The Gaming Den

Everyone likes to homebrew ideas with varying degrees of proficiency, but what does it take to get your name stuck in a shiny hard cover book? How about for a big name like D&D or Shadowrun?

Did these guys have previous relations with publishers, did they go for an interview, did they wind up publishing it themselves, how do you go about doing it?

I've read an interview with Gygax and that's about all I know.

Write one.

Ok, that sounds trite even to me. But it's true, all it takes to get your name on a book, is to write one, and publish it through any of a number of channels, if you can get it picked up by another company, so much the better, assuming they let you retain rights and don't fuck you.

As for creating a big name, it's all about marketing.

With the exception of WotC and White Wolf, which actually are tiny vestigial appendages of medium sized corporations, the vast majority of game companies are some guy or a small group of dudes. Getting your work into one of their books involves simply sending them a writing sample and an idea. You only have to impress like 2-3 people.

So for example: I got a gig writing Shadowrun because I wrote a popular SR3 ->SR4 conversion of some of the old spirit types, and people told me I should submit it to the people who were developing Shadowrun at the time (which turned out to be seriously two guys), and that was accepted. I got a gig writing Game Mechanics for Kenzer & Company by simply writing in a couple of columns to KotDT. Those were accepted and whenever I feel like doing one, I send them another.

Now a fair number of game "companies" basically don't read submissions. White Wolf has a backlog of submissions and they normally hand out contracts based on name recognition or nepotism. A number of game companies are seriously just one guy who can't be fucked to give contracts to people he doesn't know and just hires people from his circle of friends or his church or something.

All that being said: being a game designer doesn't pay well. Your professional grade work is going to be paid to the tune of hundreds of dollars. Unless you break into the "big times" like Steve Jackson, you're probably going to need to keep another job.

-Username17

FrankTrollman wrote:Your professional grade work is going to be paid to the tune of hundreds of dollars.

Sounds more than a thousand to me!

OgreBattle wrote:Everyone likes to homebrew ideas with varying degrees of proficiency, but what does it take to get your name stuck in a shiny hard cover book? How about for a big name like D&D or Shadowrun?

Did these guys have previous relations with publishers, did they go for an interview, did they wind up publishing it themselves, how do you go about doing it?

I've read an interview with Gygax and that's about all I know.

The important thing is to have a resume and a portfolio. So for a company like Paizo, first you might get something published in a small-time publication (like Kobold Quarterly or a self-published PDF). Then you might apply to one of Paizo's calls for freelancers to write Pathfinder Society organized play adventures (which are available as PDFs only); back in the old days, "Dragon" and "Dungeon" magazine articles filled this sort of middle-tier writing niche. Then if they still like what they see, they might assign you a (dead tree) module to write or a chapter in a larger book (e.g. writing a bunch of druid feats for "Ultimate Magic"). Alternately, you might be able to skip straight to the module-writing stage by winning their annual talent search.

Kobajagrande wrote:

FrankTrollman wrote:Your professional grade work is going to be paid to the tune of hundreds of dollars.

Sounds more than a thousand to me!

lmao, I cracked up at this.

I sort of fell into it backwards in the run-up to what would be Shadows of Latin America, based mostly on my developing reputation of knowing the SR world inside-and-out. RPG magazine articles are easier, you just have a good idea and do a good write up and send it in and see if they reply.

The key thing is to write, and write alot...then submit alot. I first published in 1989, and was in print somewhere every month at least somewhere until around 2009.

Nowadays, you need to be online. RPG.net is an easy way to get 'published', as long as you stay off the forums so don't risk offending anyone by an actual post.

Seriously, though, there's basically no money here, just fun and lots of free toys.

FrankTrollman wrote: All that being said: being a game designer doesn't pay well. Your professional grade work is going to be paid to the tune of hundreds of dollars.

That will take 6-24 months for the check to show up, and any such check is contingent on the company not going bankrupt before then.

Josh_Kablack wrote:That will take 6-24 months for the check to show up, and any such check is contingent on the company not going bankrupt before then.

This.

Learn to write and write well... in English if the property you're interested in is published by an Anglophone company. When open calls for submissions are solicited, send in your best proposals. Know the property better than the current line developers.

You're probably better off creating your own game engine and setting and self-publishing it first. There are a bazillion resources for that and Deviant Art is full of artists who will do work for free or almost-free. WotC and Fantasy Flight are going to be more impressed with you if you're a self-starter, motivated and understand the basics of publishing. And have stuff in the market already.

Have a focus. If you're good at math and mechanics, do that. If you're a wannabe novelist, write fantastic fluff. If you're a graphic designer or illustrator (which will open up more doors for you than game writing) do that.

Like any job, what you know is important but who you know is everything. TTRPG game writing/development is a small and contracting circle and everyone knows everyone. Be polite, correspond with creators in a non-stalkery way and attend conventions to get face time.

Edit: grammar.

Know the property better than the current line developers.

You'd think that would be really hard, but it is not.

It isn't just laziness either. If I wrote a rule, chances are pretty good that it was version seven or eight of that rule that I finally settled on. If you ask me point blank what the rule is for something specific and obscure, I may have to look it up even though I wrote it. Because what I released was not my first draft. It's a refined draft, meaning that I remember that rule going all kinds of which ways. On the other hand, a fan was only exposed to one version: whatever was in the final draft.

So as a fan, you can easily have a much clearer idea of what the rules say and even what they mean than the person who actually wrote the rules in question.

-Username17

Josh_Kablack wrote:That will take 6-24 months for the check to show up, and any such check is contingent on the company not going bankrupt before then.

My record is 18 months...WotC.

Interesting, what was it that you wrote for Wizards, Doom? Sounds like the den should work for these companies more, even just as part-time, sounds like guys would have a better mind of how the rules work than the actual designers.

Any suggestions for people to better learn the rules of an RPG, despite don't have the critical thinking critique that the likes of pretty much all, posters here on the Gaming Den? As simple reading sometimes won't necessarily bring an immediate thought to mind as being bad/good respectively.

Now imagine if the gaming den were to form its own company...

The idea's been batted around before. The conclusion is that we need the ability to actually pay people real world money.

We can't pay people in Internets or metaphorical cookies?

Yea the money issue is always present but if the den could get one good game out into the market, that would already provide some profit.

But actually making that game while on a very low budget is another matter entirely. Still, it can be done.

Our policy for external submissions is very simple: when you submit material, you forfeit any rights of ownership or royalty in return for being unambiguously credited on the published material. This allows aspiring content creators to build a portfolio of published works using accepted submissions, which can then be leveraged to get a part-time or full-time position as a content creator.

echo

echoVanguard wrote:Our policy for external submissions is very simple: when you submit material, you forfeit any rights of ownership or royalty in return for being unambiguously credited on the published material. This allows aspiring content creators to build a portfolio of published works using accepted submissions, which can then be leveraged to get a part-time or full-time position as a content creator.

echo

just like submissions to the old Dragon and Dungeon magazines, or any other magazine.

shadzar wrote:just like submissions to the old Dragon and Dungeon magazines, or any other magazine.

Pretty much, although we also publish submissions as part of sourcebooks if they meet our quality standards.

echo