Swordslinger wrote:
PC: "I use the attack action on the monster."
DM: "Okay, what weapon do you want to attack with? Your adamantine axe or your +1 silver broadsword?"
PC: "Whatever weapon works best in this situation. I told you what action I was taking. It's the anti-thesis of roleplaying if you ask for more clarification. What, did you actually expect me to think while playing this game? Fuck that dude."
Both player and MC in your example are wrong. The player has to declare all his actions, he has to draw a weapon (unless he has one drawn) and then announce that he's attacking (and not making an unarmed strike with his head or something) or full attacking, then he rolls his to-hit, miss chance if there is one and damage if he hits. Saying "I attack" doesn't work because that isn't how the rules work. Have you played D&D before?
Diplomacy works differently from attacks because it is heavily abstracted and has fucking horrible rules.
Diplomacy only has a few results, you can say you're using diplomacy to do something because diplomacy only works in certain ways. You either change the person's attitude towards you or argue your case (opposed check against whoever's arguing against you). Those are the only ways diplomacy fucking works. Everyone knows what you're talking about when you diplomacy at somebody because it has a strict set of rules, you diplomacy for <result> and announce that as your action. You can not possibly get more clear than that because that's how the rules work.
Fectin, your example is equally retarded (actually moreso). You need to follow the rules of the damn game. Taking an example out of context (maybe it was the fighter's turn and he was adjacent to the only goddamn opponent with his weapon drawn and everyone is level 4?).You can say AC 34 for 60 damage and people will understand that you attacked something, unless you don't trust your players and make them say "power attacking for full again, with the only weapon I'm holding, on the guy I attacked last fucking turn who is the only fucking person I can hit anyways. My initiative order didn't change either. Happy now, asshole? I hit a 34 AC for 60 damage."
The swim check example is just stupid because, surprise surprise, swim checks don't do anything to people. Diplomacy can totally get a guard to be friendly to you, and if you're talking about going through the gate you can make him favor your side of the argument (letting you through) with an opposed check. As the MC you could say "he says 'I understand your business is important and I'd love to let you through, but it's against the rules.' He then offers to get his superior to speak with you," and the diplomacy player would understand that as a possible reaction to his action and try something else (or try to turn him fanatic and pass through anyways, fuck diplomacy).
If you said "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT HOW ARE YOU USING DIPLOMACY FUCK HOW DOES THIS GAME WORK?" Your player would talk to you as if you were a child and explain "He said I couldn't go through, I said I wanted to go through, we're arguing opposed sides, I want him to favor my side, please make an opposed check to see if I gain the upper hand in this argument." Holy shit, the diplomacy rules are vague and terrible but that is how diplomacy works.
Diplomacy rules: You want <NPC> to do something, so you talk to him and roll diplomacy. If you succeed he favors your side, he might not actually do what you want but you have curried favor. Alternatively you just always roll to make them fanatic and they do whatever you say because they love you so much.
Would it really help if the player said "diplomacy to argue that he should let me through, I got a 30." rather than "diplomacy to have him let me through, I got a 30."
None of that had to do with roleplaying at all, though. All I said was "why announce how you diplomacy things when you don't announce how you attack things?" I never say "I swing for the damn kneecaps, using a Hungarian style chop." If you don't give my attack a bonus for being more than "I swing, 34 AC, 60 damage" you shouldn't give diplomacy a bonus for being any more than "I try to get the guard to let us pass, 30 diplomacy."
Edit: Unless you guys are saying the player needs to say "I'm using diplomacy to change <npc>'s attitude." If they're trying to make friends they should specify that. You could, for example, say "I diplomacy the guard to make him change his attitude towards me, I got a 30. I then ask him to let us through." That's still roleplaying, you're just using mechanics instead of making up small talk with the guard. That's a play style that is supported by the rules.
