The Gaming Den

So for the longest time I've had a problem-I'm really bad at writing more than a few sentences for, well, anything. It makes it hard to write essays, but more importantly, it makes it really hard to contribute to forums and other, similar things. It also doesn't help that I second guess everything I say, so I end up deleting even the small things I do write.

For example, the above is 3 sentences. I'm positive that anyone else here could have written far more than that about themselves, and made it an interesting thing to read. I want to be able to do that. I want to be able to write significant, interesting things so I can feel like I can actually contribute to things and be an interesting member of the places I go to.

About the only thing I am good at is personal conversations with people. But those conversations are personal, and so I don't have to worry about what other people think, and my desire to write something that will actually be interesting doesn't come into play. But with public conversations, I can never think of what to write, or how to write it, and even when I can, I can't think of anything more than one or two lines.

So in short, what the fuck do I do about this?

So what are you trying to write?

Like for gaming or something, I just write every idea done on index cards....well now in notepad...and just pick the ones I like and link them together.

OMG! Someone read something you wrote and has an opinion about it. Fuck'em. If it is a bad opinion or disagrees with you...fuck'em. If it is a good opinion and agrees with you...fuck'em.

Just don't worry about what random other people think.

If you are writing a novel, then fuck'em all and just write what you want to read, or the story you want to tell.

The thing is, in order to write more, you need to write more. Sounds kind of dumb, but its like walking. The more you did it to begin with the easier it got. Same with writing.

So what exactly is it you are trying to write? Just posting around these parts or other places on the net? Some novel? Something for a game?

I want to be able to write... anything. I have the same problem with everything; posting on forums, writing game stuff, writing essays (not that I do that after dropping out), etc. I just feel like I don't have anything to say, even when I absolutely do. Even when I have an opinion on something, I always convince myself that someone else has already said everything I have to say.

I suppose it could all be a self esteem problem; I never feel like anything I have to say is worth saying over what other people have to say.

It does sound like a self-esteem thing, but I do not have the qualifications to say that. On the other hand, you mention you're good at personal conversations with people, and that sounds like "being better equipped for the real world".

Which doesn't address the point. Perhaps... just decide "I want to talk about THIS!" (regardless of what it is), dot point the things that need mentioning, and pretend no-one on the planet has even considered anything you're saying. Seriously, say "Screw it, if you've read it before, then that's your loss".

That may give you the practice you need? So for instance, I recall that you stopped playing D&D in favour of Dark Heresy. So maybe write up a game session that happened, saying how it went. Or talk about rules fixes for it, or custom stuff or something.

You don't have to disagree with anyone in order to hold a conversation. Nobody will know who/what you agree with if you don't state it even if someone else has already said it.

Take for example health care in the US. If only one person spoke out for reform, would we be anywhere? Doubtful.

So in order to make your view known you just have to open your mouth an speak as it were.

Take gaming for example.There are shy players there, and in my games they quickly quit...being shy that is. You just have to get them involved. I found the best way is to piss them off into saying something...anything. It takes reading the person so you don't scare the hell out of them, but you piss them off to where there anger at you surpasses their shyness, and they open up fairly quickly and forget they were shy in the game.

Me: What are you doing Steve?
Steve: ...
Me: Earth to Steve. Hello McFly. Marty McFly!
Steve: Huh? What?
Me: Yes knucklehead. You. The one sitting like a bump on a frog. Are you in this fight or what?
Steve: Yeah.
Me: "Yeah"...Well what are you doing? Sitting around like a hillbilly from Deliverance thinking that pig has a pretty mouth? (that usually does it)
Steve: I'm attacking the orc with my sword!
Me: Roll the damn dice then
Steve: Fine!
Me: You hit, now..
Steve: I did 5 damage

Now Steve was enough upset to forget being shy and started playing a bit more.

Not that this will work on everything or in the same way. But you just have to get involved with whatever you are trying to do. Don't be indecisive.

Self esteem doesn't exist. It is just vanity. Do you really want to be one of those freaks walking around thinking they are some big shit like Titney Spears, or Paris Hilton, the epitome of the vane people that cares what everyone else thinks and they have to act in a way that everyone else would approve?

Fuck that! Who cares what the other 6.6 billion people on the planet thinks. They are mostly retards anyway. So don't succumb to their vain ways. You lose less brain cells drinking beer than being as pompous and vain as them, so save your intelligence to spite them.

Like when all the women burned their bras. (Too bad they started wearing them again...bouncey bouncey bouncey... )

I’m no expert on the subject of writing, but I can give a few helpful hints. The first question is “what do you want to write?” From there you proceed onwards.

Reading is important. Read what you want to write. You want to write RPG systems? Read a few, the good, the bad and the ugly (so you will know how not to write).

Writing is important. There are lots of contests out there where you get so involved in doing something your inner critic and inner editor doesn’t have a chance to tell you how stupid you are. No one gets the Nobel Prize for writing on his or her first work, live with that and learn from it. There are contests for novels, screen plays, even RPG modules.

Listening is important. Have you ever wondered what would be the result of listening to way too much Andy Rooney in the old 60 Minutes news show? I have often wondered that myself, and I am sort of afraid of the result. Commentators are great ways to get a good style of your own. I wouldn’t go with the political ones as they tend to be more of an in your face style and not a conversational style, like the late and great William F. Buckley Jr. was.

And before I forget, having a point is important, at least on occasion. Yes I do tend to forget that on many an occasion.

I've found that playing multiple PbP games has contributed to my volume and practice with writing. That has to help, doesn't it?

Neil Gaiman's advice: 'Write things. Then finish things.'

Just write. Start with a journal or a blog. Set aside a specific amount of time each day (I recommend 30-60 minutes), and spend all of that time either writing or staring at blank space cursing your inability to write on it. It will get easier as you go, like most things.

Seriously, just write, and don't get hung up on mistakes. You'll make them, you always will.

The trick is to improve based on the mistakes that other people have pointed out.

Something I often do is to simply write sentences or portions of sentences within a thought, and then when I get stuck simply drop down a line and begin another thought in another paragraph. It gets things done quickly because you cover a lot of ground without needing to spend time beating yourself up over thoughts you aren't ready to finish. Unfortunately you can sometimes forget to go back and finish something, leaving a sentence or concept at the end of a paragraph to

But one you've done that a few times, you've got a scaffold to hang your essay (or whatever) on. A basic argument may be 3 or five paragraphs, and if you just write an introductory sentence or two into each one you'll have places to hang further sentences as you think of them. Remember that while you read a work one sentence after another, there's no reason you have to write it that way. Every time you have a stray thought, or remember something you should have said, or whatever, you can take these thought fragments and file them in their appropriate paragraphs with the magic of word processing software. This will make you sound erudite and focused in print, even if the real you is wandering from thought to thought like a 4 year old on acid.

-Username17

Since this seems to be a matter of inspiration and motivation more than craft and technique - I would say the best thing you can do is to JUST WRITE MORE.

Seriously, one of the most useful assignments I ever had was in middle school where a teacher assigned us to write one full page in a journal every single day. He didn't care what we wrote about - the only grade was "done" or "not done" and he only provided grammatical feedback. Some kids wrote about their days, some wrote ongoing mini-soap operas, some wrote lists of gross-out jokes, some wrote about where they found the rainbow butterfly stickers they plastered on the outside of their journals and some wrote about studio wrasslin while others wrote about comic books and how confusing AD&D was - but we all had to fill at least one page each day.

You could do that, and if you are a personal person you could do it the way we did, with one of These and a trusted friend to provide honest feedback.

Of course, with this Series of Tubes here, you could also do an online version with a blog or a series of posts on a forum - that reaches a wider audience, gets faster feedback, but really requires a thicker skin and an ability to ignore trolls.

Cielingcat wrote:So for the longest time I've had a problem-I'm really bad at writing more than a few sentences for, well, anything. It makes it hard to write essays, but more importantly, it makes it really hard to contribute to forums and other, similar things. It also doesn't help that I second guess everything I say, so I end up deleting even the small things I do write.

Not sure why you'd want to write more as opposed to write better. The two aren't remotely the same. Horrible writers can go on and on without creating a believable or interesting story (in fiction) or a rational, understandable argument or explanation (in non-fiction). Being concise isn't a bad thing, it's a laudable goal.

Now if you are ask how can you write more often, then I recommend just, you know, doing it. Especially on the internet, where you can always just create a new alias if you feel you've embarrassed yourself to much.

Going through high school, I had problems writing. My mom finally sat me down one day, and confirmed this - I was a terrible writer. But she pointed out that I was a great speaker, and suggested that I try writing by talking aloud what I wanted to say, then writing it down.

That worked really well.

Then, in college, my husband made me take a fiction writing class (in exchange for me making him take basic chemistry). We wrote so much that by the end of the quarter, I had started thinking in stories and was actually doing remarkably well.

I've found that when I do something for an extended period of time, I start to see that thing everywhere. If I play a game - Tetris, Dr. Mario, Civilization IV - for a large portion of my day, I tend to see parts of the game wherever I look. After compiling a large number of pictures of cute guys one day, I started to pull out cute guy faces in the wood grain of my door and the texture of my ceiling.

The same thing works for writing, too. After doing it enough, you actually start thinking in a writing mode and then you can concentrate more on quality and less on just making the attempt.

Don't panic. Practice on us.

Neeeek wrote:Not sure why you'd want to write more as opposed to write better.

The basic reason is you have to walk before you can fox trot. Once you get used to the notion of writing, and then used to the notion of reading, you are more able to take on the real work that is necessary to make good writing.

Besides, that is a real letigimate process of writing; the first draft is quantity, the first rewrite is "write better" and the final process is the long work called "editing."

I agree with Tzor 100%. Also for the quantity over quality... it is easier to write a lot and then figure out what was the good stuff that you liked, and then pare down the rest.

I would sometimes when writing papers go beyond the limits of the assignment (starting as Frank suggested, bang out a thought and move on to the next whenever you get stuck... your subconscious will keep working on it), and then I would remove or reduce sections that weren't as necessary or compelling as the rest.

Like all modes of learning, you are going to be creating new connections in your brain, which takes time and is strongly reinforced by repetition and enjoyment. So doing things a lot and having fun helps you learn more effectively. If you get frustrated on something, move on. Just keep writing and come back later. It keeps you happier and keeps you writing. Both help build those brain connections.

One thing that really helps when writing a story is breaking it down.

"Fantasy story where knight rescues princess"

"Princess gets introduced and kidnapped.

Knight hears about missing princess.

Knight discovers dragon's lair in mountain

Knight fights way to dragon

Knight slays dragon

Knight rescues princess"

"Princess Aurelia sat on the side of her bed, lips pursed..."

Just write a rough outline, and keep breaking it down and down until you have individual scenes, which you then replace with actual written scenes.

FrankTrollman wrote:Something I often do is to simply write sentences or portions of sentences within a thought, and then when I get stuck simply drop down a line and begin another thought in another paragraph. It gets things done quickly because you cover a lot of ground without needing to spend time beating yourself up over thoughts you aren't ready to finish. Unfortunately you can sometimes forget to go back and finish something, leaving a sentence or concept at the end of a paragraph to

But one you've done that a few times, you've got a scaffold to hang your essay (or whatever) on. A basic argument may be 3 or five paragraphs, and if you just write an introductory sentence or two into each one you'll have places to hang further sentences as you think of them. Remember that while you read a work one sentence after another, there's no reason you have to write it that way. Every time you have a stray thought, or remember something you should have said, or whatever, you can take these thought fragments and file them in their appropriate paragraphs with the magic of word processing software. This will make you sound erudite and focused in print, even if the real you is wandering from thought to thought like a 4 year old on acid.

-Username17

This is actually a really good idea.

When I was working as a peer tutor at my school's writing centre, the biggest portion of my time dealt with helping people write essays.

The basic rundown of the steps that I used was:

1. Brainstorm: write down any ideas, or examples you want to use; both for and against; don't worry what you write here, you're brainstorming, and no idea is a bad idea

2. Group Ideas: group your ideas together, the most similar being put together. For a hamburger persuasive essay, you'll want 3 'groups', with 3 proof/examples/ideas in each. If you have enough, move to the next step, if you need more, go back to step 1.

3. Title Idea Groups: Come up with a phrase, or title, or description for each group of ideas; sometimes this is trick; I've honestly spent 5 or 10 minutes, given up, and then come back to a few ideas before coming up with an inclusive and accurate title or description for the ideas in a group

4. Thesis: Write your thesis; the three main supporting parts of your thesis are... those three titles/descriptions that you spent slaving over. Seriously, writing a thesis should come after you've got an idea of what you want to argue, and what you will use to prove it.

5. Thesis, unchanged: Note, you just wrote your thesis, and have your proofs already; as well as the title/description for each group of proofs. Thesis could be easily derived from your proof, meaning that you won't be editing, and reworking your thesis every time you have new proofs/material to add to your body paragraphs.

6. Write: You can start working on your intro, body and concluding paragraphs now.

7. Tie in: Remember, your proofs need to mention that they prove, or are linked to the idea of their respective body paragraph. Likewise, your body paragraphs need to be linked to your thesis.

This has to be done for every proof, every quote, and every body paragraph. Your body paragraphs will start, and end, with a sentence that explains how the idea of that particular body paragraph is linked to the thesis statement.

People tend to forget things in the middle of text; meaning that you really need to hammer home the ideas in the middle of your essay.

If not, your body paragraphs will seriously be forgotten as the paper is read.

8. Stuck?: If you get stuck; go back to brainstorming. Look at your other proofs that you didn't use, look for new ones related to your existing groups. Sometimes you'll have to gut something. Trust me it's okay, it's a pain in the ass, but you're better off not having something that you know is shit.

9. Review, Edit: When you're done, read it all, preferably with someone else sitting beside you, and reading it with you. You'll edit a lot better than on your own. One thing that I never did as a tutor was solo-review a student's work; they're already there, and know the material better than me. The writer of something is able to notice mistakes easier than someone reviewing a document

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I tended to use a single sheet of paper to explain this process using 'fake' lists of ideas; then making those ideas into groups; creating titles; creating the essay.

The centre's handout/guideline had similar steps, but was a lot less structured on how to go about generating titles and thesis in a straightforward manner.

With the method above, you can seriously write about whatever, and since the structure of the writing is organized, it will always come out to be a cohesive persuasive essay.

Writing unstructured essays is possible as well, in fact the best writing is essentially an unstructured, or uniquely structured essay. For example, Races of War, is actually a collection of unstructured essays and articles that prove about a dozen different points, and then give recommendations on how to make proven problems become less of a problem.

I've been able to give two pages of Tome material to someone who last played D&D before the year 2000; and they were able to understand and enjoy what was being explained to them.

However, that doesn't mean that structure is unnecessary. Structure is there to make the writing organized, and easier to understand. The brainstorming that occurred before doesn't need to be shown, so make a big fucking mess when you are merely generating ideas.