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Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 3:58 pm
by virgil
ishy wrote:It really highlights how terrible PrC requirements actually are.
Hopefully (naive I know) it'll lead to better PrC write-ups in the future.
Not from Paizo. They only kept them out of appeasement to the backwards-compatible claims, and would excise the mechanic if they had the gumption.
Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:52 pm
by Avoraciopoctules
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:14 am
by Voss
Weird choice. 'Hey, guys, remember how we pushed and pushed this kickstarter to get this D&D clone game off the ground? We're really glad you supported this and all so.... yeah. Also, here's this other D&D clone game that people just gave us money for.'
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:53 am
by Koumei
Honestly, I'd be okay with a PF video game if it cut a lot of bullshit options out so that making a decent character, with customisation, was a simple-enough affair, and if it played out kind of like NWN2 where different traits and things change the dialogue. And if it looked pretty enough.
So if Paizo stressed the importance of looking pretty (which is how their TT game became so big) while having basically nothing to do with the actual making of the game (being banned from ringside for all plot and mechanics discussions), basically.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:21 am
by Archmage Joda
So, on the topic of the magus, how does the staff magus archetype measure up? Does it just suck horribly, or is it potentially worth taking?
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:46 am
by Lago PARANOIA
So, remember a couple of months back in the old thread, where I mocked Pathfinder releasing the Advance Class Guide literally less than a week when the 5E D&D PHB would come out?
Well, here's the updated product listing:
http://paizo.com/products/btpy978v/disc ... Guide#tabs
I gotta hand it to Paizo:
They're not fucking around. This is a much, much heftier book than what I was expecting. Hell, this has significantly more content than both the 3E and 4E D&D Player Handbooks. Now
this is what I would call a counterattack.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:52 am
by Voss
Lago PARANOIA wrote:So, remember a couple of months back in the old thread, where I mocked Pathfinder releasing the Advance Class Guide literally less than a week when the 5E D&D PHB would come out?
Well, here's the updated product listing:
http://paizo.com/products/btpy978v/disc ... Guide#tabs
I gotta hand it to Paizo:
They're not fucking around. This is a much, much heftier book than what I was expecting. Hell, this has significantly more content than both the 3E and 4E D&D Player Handbooks. Now
this is what I would call a counterattack.
Sidenote to this particular carnival: Due to whatever disaster WotC has decided to brew up with their partnership with an untested studio doing digital tools, they're aren't doing electronic versions of the 5e books. At least not anytime soon. Sure there are the limited basic rules, but there are so many (intentional) gaps in there that it isn't even in the same theoretical space.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:52 am
by TiaC
Archmage Joda wrote:So, on the topic of the magus, how does the staff magus archetype measure up? Does it just suck horribly, or is it potentially worth taking?
It looks functional. Better at high levels I'd say.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:53 am
by Lago PARANOIA
Belatedly: I meant the 3E and 4E D&D Player Handbook twos.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:36 am
by Prak
So, on the strength of the iconic Brawler illustration*, I looked for a leaked pdf of the new Advanced Class Handbook. It's easy enough to find a playtest pdf, and I'm not sure how fbmf feels about links to pirated material, so I won't link directly to it.
*
Admittedly, it's a a playtest version, but I'm curious what people think of it. It doesn't look too terrible, but it's kind of just a better monk with less than optimal wording.
Basically, they get the Tome fighter's Problem Solver ability, but only usable (half class level) times per day, for 1 minute, and it takes a move action. On the other hand, as they level up, they can actually get more than one feat at a time with the ability and the action to gain a single feat drops. This is probably the best ability they have, even if any uses per day feat you gain with it has the feat's uses per day counted from one total regardless of how many times it's emulated in a day. They also have an ability where their class level counts as monk and fighter levels for the purposes of gaining feats.
They also gain a monk's unarmed strike, and a weird brawler flurry thing where they benefit from Two Weapon Fighting while fighting unarmed, or with a monk or close fighting weapon. This improves as they level up, but at the weird rate of at 8th and fifteenth level.
Oh, right. They get bonus feats at 2nd level and every three after, and at fifth level they can retrain previous bonus feats when they gain a bonus feat. Kind of cool. Unless the retraining costs you your new bonus feat (like I said, poorly worded) then it's stupid.
They get a +1 to CMB and CMD when using/defending against one specific chosen combat maneuver at third, and at 7th, 11th, 15th and 19th, they get to select another combat maneuver to get +1 to, and all the previous ones' bonuses go up by a point. Then at 4th they just get a +1 bonus to AC and CMD which increases by 1 at 9th, 13th and 18th level.
They get something like Ki Strike at 5th, where their unarmed is counted as magic, then silver and cold iron at 9th, then 1 alignment component at 12th, then adamantine at 17th. This... could really be fucking earlier. Unarmed-focused class unarmed attacks should just start magical. And then materials should be at once and obtained at around 4th level. And you should just fucking get an alignment component at like 7th level, and then another every 2 or 3 levels until they can just count as whatever alignment they want for DR.
At 13th, they can make a knockout attack once a day, typical fort DC scheme, but they can choose Str or Dex for it. Lasts 1d6 rounds, and usable 3/day at 16th. Crit/Nonlethal immunity makes you immune to this attack.
At 16th they get an ability to make a special knockback (10ft) combat maneuver against creatures their size or smaller, which deals 1d6 damage to victim and what they hit if any obstacle prevents it. At 20th this improves to affect creatures of any size, with a -5/size cat above the brawler. They can roll a second combat maneuver roll if the first succeeds to make the thing do double damage.
*sigh* when the fuck am I going to get a martial artist class that lets me punch people through fucking walls at high levels?
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:54 am
by Axebird
Yeah. Brawler looks like it's slightly more competent than monk... but still not nearly good enough. The feats are cool, but the limited uses per day are harsh compared to the duration, and the feats you can get are... underwhelming.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:56 am
by Prak
Yeah, I figured that would be the case on feats. I mean, it's a nice way to make use of the stupidly circumstantial feats PF has, but that's about it.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:31 am
by Archmage Joda
I'm a bit unclear, Prak, did you actually find a leaked pdf of the final book, or just give up and settle for the playtest document?
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:39 am
by Prak
playtest only. So things may change (though I doubt it). Apparently it was an open playtest, so, link:
http://gforcecomp.com/wp-content/uploads/r-acg.pdf
Edit: so I just noticed that classes in the ACG were all designed to mix two base classes. Which is a neat idea. On the other hand, you're not allowed to multiclass with either of the classes that were voltroned together to make the advanced class
or any other advanced class that shares either component.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:47 am
by Axebird
They retracted the multiclassing restrictions in the final.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:54 am
by Prak
Oh, well that's good.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:22 am
by OgreBattle
So is this worth flipping through for inspiration/ideas or is it mostly a testament to failure
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:43 am
by Axebird
Half and half. They've got some cool ideas (Bloodrager is neat), and some real bad ones (Swashbucklers are just more crappy glass cannon martials, a feat that straight up gives Cha to all saves).
In other news...
this is a joke, right? Please tell me this is a hoax.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:37 am
by hogarth
Lago PARANOIA wrote:I gotta hand it to Paizo: They're not fucking around. This is a much, much heftier book than what I was expecting.
This is exactly the same size as the other hardcover rules splatbooks they have been churning out every six months (Ultimate Magic, Ultimate Combat, Mythic Adventures, Ultimate Campaign, Master Race Handbook, etc.). I'm not sure why you expected something smaller.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:09 pm
by Voss
hogarth wrote:Lago PARANOIA wrote:I gotta hand it to Paizo: They're not fucking around. This is a much, much heftier book than what I was expecting.
This is exactly the same size as the other hardcover rules splatbooks they have been churning out every six months (Ultimate Magic, Ultimate Combat, Mythic Adventures, Ultimate Campaign, Master Race Handbook, etc.). I'm not sure why you expected something smaller.
Probably because the playtest version gave no indication of all that other stuff, particularly yet more archetypes for the old classes. As written it just looked like an info dump of poorly thought out gestalts
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:36 pm
by Avoraciopoctules
OBSIDIAN ANNOUNCES PATHFINDER LICENSE
Obsidian to partner with Paizo Inc. to release electronic Pathfinder games
INDIANAPOLIS -- August 13, 2014 -- Obsidian Entertainment, the developer of Fallout: New Vegas, South Park: the Stick of Truth and the Kickstarter phenomenon Pillars of Eternity, announced that they have entered into a long-term licensing partnership with Paizo Inc. to produce electronic games based on its popular Pathfinder Roleplaying Game intellectual property
Obsidian's first licensed product will be a tablet game based on the highly successful Pathfinder Adventure Card game, a cooperative game for 1 to 4 players. Players each have a unique character composed of a deck of cards and a set of stats. Characters have classes such as fighter, rogue, wizard and cleric, as well as numbers that define attributes such as strength, wisdom and charisma etc. Players will be able to customize their deck to better suit each individual’s vision of their character.
"At Obsidian we have a long history of working with the greatest RPG franchises, and we're thrilled to get to play in the Pathfinder universe now," said CEO Feargus Urquhart. "We're huge fans and can't wait to bring what we do in the electronic gaming world to Pathfinder fans everywhere".
In the world of Pathfinder, players take on the role of brave adventurers fighting to survive in a world beset by magic and evil. The Pathfinder RPG is currently translated into multiple languages, with hundreds of thousands of players worldwide. The Pathfinder brand has also been licensed for comic book series, graphic novels, miniatures, plush toys, apparel, and is being developed into a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game.
"Obsidian is a video game developer at the top of its game", said Paizo CEO Lisa Stevens. "Being able to bring that type of experience and passion to Pathfinder can only mean great things, both for our loyal Pathfinder community and for all fans of great CRPG's."
Obsidian will be at Gen Con 2014 showing off an early prototype of the digital Pathfinder Adventure Card Game in the Paizo booth (#203) and in their own booth (#2151) featuring the first consumer hands on for Pillars of Eternity.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:11 pm
by Longes
Avoraciopoctules wrote:OBSIDIAN ANNOUNCES PATHFINDER LICENSE
Obsidian to partner with Paizo Inc. to release electronic Pathfinder games
INDIANAPOLIS -- August 13, 2014 -- Obsidian Entertainment, the developer of Fallout: New Vegas, South Park: the Stick of Truth and the Kickstarter phenomenon Pillars of Eternity, announced that they have entered into a long-term licensing partnership with Paizo Inc. to produce electronic games based on its popular Pathfinder Roleplaying Game intellectual property
Obsidian's first licensed product will be a tablet game based on the highly successful Pathfinder Adventure Card game, a cooperative game for 1 to 4 players. Players each have a unique character composed of a deck of cards and a set of stats. Characters have classes such as fighter, rogue, wizard and cleric, as well as numbers that define attributes such as strength, wisdom and charisma etc. Players will be able to customize their deck to better suit each individual’s vision of their character.
"At Obsidian we have a long history of working with the greatest RPG franchises, and we're thrilled to get to play in the Pathfinder universe now," said CEO Feargus Urquhart. "We're huge fans and can't wait to bring what we do in the electronic gaming world to Pathfinder fans everywhere".
In the world of Pathfinder, players take on the role of brave adventurers fighting to survive in a world beset by magic and evil. The Pathfinder RPG is currently translated into multiple languages, with hundreds of thousands of players worldwide. The Pathfinder brand has also been licensed for comic book series, graphic novels, miniatures, plush toys, apparel, and is being developed into a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game.
"Obsidian is a video game developer at the top of its game", said Paizo CEO Lisa Stevens. "Being able to bring that type of experience and passion to Pathfinder can only mean great things, both for our loyal Pathfinder community and for all fans of great CRPG's."
Obsidian will be at Gen Con 2014 showing off an early prototype of the digital Pathfinder Adventure Card Game in the Paizo booth (#203) and in their own booth (#2151) featuring the first consumer hands on for Pillars of Eternity.
I liked Neverwinter Nights 2 and add-ons. So, eh, I'm hopeful.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:06 pm
by malak
Avoraciopoctules wrote:OBSIDIAN ANNOUNCES PATHFINDER LICENSE
Obsidian to partner with Paizo Inc. to release electronic Pathfinder games
INDIANAPOLIS -- August 13, 2014 -- Obsidian Entertainment, the developer of Fallout: New Vegas, South Park: the Stick of Truth and the Kickstarter phenomenon Pillars of Eternity, announced that they have entered into a long-term licensing partnership with Paizo Inc. to produce electronic games based on its popular Pathfinder Roleplaying Game intellectual property
Obsidian's first licensed product will be a tablet game based on the highly successful Pathfinder Adventure Card game, a cooperative game for 1 to 4 players. Players each have a unique character composed of a deck of cards and a set of stats. Characters have classes such as fighter, rogue, wizard and cleric, as well as numbers that define attributes such as strength, wisdom and charisma etc. Players will be able to customize their deck to better suit each individual’s vision of their character.
"At Obsidian we have a long history of working with the greatest RPG franchises, and we're thrilled to get to play in the Pathfinder universe now," said CEO Feargus Urquhart. "We're huge fans and can't wait to bring what we do in the electronic gaming world to Pathfinder fans everywhere".
In the world of Pathfinder, players take on the role of brave adventurers fighting to survive in a world beset by magic and evil. The Pathfinder RPG is currently translated into multiple languages, with hundreds of thousands of players worldwide. The Pathfinder brand has also been licensed for comic book series, graphic novels, miniatures, plush toys, apparel, and is being developed into a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game.
"Obsidian is a video game developer at the top of its game", said Paizo CEO Lisa Stevens. "Being able to bring that type of experience and passion to Pathfinder can only mean great things, both for our loyal Pathfinder community and for all fans of great CRPG's."
Obsidian will be at Gen Con 2014 showing off an early prototype of the digital Pathfinder Adventure Card Game in the Paizo booth (#203) and in their own booth (#2151) featuring the first consumer hands on for Pillars of Eternity.
But...Obsidian, so great and yet so flawed, and Pathfinder, so flawed and yet... not great.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:17 pm
by Lago PARANOIA
Damn, that's one spiteful poke in the eye for WotC. And coming off of the 'exploded in the hangar' 5E digital tools it just makes WotC look that much worse, doesn't it?
If Hasbro had even a little bit of competence, Mike Mearls would soon wake up next to a horse's head in his bed.
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:23 pm
by Voss
Oh. A tablet card game. I guess Pillars of Eternity backers (and people looking forward to it) have nothing to worry about after all.
Paizo/Obsidian definitely seem to feel like they can play with the big boys, however. Digital MtG and Blizzard's Heathstone are the competitors here.
This should be funny in a train wreck kind of way.
