More Threads that make us Laugh, Cry, or Both

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:27 am

Being a Red Mage fan, it does look interesting, but as I wrote on The Wiz I would never actually play this class.
However it does fulfill the role of Walking Toolbox nicely.

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:16 am

Talisman wrote:In the "I just found a pointy stick...should I poke myself with it?" department...

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1020469

Yes, you should, in both eyes.

Maxus wrote:The results of your experiment are disturbing. But by all means, keep doing more.

The funny thing is this experiment is based off one that was done by I think Tempest Stormwind and others when they made a class that was really just a fighter with it feats switch out with feats that were written as class abilities. People said it was overpowered and broken.

So I may do another one, but I working more on my Runic Knight, and a d20 campaign setting.

sigma999 wrote:Being a Red Mage fan, it does look interesting, but as I wrote on The Wiz I would never actually play this class.
However it does fulfill the role of Walking Toolbox nicely.

That's cool, it really was way to break up the monotony of "fighter" threads.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:38 am

Talisman wrote:In the "I just found a pointy stick...should I poke myself with it?" department...

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1020469

Oh, another "Burn the cheaters at the stake!" thread. *rolls eyes*

When I DM, I seriously don't care if players cheat. If that helps them enjoy the game more (whether for the "I always succeed!" or simply succeeding when it's something that is important to the character or a dramatic moment where, were it a movie, it would have to succeed), then so be it. Heck, maybe they suck at optimisation while playing a fighter or bard and they're just making my job (keeping them alive) easier.

I just seriously don't care. But, there are people there who apparently play D&D at tournaments or something, where cheating will affect the outcome of a televised event and where millions of dollars are at stake. Or they just take their hobby a little too seriously.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:51 am

See, I have a single cheater die I only use when a fumble would seriously ruin the game for me, it's a d20 with no one and two 20s.

Draco_Argentum · Post by **Draco_Argentum** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:48 am

Cheating is not cool. Its an RPG, if the rules aren't what you like change them. Hell, mandate loaded dice if thats more fun. But telling your friends you're doing one thing then actually doing something else is lame.

Besides, if you need to win D&D so badly that you get loaded dice you're just taking your hobby a little too seriously.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:17 am

I agree in that I don't care enough to cheat, although it can really shit me up the wall when I get a serious of crap rolls. What I do then is get pissy and either people know it and handle me with kid gloves, or eventually I just go home/stop paying attention to the game and do something else altogether.

Online games, if I find myself in a situation where I'm just rolling crap, I tell the DM to roll for me. Because maybe their real dice that I can't see (but the DM can) will be fairer than dice programs, which are known to hate people. Or I just completely ignore the game, which is really easy for message board things, but I usually save that for when I can't do anything useful because my character sucks or whatever.

On a few occasions, with one DM, I rolled badly, announced the result, then the DM said "I don't believe you, roll that where I can see it." - before I was even getting in a bad mood. One of those occasions was when rolling a statline, and with big (10cm or more in each dimension) foam dice that he could have easily seen... from Norway.

So, basically, the DM publicly granting free re-rolls.

But I don't care enough to be dishonest about it. Though if I ever rejoin my old groups in Melbourne, I want to do a little experiment, and randomly say "I rolled X, but I don't like that, is everyone okay with calling it Y instead?" - both for "I rolled low, I want high" and the other way round.

I have the feeling they'll be fine with both, but moreso the former. If it was the White Wolf group though, they'd only allow the latter, and start masturbating as it was said. Because the word "botch" is sex talk to them.

...an I take this moment to just say I hate White Wolf, their games, and the type of people who commonly play their games?

PhoneLobster · Post by **PhoneLobster** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:33 pm

You know how if you practice coin flipping, even just a little bit, a normal person can eventually master it, without cheating, to the degree that they get their chosen result not 50% but more like 80% of the time?

Well when rolling a single d6 on a smooth flat surface against someone else's d6 roll to determine who goes first for various games I play I amuse myself by rolling the same number as them.

I'm remarkably good at it. Still well off 80% but then a d6 is a little more difficult to manipulate than a coin.

It's harder with higher sided dice and frankly dead easy with a d4. But you can safely assume that even unconscious effort and a massive familiarity with the object may sway the results of a dice roll.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:50 pm

Heh, that's pretty funny.

"What on Earth... that's the eighth tie in a row!"

I know people who boil dice that routinely roll poorly. The other dice are arranged in a circle around a glass of boiling water to watch, and the offending die is dropped in, to serve as an example for others.

It's sort of like a Commissar of dice.

Bigode · Post by **Bigode** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:11 pm

Leress wrote:The funny thing is this experiment is based off one that was done by I think Tempest Stormwind and others when they made a class that was really just a fighter with it feats switch out with feats that were written as class abilities. People said it was overpowered and broken.

It was just Seerow (who later led the making of a real fix - if not perfect, of course). Also, hope something good comes outta the experience (in part because I thought "people don't read" was a long-established conclusion, in part because I actually saw a concept in it, specifically fey as it may be).

Koumei wrote:I just seriously don't care. But, there are people there who apparently play D&D at tournaments or something, where cheating will affect the outcome of a televised event and where millions of dollars are at stake. Or they just take their hobby a little too seriously.

That's especially funny for me, as next-last week I came second instead of first in a tournament due to badly-explained rules (namely, whether the exclusive skill concept was still in use, making me, who'd otherwise use UMD, lose specifically for not doing so).

Talisman · Post by **Talisman** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:18 pm

Koumei wrote:I know people who boil dice that routinely roll poorly. The other dice are arranged in a circle around a glass of boiling water to watch, and the offending die is dropped in, to serve as an example for others.

It's sort of like a Commissar of dice.

Awesome.

But what do you do for the good dice? For example, I have a d20 that recently rolled 5 crits in a row, of which 4 were natural 20's. How should I reward him?

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:49 pm

Talisman wrote:
Koumei wrote:I know people who boil dice that routinely roll poorly. The other dice are arranged in a circle around a glass of boiling water to watch, and the offending die is dropped in, to serve as an example for others.

It's sort of like a Commissar of dice.
Awesome.

But what do you do for the good dice? For example, I have a d20 that recently rolled 5 crits in a row, of which 4 were natural 20's. How should I reward him?

Cake

angelfromanotherpin · Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:51 pm

A place of honor on a small plush cushion. Possibly with pretty attendant d6 to see to its dicely needs.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:01 am

I'm glad you asked.

I have a lucky dice tin, which is padded with a very beautiful fake fur material. It's sort of a deep red-purple with a hint of magenta here and there, speckled with black spots.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:42 am

Leress wrote:The funny thing is this experiment is based off one that was done by I think Tempest Stormwind and others when they made a class that was really just a fighter with it feats switch out with feats that were written as class abilities. People said it was overpowered and broken.

Are you fucking kidding me? rofl.

I kind of share Koumei's view about cheating, sorta. It's not cool if people are overpowering other members of the party, but that's really fine if it's some climactic roll that failing would just not be right.

As for die roll manipulation, people have done that sort of thing for playing craps and have done it well, well enough that nowadays they make you throw the dice really hard against the back wall to stop that sort of thing. I'd imagine a d20 would be significantly harder, though.

SphereOfFeetMan · Post by **SphereOfFeetMan** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:07 am

Cheating in a game is lying to your friends.

If you don't want the dice to determine the outcome, don't use them. Make your own rules, or don't use rules.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:26 am

95% of the time the dice are fine in determining the outcome. The other 5%, like situations I described, they are not. If everyone understands that, I fail to see the issue.

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:32 am

Prak_Anima wrote:See, I have a single cheater die I only use when a fumble would seriously ruin the game for me, it's a d20 with no one and two 20s.

If I had one of those, which is difficult since the local game store refuses to carry any, I would call it the Noob Dice and only lend it to the newest player for a session.
Or anyone that critfumbled more than 3 times in an encounter.
But never for DMing, nor in any regular situation.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:13 pm

Like I said, I only use it when a critfumble would ruin the damned game, and I do tend to roll alot of those... I actually got it while I played magic from another guy in a tournament, free, because I thought it was cool and he was just using it to keep track of life.

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:50 pm

What, never had those 1-life-each down to the line close calls in MTG?

Draco_Argentum · Post by **Draco_Argentum** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:33 am

Surgo wrote:95% of the time the dice are fine in determining the outcome. The other 5%, like situations I described, they are not. If everyone understands that, I fail to see the issue.

Which is different from using a loaded die without telling the rest of the group. Once its been rule zeroed in its not cheating.

SphereOfFeetMan · Post by **SphereOfFeetMan** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:16 pm

Post #11 hurt me with stupid.

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=224801

epochrpg wrote:Quote:
Originally Posted by jackston2
None of my players want to play a defender. Not in 3rd and still not in 4th.

According to them, defenders are "dumb servants" and "meat shields" whose sole job is to get hurt/ be incapacitated so the wizards and assassins can bask in the limelight.

Can anyone help me put a positive spin on the defender for my players?

Very easy. Run a few games that end in TPK. Remark how they may have survived the encounter if they'd had a decent defender.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:57 pm

That... arh. The stupid hurts me as well. It's like the minesweeper role in so many games I've been in. No-one wanted to play that role, to the point where either we had an NPC to do that shit for us, or the person who grudgingly played it took their vengeance by stealing shit from everyone.

Luckily, we usually had an NPC for it. Though since discovering the joys of "Most spells are devices", I'd do it. Just so I could disable confusion by jamming a lock pick into someone's ear.

But this looks like a classic case of "They've noticed the truth, so either give them a meatshield NPC or don't make encounters that actually need defenders. From the look of it, you don't need them anyway, so it's all good."

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:00 pm

SphereOfFeetMan wrote:Post #11 hurt me with stupid.

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=224801

epochrpg wrote:

Very easy. Run a few games that end in TPK. Remark how they may have survived the encounter if they'd had a decent defender.

See, that's saying "I'm an asshole DM."

And, actually it rather reminds me of this:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/ ... 22434.html

See, Virg and Cynic, there are DMs who make yours look pretty mild.

bosssmiley · Post by **bosssmiley** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:02 pm

Hi.

"Why the hate for Balance?"

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79138

I'm a habitué of the boards in question, but even I was cringing within two posts and losing faith in humanity within 4.

Hope it raises a smile or two.

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:10 pm

Minesweeper??? lulz. Just play a spellcaster, Shoot wide-area Evocations at the traps to blow them up or send a summoned critter in.
And why meat shield at all? Just use restraining techniques either by spell, net, tanglefoot bag, or similar.

But those answers are obvious.
Perhaps too obvious for these "we need a defender" types.