The Gaming Den

Oh, the random numbers of attacks, yes. I can't remember quite what the record was, but a friend and I tried to see what the maximum number of attacks was at level 1. It was impressive. Let's see...

2 for existing
+2 for HtH: anything except Assassin
+2 for being a Hyperion Juicer
+1 for the "Ambidextrous" ability.
+2? for fighting in Power Armour with the Power Armour Combat skill.

9 attacks. I thought we had more. Oh well. That's still a high number for first level. So that's 9 with a firearm, or you could dual-wield melee weapons for 18 attacks at no penalty.

Cyberknight armour is indeed weird. If you don't wear MDC armour over it, then either half the attacks do no damage at all to you (SD attacks because you look human) or half the attacks kill you outright (MD attacks because they know you have hidden MDC armour).

They recently added a weird-yet-good change for Psi-Stalkers. They're SDC creatures, but they "momentarily turn into MDC creatures" when hit by MD attacks, meaning they take it as SD. So in other words, all weapons can hurt them, but MD ones don't annihilate them outright.

Koumei at [unixtime wrote:1190034008[/unixtime]]

They recently added a weird-yet-good change for Psi-Stalkers. They're SDC creatures, but they "momentarily turn into MDC creatures" when hit by MD attacks, meaning they take it as SD. So in other words, all weapons can hurt them, but MD ones don't annihilate them outright.

Lol, now that's a crazy nonsensical mechanic. In many cases you're better off with a high SDC weapon rather than a low MDC weapon. So an assault rifle or shotgun might be better than a bazooka.

Really, I'm not even sure how people actually played rifts. The crazy rules set actually makes 2nd edition AD&D look good. I'm not even sure why Rifts has levels, it seems like all your power ends up coming from your equipment anyway.

Your power comes from your equipment and from your RCC/PCC/OCC at first level. Most classes don't give you anything useful over the later levels.

For instance, as a Dragon, you don't care about the extra MDC, spells and psionics gained later on. What matters is that you start off being a tank that can regenerate, and you can bite people in half with no effort.

Oh, there was one god thing! Polymorph effects weren't broken. If you change shape, you have all of your own stats, all that changes is your appearance (possibly movement forms as well). If a dragon turns into a puppy, that puppy can breathe fire and bite people in half. If a weak-ass wizard turns into a rhinoceros, then you have the world's weakest rhino, albeit one that can cast spells.

Anyone know of a good Rifts d20 conversion?

Hey I Can Chan wrote:But, yeah, later books kinda hosed that by making up new skills, which is bullshit. If you're a rogue scholar whose background is knowing all kinds of funky lore, the game damn well better provide a list of all those lores off the top, 'cause, in Palladium, if you don't have the skill, you can't even roll. And a rogue scholar without skills is just a fat-filled snack for a dragon.

y'know, I doubt this is an actual rule, but my dm said that one could buy training in a skill for something like 1500 credits, so that could fix the thing about Rogue Scholars not getting the new ones, or if you don't want them to have to deplete their funds to stay ahead, why not allow them to roll whatever the equivalent of Gather Info would be(been a while) to pick up maybe a 15%?

also, why not say that untrained skills have maybe a 5% rating automatically, so that you can still roll and maybe even have some system of degree of success so that someone can still do something?

sigma wrote:Anyone know of a good Rifts d20 conversion?

yeah, I've got it on CD, want me to email it to ya? I suppose I could also just post the email of the converter, lemme see if I can find it...

found it: hida_jiremi@yahoo.com email him and ask if he's got anything left.

Cyber Knight nuthin.

Now, Cosmo-knights, there's something to put next to a Vagabond. Along with a Promethean Time Master.

Ah, Rifts.

Voss at [unixtime wrote:1190014728[/unixtime]]It isn't worth trying to get a consensus opinion of what people want in Rifts, because you'll get a different answer from almost everybody.

I'd almost believe that, if I actually got someone saying what they liked about it, rather than post-after-post of complaining about the current rules. People say that everyone likes Rifts for different reasons, but it's hard to accept this when I NEVER see anyone actually say good things about it (in a non-retarded manner, as the Palladium board is rife with such).

I seriously do like the setting. I like some of the races in it (dog boys and psi-stalkers, Turner and Hooch (or any other '80s-'90s "Cop and dog" movie) for the win!), I like some of the classes (Tattooed Men, Juicers, Temporal Wizards...), I like North America and Atlantis and don't really have a problem with any of the other places. Yes, even though all the other places are "Take myths/legends/stereotypes and pump them to the max." England has knights and shit, and I don't mind. Japan is filled with ninjas and cyborgs and cyborg ninjas (I'm not even joking), and I don't mind.

Heck, somehow, Juicers and Crazies seem to exist in parts of the world that are 100% cut off from each other. And I don't really mind.

A lot of the things I think are cool. It's only the system and perhaps the "New stuff! New stuff! Let's get crazier!" that make me cry.

virgileso at [unixtime wrote:1190091429[/unixtime]]I'd almost believe that, if I actually got someone saying what they liked about it, rather than post-after-post of complaining about the current rules. People say that everyone likes Rifts for different reasons, but it's hard to accept this when I NEVER see anyone actually say good things about it (in a non-retarded manner, as the Palladium board is rife with such).

In some ways, the setting as presented in the main Rifts book works well as a post-apocalyptic setting. Aliens, magic, and precursor technology are all seen as dangerous by the dominant fascist city-states, but it also makes those elements more attractive to people wanting to play rebellious, heroic, or just plain self-sufficient characters.

And as much as the Coalition plagiarizes the Star Wars Empire from the original movies, Siembieda still managed to translate it pretty well into a source of ubiquitous bad guys, as well as a constant reminder of how civilization can go bad in hard times, encouraging PCs to look for a brighter future.

Thanks Prak, I mailed him.

Well, my bad on that (honestly didn't notice it); and thanks Rob.

sigma999 at [unixtime wrote:1190099110[/unixtime]]Thanks Prak, I mailed him.

no problem.

as to what I like about the settling, I like the idea that one can play anything they want, the philosophy I'm used to playing under is that if it has ever existed in print, on screen, or even just in your twisted little head, it's some where in the megaverse. I have seriously played an Endbringer from the Hecatomb card game, an advanced form of a character from beast wars, and an anthropomorphic goat named baphomet.

The enjoyable thing about Rifts is that some of the ideas are really good. Consider the crazies. Now, these guys have super human abilities because someone has unleashed the ultimate power of their subconscious minds, seemingly by screwing pop cans into their craniums. Their Tony Robins powers are great, but comes at a price in that they eventually go insane. Also, they are ninjas or something.

Rifts was the setting with everything in it. Seriously, you can get into a bar fight with a gang of gunslingers at the saloon, buy incredibly awesome weapons from blue skinned aliens on store credit, fight a guerrilla war against Neo Nazis, and be enslaved and forced to fight in an Atlantean coliseum, all in the same day. When you have that much stuff going on, something cool is bound to emerge.

shau at [unixtime wrote:1190159983[/unixtime]]Seriously, you can get into a bar fight with a gang of gunslingers at the saloon, buy incredibly awesome weapons from blue skinned aliens on store credit, fight a guerrilla war against Neo Nazis, and be enslaved and forced to fight in an Atlantean coliseum, all in the same day.

This sounds suspiciously like what I enjoyed about the Star Wars setting.

Yeah but on the plus side, Rifts doesn't have Jedi fans whining that they are entitled to lightsabers as part of their class package (when no one else does)
There's so much crazy shit going around, it doesn't matter if you had 10 arms with a lightsaber in each.

I wish it didn't take hours to make a character though. That, and the ability score crap, are the biggest gripes I have about Rifts mechanics.

Or you just develop A.D.D.
Who needs a plot? Just throw a bunch of random crap at the party. They might think something is good.

To be slight on topic: I found the link to the new Megaverse Podcast, right now it is up to episode 3

http://www.talkshoe.com/talkshoe/web/ta ... 867&cmd=tc

Voss at [unixtime wrote:1190168489[/unixtime]]Or you just develop A.D.D.
Who needs a plot? Just throw a bunch of random crap at the party. They might think something is good.

I thought that was the reason they made cyberpunk 2020?

Never played Cyberpunk, though I have played Cybergen, which had a cool comment near the front of the book: This game is designed with less emphasis on worrying about different bullet types interacting with different gun types, and more emphasis on playing the game and having fun.

Only played a few sessions, but it was fun.

And yeah, if you use the Rifts setting, you could totally do a better job with a lot of other systems. Heck, for some of them, you could just use their setting and import a couple of Rifts elements and maybe change the world specifics a little bit and still call it Rifts.

CP2020 had crap rules. Firing a gun on fully automatic could take 10 minutes to resolve.

And the combat class -> solos, where just SO MUCH better at combat that the other guys may as well not even try.

virgileso wrote:What makes Rifts the Rifts that people actually enjoy?

It has powered armor commandos fighting interdimensional invaders.

I went to two different stores today to pick up SR4. No luck.

sigma999 at [unixtime wrote:1190078783[/unixtime]]Anyone know of a good Rifts d20 conversion?

At Gencon '05 my buddy Galahad Knight yelled that outside the palladium booth.

I thought we were going to get our asses kicked right then and there.

sigma999 at [unixtime wrote:1190162333[/unixtime]]I wish it didn't take hours to make a character though. That, and the ability score crap, are the biggest gripes I have about Rifts mechanics.

That can actually be a problem in any game system... When I was in Portland, I lived in an apartment with a great group, we all played and I brought in a few other people and we had great games going like 3 nights a week. But it took hours for these people to make characters, no matter what game we were playing. And my group here in CA is the same way, when we actually get together, no one's got a character, and it takes hours to make them. This is why I've enstated a rule saying that characters are made on the player's time, not during potential game time. I actually started typing up rules for my games, and I need to get back to that.