Stahlseele wrote:But of course.
Have you read the Grenade Stacking Rules yet?
Combine those with MRSI and Akimbo Firing Full Auto Grenade Launchers.
Yes, you can get close to a nukes size of boom that way, why do you ask?
I'm AFB at the moment, but the only thing I remember of the grenade rules are the chunky salsa effect. What is this?
Sorry if I come off as criminally retarded.
If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.
Stahlseele wrote:Haesslich was an Adult Western Dragon at best, nowhere near Great Status.
Also the Chief of Security of United Oil. He got killed by the Minigun i think.
After he had killed a feathered Serpent called Tessien.
I stand slightly corrected.
For a minute, I used to be "a guy" in the TTRPG "industry". Now I'm just a nobody. For the most part, it's a relief.
Trank Frollman wrote:One of the reasons we can say insightful things about stuff is that we don't have to pretend to be nice to people. By embracing active aggression, we eliminate much of the passive aggression that so paralyzes things on other gaming forums.
hogarth wrote:As the good book saith, let he who is without boners cast the first stone.
TiaC wrote:I'm not quite sure why this is an argument. (Except that Kaelik is in it, that's a good reason.)
Stahlseele wrote:But of course.
Have you read the Grenade Stacking Rules yet?
Combine those with MRSI and Akimbo Firing Full Auto Grenade Launchers.
Yes, you can get close to a nukes size of boom that way, why do you ask?
I'm AFB at the moment, but the only thing I remember of the grenade rules are the chunky salsa effect. What is this?
Sorry if I come off as criminally retarded.
War! has a mathematically challenged system for adding multiple grenades together. A small bag and a wireless transmitter can easily beat a thor shot. When you have overlapping grenade blasts you do a single damage line of the full damage of one plus half of all the rest. So If you radio-detonate an Armatech MGL-12, it does 78P to everything nearby. That is not a joke or an exaggeration. That is seriously how much damage the book says you inflict.
This guy claims 4 shots in 9 seconds. That's 1/2.25 seconds. Arrows fly at roughly 200f/s, so you'd get about a 450 ft(150 yard) separation. Therefor, two arrows during the first arrow's flight time means you need to be shooting at least 300 yards away.
And most runners aren't operating at normal human speeds, so that should close in noticeably for shadowrun.
But that's all the same arc. To get a MRSI effect you'd need two arcs, one quite distinctly higher, and therefore taking longer to hit the target. I'd guess the flight time of the high arc for an archer would be longer than your average combat round for the usual combat distance.
And that's the reason MRSI for archery is stupid - it only works if you're using archery as artillery, and then it can't really hit moving targets. And a stationary target you can always simply blow up with explosives using a variety of delivery systems.
But simply firing two arrows close together doesn't to shit if they are on the same arc - or any full semi-automatic sniper rifle could do the same.
Last edited by Fuchs on Thu May 26, 2011 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
<sarcasm>
But they heard about it from someone who told them about a comic book they read and it sounded way cool!
</sarcasm>
But more seriously, that's pretty much how they did the rest of the combat system. If you know even a tiny bit about how guns work you realize the almost all the mechanics are stupid and based on what someone thinks they saw once in a bad movie or something equally dumb. Shotguns are stupid. Automatic weapons are stupid. Explosives are stupid. Barrier rules (I shoot a hole I can walk though with 6 rounds from with my pistol) are stupid. Pistols=rifles is stupid. APDS from pistols is stupid. Velocity=RoF is stupid. It's all stupid, this is just another layer of stupid pasted on top.
Last edited by kzt on Thu May 26, 2011 8:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
FrankTrollman wrote:War! has a mathematically challenged system for adding multiple grenades together. A small bag and a wireless transmitter can easily beat a thor shot. When you have overlapping grenade blasts you do a single damage line of the full damage of one plus half of all the rest. So If you radio-detonate an Armatech MGL-12, it does 78P to everything nearby. That is not a joke or an exaggeration. That is seriously how much damage the book says you inflict.
-Username17
I suspect I need to disable my brain's bullshit filter so I don't automatically gloss this crap over as "impossible!"
If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.
Looks like it's time for chapter and verse, Frank.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.
--The horror of Mario
Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
"Overlapping Grenade Blasts:
Occasionally, a gamemaster will have more than one grenade
or other explosive simultaneously affecting a single target. In these
cases, treat the damage as a single blast with a Damage Values equal
to the sum of the highest Damage Value of one explosion plus half
the DV of the other explosions. Each explosion’s DV should be
modifed for the distance of each explosion, as if the target was
affected by the Blast in a Confined Space rules (p. 156, SR4A).
The combination of overlapping blasts and confined quarters is
known as the “puréed salsa effect.”"
-War, p. 140.
My favorite part is how the author recognizes that the salsa is far beyond chunky, it is blended and puréed at this point.
Last edited by attackdrone on Fri May 27, 2011 11:05 am, edited 2 times in total.
I just a had a situation in game the other night where I specifically made sure not to use these rules. Guess what? Everything was fine.
Well, not for the bad guys...
Custom fast attack LAV lands in the open garage door of the PCs hideout. The craft is designed to allow the entire front to open so that the first three milspec armored adapts inside can quickly deploy and make use of the surprise round offered by the fast entry while the three behind them can offer cover from ballistic barriers built into the craft.
One of the PCs is literally strolling around the garage drinking his coffee when the craft lands and door pops. He's an unmodified human with nothing on him but his trusty FN 5-7c. But he's an edge character with Adrenaline Surge and gets a lucky roll on the surprise test.
I ask him what he wants to do as he watches the doors pop open and the soldiers prep to deploy. He asks for cover; check the map, nope. He asks if they are packing grenades...
In the end I gave the other grenades a 4/4 to see if they got cooked off. Being dual charge High Explosive/White Phosphorus grenades there wasn't much chance they weren't going to. The fire on the deck of the craft raged for three rounds, killing everyone inside.
I rolled damage separately for each grenade until I got to the point where the soldiers were dead. That was about three in. The rest bounced around and burned more, but there's no reason they should equal a nuke. Fuck, I had 18 of the damn things in there. That would have been 114P for the high explosive alone. Plus I don't recall if the blast radius is supposed to be expanded as well, but that would have taken out a sizable section of the Galway docks. For a fraction of the price of "real" weapons of mass destruction!
In the end I gave the other grenades a 4/4 to see if they got cooked off. Being dual charge High Explosive/White Phosphorus grenades there wasn't much chance they weren't going to. The fire on the deck of the craft raged for three rounds, killing everyone inside.
bwahahahaahahha mad props, i hope he gets street cred for that ^^
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:
TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
Silent Wayfarer wrote:Oh lord, I can imagine his trollface after pulling that off.
Also, are there stats for the vector thrust MBTs Frank has been comparing Dragons to?
At one point stats were kept sparse because if you needed to know it was too late for you. Thanks to War! you have stats, you just can't apply them in any meaningful way.
Could we please have a new version of Riggers Black Book. Rigging and vehicles don't get enough air time... so far, and even none riggers love to trick out their vehicles. Love to see some more vehicles, vehicle art etc.
Thanks
Bryce
Answer:
We actually have a Black Book in the works. It will combine some already published PDFs--This Old Drone and MilSpecTech--along with Unfriendly Skies, which will have aircraft, Deadly Waves, which will have watercraft, and Gun Haven, which will have, well, guns. Some new material will be acquired in the book as well. So it's not quite the same as previous Black Books, but it will be gear and tech-riffic.
Jason H.
Conclusion:
More warmed up stuff with little original content and charging people twice for stuff that's in the pdf's and in dead tree format . .
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:
TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
Stahlseele wrote:More warmed up stuff with little original content and charging people twice for stuff that's in the pdf's and in dead tree format...
I don't care if the material is original or not. It's the mandate with each new edition of an RPG to re-hash old material and tweak the stats to fit the new engine. That's how it goes. I simply don't want them to be shitty, which would be an easy thing to accommodate, and Hardy's crew can't even accomplish that. War! and Attitude were beyond the pale - shit editing, shit development, ignorant writing, and whole lot of ickiness. I can forgive a lot but CGL passed my sympathy level a long time ago. Until another company has the license I'm not purchasing another SR product. There are better games out there that are worth my time.
Question... how are people being charged twice? Because a new edition is incorporating PDF only release material? If you've already got a copy of Arsenal, which is due for a reprint anyway, you don't have to buy a new one. If you want the new material, just buy the PDFs and save your money.
I agree that printing material that was previously released in a separate PDF product isn't necessarily wrong. Not everyone goes in for the PDFs, and if the material makes sense next to each other and is presented in a compelling way there is value there.
I'm with Wesley on not purchasing another Shadowrun product while CGL is publishing, even though it still breaks my heart. It would be a step in the right direction if they manage the clean up the vehicle stats and inconsistencies then pair the release of Gearstrocity with downloads of the originals with errata added.
fectin wrote:Didn't he preface his last review by saying GAF was available in liquid form over there? (cider)
Unfortunately, I am in Africa, and Give-A-Fuck seems in short supply here.
The gutters are uncovered and people piss directly into them. GAF appears to have been leeched by years of colonialism to the point where you can't even see it in museums.
Why are you poor specimen in Africa of all places? O.o
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:
TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
Ah, right, Dr.Trollman and all that, yeah, i actually forgot . . .
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:
TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
