very-skilled labor that exposes you to disease and will make a lot of people very unhappy to perform.
Even as a Prostitute you are still allowed to say no to sex, as you being forced to do it would make it illegal prostitution again.
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:
TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
Oh wow, tens of millions of USD in military assistance. That is... not very much money. Wikipedia says Ukraine's military budget is 26.9 billion UAH, which according to google's currency conversion comes out to about 8.5 billion USD.
DSMatticus wrote:It's not just that everything you say is stupid, but that they are Gordian knots of stupid that leave me completely bewildered as to where to even begin. After hearing you speak Alexander the Great would stab you and triumphantly declare the puzzle solved.
Yeah, that's just them chucking some loose change here and there to people they'd like to see win without really caring too much. Pennies in their "Fuck Russia" bucket.
Count Arioch the 28th wrote:There is NOTHING better than lesbians. Lesbians make everything better.
By my reading of the article, all that stuff was already illegal when sold in physical stores, it's just now also illegal online.
The Audiovisual Media Services Regulations 2014 requires that video-on-demand (VoD) online porn now adhere to the same guidelines laid out for DVD sex shop-type porn by the British Board of Film Censors (BBFC).
Frankly, the fact that a "British Board of Film Censors" even exists offends me on a deep and personal level.
EDIT: Also, the "for the children!" explanation is bullshit. Kids young enough to maybe need "protecting" from porn don't have the ability to go out and buy stuff on the Internet because they don't have credit cards.
Last edited by RadiantPhoenix on Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
There are online stores other than amazon that require a credit card?
Last edited by ishy on Thu Dec 04, 2014 10:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Gary Gygax wrote:The player’s path to role-playing mastery begins with a thorough understanding of the rules of the game
Bigode wrote:I wouldn't normally make that blanket of a suggestion, but you seem to deserve it: scroll through the entire forum, read anything that looks interesting in term of design experience, then come back.
Oh wait, I suppose some allow for Paypal, and one or two use Bitcoins. But you'll find that any purveyor of specialist gentleman's cinematography requires a credit card, as it's close enough to proof that you're an adult.
Count Arioch the 28th wrote:There is NOTHING better than lesbians. Lesbians make everything better.
Yeah, I don't think kids these days are overflowing with Paypal money or bitcoins either. I mean, that's the kind of thing where it's possible to make money using nothing but the internet, like maybe you write a thing for a guy and get paid via Paypal or something, but that's seriously unlikely to happen.
Paypal money?
You make it sound like some exclusive club.
It takes like 2 minutes to set up a paypal account and transfer some money from your bank account.
I did own a credit card in the past, but since I never used it for anything except amazon (and amazon uk did away with free shipping), I didn't really see the point in owning one.
If I want to buy something online, I can just wire some money from my bank, which unlike using a credit card or paypal doesn't have any transaction fees.
Last edited by ishy on Thu Dec 04, 2014 12:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Gary Gygax wrote:The player’s path to role-playing mastery begins with a thorough understanding of the rules of the game
Bigode wrote:I wouldn't normally make that blanket of a suggestion, but you seem to deserve it: scroll through the entire forum, read anything that looks interesting in term of design experience, then come back.
