The Gaming Den

In 2011 I bantered notions with a comic illustrator about designing a fighting game.
It's been on hold for a while while I sort out personal problems and my friend does a few projects.

The concepts were in its infancy but it would pretty much be, in essence, Frankstein's monster and similar creations pitted against vampire clans.
On Mars.
In the future.

Actors such as Kiefer Sutherland expressed interest in voice acting for a character, which I promised him once the project got to that point, since he said his son loved fighting games.

Mugen was used for a few mockups, namely the primary protag "Grandfather Monster" which was Frankenstein's original creation, and two vampires. It sufficed but the Mugen engine didn't support the kind of custom mechanics we wanted.

I had some ideas that were tested:
1. Semi random hitboxes to mix up the move spam. This was shot down due to unpredictability, which testers didn't like.
2. Custom bonuses such as speed, power, HP, and special bar regen/bar length using "gems" that can be plugged into three slots before a fight. Gems are won by playing story mode.
3. A control setup similar to Smash Brothers more than Street Fighter. No redundant punch/kick buttons.

What do you all want to see in a game such as this? Are there any pitfalls to avoid in fighting games that I'm not seeing here?
It will likely be resumed this year.

http://www.sirlin.net/article-archive/

http://shoryuken.com/glossary/

A control setup similar to Smash Brothers more than Street Fighter. No redundant punch/kick buttons.

There were no redundant punch/kick buttons in Street Fighter. Each one had different start-up, activation, and recovery frames.

If you're making a fighting game with a story mode you need to make sure the story mode does not change the multiplayer at all, because that is what people play fighting games for.

If you want to use a per-match customization you...well you really shouldn't unless it has the option of being removed. You could probably make a very fun casual game out of it, but casual players fucking hate fighting games that aren't Smash Brothers.

Semi-random hitboxes are dumb.

Pitfall: Avoid infinite combos, and be sure to allow players who are being hit a chance to change the game. Smash Brothers (all iterations) did this with Directional Influence (DI), where your character will move in a certain direction when hit based on where they moved their control stick. This did not overpower real move knockback (if a move sends you up and you held right you'd still go up, but also drift right a decent amount), and made the game more interesting because you couldn't just auto-combo people.

A control setup similar to Smash is very similar to SF. I assume you meant to say "easily playable on a normal console controller", in which case you want shoulder buttons or control stick taps to help switch between attacks. Smash had different attacks just like SF had (for each button/direction), you just activated "weak," "moderate," and "strong" by not moving/tilting weakly/tapping the control stick in a certain direction before hitting your "regular" or "special" button. I mean, super moves in SF are still a barrier due to its control scheme, but that also lets SF have more of them. The control scheme is hardly different as far as number of attacks goes.

Balance is key to a fighter, casual or not. Just don't make stupid combos on any character and it'll be fine.

Leress wrote: There were no redundant punch/kick buttons in Street Fighter. Each one had different start-up, activation, and recovery frames.

There are three punch buttons and three kick buttons. That's far too many granted how you can combo moves anyway by tilting in directions and chaining button presses.

I was thinking of having a Smash Brothers setup with one punch, one kick, one "special", and one block.

Pseudo Stupidity wrote: If you want to use a per-match customization you...well you really shouldn't unless it has the option of being removed. You could probably make a very fun casual game out of it, but casual players fucking hate fighting games that aren't Smash Brothers.

Naturally, there will be a menu entry just before entering a two player match that is either "Custom" or "Default", with custom allowing the gem slot assignment.

It could very well also allow a player to use all bonus gems from the start with versus mode rather than unlock them, but with single player I was thinking of doing a kind of CCG like gathering mechanism so that players have a sense of progress.

There are three punch buttons and three kick buttons. That's far too many granted how you can combo moves anyway by tilting in directions and chaining button presses.

Speed, Range, Priority is the trinity of Street Fighter.

Light attacks tend to be the fastest, medium attacks tend to reach the furthest, fierce attacks tend to hit the hardest and override lighter blows.

It's certainly complex, but for Street Fighter not redundant. You're making a Smash Bros style game though so whatever. You should take a look at Blaz Blue as they have a "light, heavy, kick, and special button' setup, with every character doing a different special. Pocket Fighter too for "What if Street Fighter was made less complex"


What's Sutherland & Son's favorite fighting games?

Bottom line is, the number of buttons should be dictated by the complexity/reliability of your dpad inputs. 4-6 buttons isn't way too much if those buttons are effectively acting as release valves that keep your game from featuring ricockulous bullshit on the dpad.

OgreBattle wrote: What's Sutherland & Son's favorite fighting games?

Street Fighter, if my memory is correct

Pseudo Stupidity wrote: You could probably make a very fun casual game out of it, but casual players fucking hate fighting games that aren't Smash Brothers.

I'm a casual player, and I only hate fighting games that make no attempt (or sometimes even go out of their way) to make themselves excessively unfriendly to new players. There's no reason to make your game play like a quarter-eater unless you're making an arcade game where the point is to make the game eat quarters.

Actually, that's a pretty important suggestion: don't make single-player too difficult or confusing, since all that does is repel potential players (and, if you're planning on selling it, customers.) The really challenging stuff is going to come from veteran human players, so don't make the computers Nintendo Hard unless you explicitly have options to crank that down. Basically, have an Easy Mode on hand, and perhaps even a Training/Practice Mode. Hardcore gamers have tournaments and multiplayer (and probably even a Hard Mode) if they want something really hard.

Balance is key to a fighter, casual or not. Just don't make stupid combos on any character and it'll be fine.

This, very much this.

I'd like to add that you should avoid 'joke' characters (where the joke is that they are deliberately underpowered) at all costs. That kind of joke is really only funny to the designers, and is only really interesting as a Hard Mode in a single-player game. In a game that expects multiplayer (as a fighting game is going to) it just reeks of bad game design. If you want to make a joke character, balance them with the other characters and just let the joke come from some combination of their design, moves, and/or in-game dialogue, because that can genuinely be funny.

Also, I'd probably avoid unlockable characters, since it ranges from "kind of annoying" to "why the fuck would you do this?" when you have to press through a lot of bullshit just in order to play what you want with your friends. If someone wants to whore achievements, just put achievements and/or a scoring system in your game.

That's just my 2 cents on the whole matter, but I'm by no means an expert so feel free to ignore me if more savvy gamers weigh in on it.

You should totally have a character creation system, like SCV.

sigma999 wrote:

OgreBattle wrote: What's Sutherland & Son's favorite fighting games?

Street Fighter, if my memory is correct

I really hope their favorite character is Guile.