Skill consolidation
Moderator: Moderators
Tell them they're full of crap. Thieves were hiding behind nothing and running up 100' cliffs in one round before most of them were born. In 2nd edition you were even allowed to be 99% perfect at that by 2nd or 3rd level.Lago PARANOIA wrote: A not-inconsiderable proportion of the playerbase do not want skills to do anything fantastical at any point.
Mmm. Skills have to hit 100% not long after the Wizard can do that anyway. With tightly controlled bonuses (unlike 3e) you can just keep stacking effects on where that stays true at higher DCs.A not-considerable proportion of the playerbase want skills to be relevant at all ranges of play.
You've got to have saves and fixed defences possible if you're going to win the game with them though, so Diplomacy can totally be Charm Person and then later Dominate Monster, as long as there's a save and total HD limit and other things like there is (or should be) for the spells.
If you then build your spells so they give you automatic skill results, like Spider Climb becomes "you get a minimum of 25 on any climb check", it makes people think the spells are giving you awesome skill, rather than the skills giving you magic powers. Makes for repeated info in the spells, but whatever, D&D books are huge.
Yeh. They want a mythological example that isn't a Wizard for everything that a non-Wizard might do. Tagging things as (Su) can fix up some of those guys. "Yes, it is a kind of magic, well spotted".Even if you accept caveat #2 and not caveat #1, a lot of people won't go along with the kludging. People will insist that even though they can accept Beowulf swimming to the bottom of a sea past a submarine that was crushed by the pressure, they don't necessarily want him having this same level of hardcoreness towards--say--gymnastics or even climbing.
Bullshit material components can work for them too, "your songs can put low HD creatures to sleep, if read from a religious tome worth 5gp and weighing 1 lb". Forcing the special effects into expensive magic items is traditional, so you have a tome of sleepy that's used with Perform skill, but that then gets into trade values and so on. Yick.
P.S. Learning spells is too cheap, and Wizard should be 5 different classes.
Give them a meaningless failure to have if they roll a 1, a sidebar saying that DMs should ignore rolling whenever it's inappropriate, and an example list hinting that it's always inappropriate. So lying to the fanbase to keep them happy. Like 4e's skill challenges, only lacking the math failure.A lot of people have this mentality that because it's rolled it has to have a chance of failing.
True. The spells aren't great for basing DCs on for various reasons, including that the spells aren't all the right level. Nice starting point though.Skills scale at different rates of effect. ... This is not an unsolvable problem, just really really hard to balance.