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Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:11 am
by virgil
I'm using a skill trick that allows me to concentrate on spells as a swift action rather than a standard action; which my only real option right now are the various illusion spells.

Since that's the only thing that changes, I still can't cast a spell while concentrating, so I'm trying to figure out ways to continue to contribute to the battle while concentrating on the spell; despite being an 11th level wizard.

I have two days of preparation, so any magic item crafting is limited to 2000gp in value. The only reason this is the case is we're about to attack an illithid fortress (with duergar, trolls, couple grimlocks, illithids, etc).

I've already done lesser planar binding earlier and got the service of three justice archons (MMIV) free of charge for this fight. I've got one custom spell that allows me to animate objects permanently, but their HD count as undead for purposes of my cap with animate dead; as a result, I've also got a pit fiend skeleton, a huge mithril chain, and a huge iron statue with an exotic saddle that gives the rider cover. With only alter self as a troglodyte, I have a 28 AC while mounted on the statue, and a +16 Will save.

I've only just now reached 11th level, so I haven't chosen my two 6th level spells; of which I can only choose from the PHB (should be able to finagle an extra one or two).

Does activating a wand still count as casting a spell? Heck, when I maintain a silent image, can I change the illusion to something else without having to recast it (any who disbelieved that casting remain disbelieved of it)?

Any other suggestions for what I'm getting into? There is basically a houserule on polymorph where I can't turn into any templated creatures, and it's iffy as to whether I can turn into an advanced HD creature, but I do use the spell once in awhile...keeping the benefits of my headband of intellect and cloak of resistance; though that's somewhat underhanded, as I'm intentionally deactivating the rest so I'd avoid any close watch by the DM and subsequent discussion of what gear remains active (recently ruled any gear put on after using wildshape by the druid is automatically absorbed, forcing him to use a lot of wilding clasps).

There is also an understanding that I won't bind an efreet, so I need to be careful with whatever I bind, as anything too good will probably be stealth nerfed one way or another.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:51 am
by SphereOfFeetMan
If you can 'finagle' it, maybe you would want the spell Imbue Familiar With Spell Ability. It is from Complete Arcane, p.112. You can just give your illusion spell to your familiar and have him cast it and concentrate on it. It's a level 6 spell. At caster level 11, you could imbue 3 spells, each of up to a level 3 spell. Duration 1 hour/level.

Other things:
-Get some gaze spells, cast them before battle and have them active while you are concentrating. (bonus points if used through walls of force)
-Use ready actions. Since you would otherwise be concentrating on a spell for your action, ready an action to cast a spell (breaking your concentration) versus particularly dangerous and unpredictable foes.

I can't give much more advice without knowing more about you and your party's resources.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:20 am
by virgil
My resources are more or less battlefield control wizard, Wizard 6/Geometer 3/Loremaster 2, Int 26 with headband factored in.

We have...

A quiet druid that sometimes falls asleep, so he doesn't do much compared to what he's capable of (still a druid though).

Another druid, only level 10, with a full set of wilding clasps and fully aware of his capability and possibly an awakened tree or two in tow.

A barbarian with a big sword and vanilla gear, so nothing in the way of flight or ranged ability. Probably does ~20/swing most of the time.

A bard 5/outcast champion 5/something 1 (thinking maybe dread pirate), who's doesn't really do much on his own other than inspire courage and fling about a +1 shocking bow (no archery feats), or swing a sword for crap damage for our level. I think the most damage I've ever seen him do in an entire round is 25.

A cleric 9 (sun & magic domain) with a +2 LA template that grants her scorching ray 2/day, FR 10 or 15, and meaningless crap along with no magic oriented feats except for the ability to cast cure spells up to 30' away and walks around with about a 23 or 24 AC most of the time...and virtually no ability to know what to memorize without someone telling her what to memorize.

We also have a paladin with a +3 aberration bane longsword (also casts restoration once or twice a day), and some general stuff that applies to his melee role (and a flying mount). His damage output is a touch better than the barbarian (not sure how), about ~25/swing.

A monk, but he's more like a well-made level 7 character as far as what he brings to the table for numerous reasons.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:46 am
by Username17
Since that's the only thing that changes, I still can't cast a spell while concentrating [Citation Needed]


I'm looking right at page 140 of the PHB and I do not see this rule.

-Username17

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:51 am
by virgil
I can't give you a PHB quote, but I can give an SRD quote, under the duration section here.

Edit: Ah, here it is. I apparently do have the book on hand. The rule is on page 176.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:20 am
by SphereOfFeetMan
It is a common houserule to allow the feat Extraordinary Concentration (Complete Adventurer p. 109) to allow you to concentrate on one spell and cast another. The benefit of the feat is that it lets you move the concentration time of a spell down from a standard action, to a move action, to a swift action, dependant upon a skill check. However, the description states, and I quote: "Your mind is so focused that you can cast spells even while concentrating on another spell." It is up for debate whether the author of that feat intended for it to work that way or not, and whether or not he also forgot that one cannot normally cast a spell while concentrating on another one, despite its concentration time.

That said, the earliest you can take it is level 12, so it is something to consider.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:23 pm
by SunTzuWarmaster
It sounds as though you have a fairly lenient DM, so I suggest the combo I am currently using:

I have the Skill Feat of Concentration:
------------------------------------------------------------------
Combat Casting [Skill]
Having a sword sticking out of your chest doesn't noticeably impede your ability to do—well, just about anything. (This is a Skill feat that scales with your ranks in Concentration.)

Benefits: You gain +3 to your Concentration checks.

4: You can take 10 on Concentration checks and caster level checks.

9: You may maintain concentration on a spell as a move action (DC 25 + spell level). If you beat the DC by 10 or more, you can maintain concentration as a swift action. If you fail your check, you lose concentration.

14: If you would be nauseated, you're sickened instead.

19: All Concentration DCs are halved for you.
------------------------------------------------------------------

and I have a custom magic item: Rod of Minor Quickening (can only quicken 1st level spells).

Essentially this means that if I have not cast an Immediate Action spell (Stay the Hand, Great Mirror Image), or Swift Action spell (Distract Assailant), I will be casting a Silent Image.

That's just a suggestion. The above suggestion of Extraordinary Concentration is right up your way. Remember, I think that you can only use a Skill Trick once per encounter.

Activating a wand is a Standard Action (the same as most spells), so tough luck.

You may change the illusion in accordance with the will of your DM, essentially. I have commonly done something like making a fake Wall of Force one round and then had it ignite and be on fire for the following round. Talk to your DM to see if he will allow you to have illusionary Babau soldiers walk through it. Your mileage may vary, my DM plays it that anyone that knew the wall was fake before the babau soldiers walked through knew the soldiers were fake, and that anyone that attacked the soldiers and made the save to realize that they were illusionary also knew the wall was illusionary. This seemed fair enough (heck, for 1 spell I denied the enemy several actions).

However, watch for for True Seeing, Tremorsense and the like that allow them to realize your illusions.

Level 6 spells that you want:
Contingency, provided that you have not banned evocation
Acid Fog can be fun (you can wreck supporting pillars)
Suggestion, Mass is solid (it gets a decent save because it is high level)
Disintegrate is a solid spell (also a spell that you can use to make your own entrance into a castle)

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:29 pm
by K
There's a feat that lets your familiar do the Concentrating on a spell. I don't remember where its from but its a short list of books to check.

Re: Concentration and battleplans

Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:40 am
by cthulhu
Isn't the obvious plan to polymorph into something? Preferably something damaging that the barbarian can ride?