Why in D&D world doesnt anyone want to become an adventurer?

tussock · Post by **tussock** » Wed May 14, 2014 12:03 pm

If you're the PCs, and you're level 1, you hit challenges that are mostly level 1, or 2, or 5 if you're playing a Paizo module, but still. You win and go up levels before the challenges get harder because you're playing the people who got lucky like that.

If you're a no-name NPC, and you're level 1, you hit a mind flayer and die. Or a CR 10 Dragon and die. Or 400 Orc Warriors with their 12th level Generals in tow, and die. Or there's a hydra and you wore armour, so you die. Or a big rock drops on you and you're dead. Or you fall out of a tree and don't die but are eaten by the wolves who chased you up the tree for some reason, I blame druids. Or the druid just fucking kills you themselves.

Way I see it, lots of people adventure. Most of them don't find balanced encounters.

JigokuBosatsu · Post by **JigokuBosatsu** » Wed May 14, 2014 2:06 pm

hyzmarca wrote: And at level 20, potatoes.

I think you mean "PO-ta-toes".

shadzar · Post by **shadzar** » Sat May 17, 2014 8:50 pm

Avoraciopoctules wrote:
shadzar wrote:The extremely rare and lucky become PCs. Everyone else is just screwed by fate to have to be Villager #656 or Merchant #6848.
... I'm not sure I'd want my life decisions to have been predetermined by some random guy in a gaming store's back room. Really, I'm lucky that I'm not a PC and I'd imagine a lot of characters would feel the same way.

when you stop sucking the barrel of cocks; the NPC was fated by the game world dynamics, not the DM. just like any NPC in video game, MMO, etc. they are programmed mainly be the game world unless they have a special function.

ergo, the People of the Land (to borrow from Log Horizon), are just filler bodies to populate the world, and fated to be so because that is their function and reason to exist.... until such time as they become self-aware and no longer only follow code. then the TTRPG no longer has control of them and they are doing what they want in your shared imagination, and you should seek medical help for it.

darkmaster · Post by **darkmaster** » Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:27 pm

You know, this didn't come up the first time around. But what about rewards in the afterlife, which really is based on how many faces that happen to be under the hat of the other team you have stabbed in your life time. That seems like a pretty good incentive to risk life and limb.

shadzar · Post by **shadzar** » Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:45 pm

This entire thread may be answered this fall. Log Horizon is about like .//hack, SAO, D&D cartoons, and some others.

People get trapped in a game world after an update in its 11th year.

NPCs, called People of the LAnd, and the trapped players, called Adventurers.

Well damned if one of the NPCs wasnt turned into an adventurers, so no longer ceases to exist after dying, but respawns at the special point where all people players respawn.

What implications and ramifications can this have on the world? How did the People of the LAnd view the Adventurers to begin with? Will more of them want to beAdventurers and give up their afterlife for the freedom of being an Adventurer and immortality?

Someone is answering ALL these strange questions in this anime, and even though based on an MMO, similar should apply to TTRPG worlds as well.

If you want to watch the first 25 episodes they are free on Crunchy.

Now I am interested in the anime mostly and what happens and IF the players will be able to return home, but the world itself is interesting for RPG thought experiments such as the one posed in this thread.

silva · Post by **silva** » Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:56 pm

Man, I thought my english was bad.

Cyberzombie · Post by **Cyberzombie** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:01 am

ACOS wrote: I have NPCs level-up all the time - even commoners, shop keepers, farmers, etc. That's not to say that all NPCs level-up; but reoccurring one's definitely should. I've been told by my players that this is one of the big things that help to give the setting a sense of being alive.
They obviously shouldn't be leveling-up anywhere as fast as the PCs, though. But if the party returns to a particular town after a year or so, maybe their favorite tavern owner expanded his operation, and is now a level 7 expert instead of a level 5. That's actually kinda cool.

How do the PCs even know that the tavernkeeper leveled up?

shadzar · Post by **shadzar** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:30 am

There is a failing in recent gamers that play RPGs that insist everyone knows everything and there is no 4th wall. You know how Pcs go around talking about their level in the game in character.

'People tend to forget these are things that dont exist in the game world.

leveling is more like have mid-life crisis about 20 times in your life. you get frustrated you aren't able to do more, go train, then you can do more and feel better until the next one. This would be more how the characters see it. unless it is "trapped in the game" kind of thing.

Cyberzombie · Post by **Cyberzombie** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:40 am

shadzar wrote:There is a failing in recent gamers that play RPGs that insist everyone knows everything and there is no 3th wall. You know how Pcs go around talking about their level in the game in character.

'People tend to forget these are things that dont exist in the game world.

This. So many people seem to not understand that people in a D&D fantasy world aren't working with google and smartphones. They're not even working on a pre-internet public school education. You're talking about people that are basically passing on whatever any guy that looked remotely smart told them.

Now consider that in the modern world, some polls get results of around 50% of US citizens who don't believe in evolution.

The average D&D world is going to be ridiculously misinformed.

Night Goat · Post by **Night Goat** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:49 am

I have a related question: why doesn't everyone with an above-average mental stat become a spellcaster? Even if you're not going to be an adventurer, the benefits should be obvious.

deaddmwalking · Post by **deaddmwalking** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:00 am

Night Goat wrote:I have a related question: why doesn't everyone with an above-average mental stat become a spellcaster? Even if you're not going to be an adventurer, the benefits should be obvious.

High cost of entry.

A spellbook costs 15 gp; inscribing a spell costs 100 gp per page. Even a 0-level spell costs 100 gp.

PCs don't 'pay' the cost, but one presumes that NPCs would.

There are 19 0th level spells; so 1900 GP just to have them inscribed in your spellbook (that PCs get to start with for free).

With a +4 Int, you'd get another 8 1st level spells.

So, 2715 GP just to start off as a reasonably talented 1st level Wizard.

It's like asking why everyone doesn't go to college. An extra $1 million in increased earnings over your lifetime sounds really good, and you'd think that everyone smart would do it. But some smart people just can't find a way to make it happen. Coming from a (reasonably) wealthy family where both parents went to college helps more than being smart. Getting levels in wizard is similar.

Wiseman · Post by **Wiseman** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:23 am

So what about clerics? Technically, you don't even need to worship a god to become one, and I don't think there's any cost of entry for that. You could totally believe in the concept of helping my family not starve (or at least die of thirst). (Family and Protection domains).

shadzar · Post by **shadzar** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:37 am

Night Goat wrote:I have a related question: why doesn't everyone with an above-average mental stat become a spellcaster? Even if you're not going to be an adventurer, the benefits should be obvious.

feed your family or leave them?

as for the cleric, well how many clerics get spells jsut for no reason?

it really depends on the world, and either could happen if that is the type of game you want.

main reason is PCs are top priority because they are the ones the players control and the NPCs are just story elements that get the PCs going on to their adventures.

ACOS · Post by **ACOS** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:22 am

Cyberzombie wrote: How do the PCs even know that the tavernkeeper leveled up?

They generally don't. But when it does get noticed, it's stuff like:
* skills improvement: maybe he's better at calming down rowdy patrons (diplomacy), he makes better drinks (profession/craft), etc.
* BAB: he's able to make quicker work of overly-rowdy patrons
* WBL: if he's expanded his operation, that means he has more money, ...
And, of course, they gain XP by engaging in tavernkeeper-appropriate "challenges".

It's little things - very little things -, but it does add a sense that the people in the world are on their own personal advancement paths.
If every NPC is just in a lifelong state of stagnation, or only plot-relevant people are advancing, it just doesn't jive - if the setting is supposed to be alive, then the elements that make up that setting actually need to feel like it.

Night Goat wrote: I have a related question: why doesn't everyone with an above-average mental stat become a spellcaster? Even if you're not going to be an adventurer, the benefits should be obvious.

The same reasons LOTS of people IRL don't fulfill their potential. Loss of interest in their particular direction; found "dumber" careers to be more personally fulfilling; ran out of money; popped out some kids before they had a chance to go find their dreams; really bad decision-making processes based on mis-ordered priorities; etc.

darkmaster · Post by **darkmaster** » Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:57 am

But here's the thing, in preindustrial society, there is education, it's just provided by the church. So matters of getting rewarded in heaven should be a thing people know about because the clrics of a god have one job and that is to push that god's agenda in the world at large. So when you go into a temple of Saint Cuthbert you hear fiery sermons about how awesome rededifying undead is and see grizzly frescoes depicting scenes of vampires being stabbed in the face and the messege is clear, "these guys are asshole, if you kill a bunch of them Cuthbert will set you up in the afterlife."