5th Edition

TheWorid · Post by **TheWorid** » Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:09 am

FrankTrollman wrote: As rounds get shorter, the ability to have real world events occur goes away. The police have a response time. The cavalry have a response time. Everything has a response time. Poison has a progression time. Bleeding has a progression time. And so on.

A very good point. However, I wonder how movement should work in a long-round system; as was previously noted, it seems difficult to have interesting man-to-man tactical movement when you can easily move a great distance, dancing around threatened areas, in one turn.

IGTN · Post by **IGTN** » Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:44 am

TheWorid wrote:
FrankTrollman wrote: As rounds get shorter, the ability to have real world events occur goes away. The police have a response time. The cavalry have a response time. Everything has a response time. Poison has a progression time. Bleeding has a progression time. And so on.
A very good point. However, I wonder how movement should work in a long-round system; as was previously noted, it seems difficult to have interesting man-to-man tactical movement when you can easily move a great distance, dancing around threatened areas, in one turn.

The simple solution would be to make the squares larger, too. Turns are longer, but you're able to maneuver (and take AoOs into) a bigger space.

That, or get rid of squares entirely and go with something else.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Tue Feb 02, 2010 4:12 am

Give everyone a "maneuver" bonus. During the first round, everyone gets to "engage" everyone they want to. If you want to engage someone who doesn't want to engage you, make opposed maneuver rolls.

During combat, you can use a move action to attempt to engage another opponent, but take a penalty the more opponents you have already "engaged". Presumably you can disengage by a similar process. You can also spend an action to "cover" a specific ally, giving them +4 to evade engagement, or to "block" an enemy, giving him -4 to maneuvers.

Flying gives you a +4 to avoid engagement. Seriously. If they beat your maneuvers by 4 you can grab their wings or something and drag them down. If you have "good" maneuverability you can ignore interposing characters when rolling to engage. Similarly, between two flyers, higher maneuverability gives a +4 to engage or avoid.

You can declare use of a scenery piece as cover, but if you actively engage anyone who isn't using it, you forfeit your cover.

For long-range encounters, use similar rules to get from "close" to "long" range.

Mask_De_H · Post by **Mask_De_H** » Sat Feb 27, 2010 1:19 am

Aaand we're back!

Terrains:

To ensure victory, a warrior must first know their terrain. Each terrain falls under one of the elements and has a rank from 1-5. This rank determines how attuned to their personal element the terrain is. The more attuned it is, the more difficult it is to change the terrain to something else. Each terrain is composed of a range 1 area of effect centered on a node. Nodes can be denoted by chits, coins, or what have you.

Neutral:
1: Flatland
2: Roadblock(Low)
3: Pit
4: Roadblock(High)
5: Deadzone

Fire:
1: Hot
2: Desert
3: Fire
4: Lava
5: Inferno

Water:
1: Puddle
2: Swamp
3: Freezing
4: Depths
5: Tempest

Wind:
1: Breezy
2: Airborne
3: Crosswind
4: Gale Force
5: Typhoon

Earth:
1: Steppe
2: Mountainside
3: Tunnel
4: Mudslide
5: Earthquake

Lightning:
1: City
2: Lodestone
3: Clockwork
4: Thunderstorm
5: Hypergrav

Light
1: Sunshine
2: Brightness
3: Hallow
4: Noontide
5: Heaven

Dark
1: Dusk
2: Darkness
3: Unhallow
4: Witching Hour
5: Void

Terrain Effects:

Placed Into: Your character would be moved into the square containing the object.
Attack Past: Your attack draws line of effect through a square adjacent to the object that does not include the target.
Move Past: Your character moves into and out of a square adjacent to the object during movement.
Back To: Your attack "flanks with" the object.

Flatland
B No effect
A No effect
M No effect
P No effect

Roadblock(L)
B Attacker gets Combat Advantage
A Target gets half cover.
M Flying unhampered, charge bonus halved.
P Forced movement stopped in next square, Target falls prone.

Roadblock(H)
B Attacker gets Combat Advantage
A Target gets full cover
M Flying hampered, charge bonus halved.
P Forced movement stopped, target takes 1 damage per unmoved square and falls prone.

Pit
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage. Target can negate CA and attack by voluntarily falling into the pit.
A No effect. If target is adjacent to two or more Pit squares, attacker gains CA.
M Flying unhampered. Charge bonus halved unless character has [Acrobatic] tag on charge.
P You fall in.

Deadzone
B No effect
A No effect
M No effect
P All effects within and adjacent to the object are negated until leaving the space.

Hot
B No effect
A No effect
M No effect
P [Fire] tag enhance 1, [Water] tag weaken 1

Desert
B Target's Dex -1
A Ranged attacks -1 accuracy
M Flight hampered, Movement -1
P Take 1 [Fire] damage every two rounds within.

Fire
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, illuminates target.
A Target gains cover.
M Flying unhampered, charge bonus halved unless done with [Acrobatic] Tag.
P Take 5 [Fire] damage every round inside.

Lava
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target's Dex -2.
A No effect
M Deals 3 [Fire] damage per each square moved, Flight unhampered.
P Deals 7 [Fire] damage each round within, pushes 2 squares in determined direction.

Inferno
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target's Dex -2.
A Target gains full cover, [Water] tag attacks fail to work
M Deals 5 [Fire] damage for each adjacent square moved through, Strength Save or Fatigued.
P Deals 10 [Fire] damage each round within.

Puddle
B No effect
A [Lightning] tag powers travel along adjacent Puddle, Swamp and Depth tiles.
M No effect
P [Water] tag enhance 1, [Fire] tag weaken 1

Swamp
B Target's Dex -2
A No effect
M Flight hampered, Movement -2
P Movement is reduced by 1 every turn within.

Frozen
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target can negate by purposefully going prone.
A No effect.
M Flying unhampered, charge bonus halved unless done with [Acrobatic] Tag or Dex save vs. falling prone.
P Target falls prone.

Depths
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target cannot take retreat option.
A Target gets full cover unless attacker is also in Depths.
M Flying unhampered, cannot move into unless able to swim.
P Target makes Str check vs. falling unconscious unless able to breathe water.

Tempest
B Target's Will -2.
A Target gains partial cover if attacker is within Tempest, full cover if attack is outside.
M Movement -3, Dex save vs. being pushed back 3 squares.
P [Fire] tag fails to work, [Lightning] tag spreads to every connected Tempest square.

Breezy
B No effect
A No effect
M Flying movement +1
P [Wind] tag enhance 1, [Earth] tag weaken 1

Airborne
B No effect
A Attacker gains +1 to hit against groundbased targets.
M Flight only, if unable to fly, falls 5 squares per turn.
P Same as Move through

Crosswind
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage. Applies to Flying targets.
A Target gets half cover.
M Flying hampered, moved towards the Crosswind piece.
P Forced Movement stopped, target is flung three squares in a random direction.

Gale
B Ranged attacks -1 to hit.
A Target gets half cover.
M Flying make Dex save vs. being forced to the ground. Dex save vs. being pushed back to the outside of the effect.
P Forced Movement rerouted to along the direction of the Gale.

Typhoon
B Target's Dex -2
A Target gains partial cover if attacker is within Typhoon, ranged attacks fail if attack is outside.
M Dex save vs. movement stopped and being pushed back 5 squares.
P Forced Movement stopped, target flung 5 squares in a random direction.

Steppe
B No effect
A No effect
M No effect
P [Earth] tag enhance 1, [Wind] tag weaken 1

Mountainside
B Attacker gets Combat Advantage
A Target gains partial cover
M Flight hampered, Movement -2
P Anyone on this tile gains Combat Advantage against those not on Mountainside tiles

Cave
B No effect.
A No effect.
M Flying disabled.
P No effect

Mudslide
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target cannot take retreat actions.
A Target gets full cover.
M Flying unhampered, Str vs. movement stopped.
P Forced Movement stopped, target takes 5 [Earth] damage and is moved along the Mudslide's squares.

Earthquake
B Target's Dex -2, cannot move.
A No effect.
M Movement -3, Dex save vs. falling prone.
P Dex save vs. falling prone.

City
B Illuminates targets.
A No effect
M No effect
P [Lightning] tag enhance 1, [Dark] tag weaken 1

Lodestone
B Target's Dex -2
A No effect
M All movement -2
P Will save vs. losing a Swift action.

Clockwork
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage.
A Target gains half cover.
M Flying grounded, charge bonus halved unless done with [Acrobatic] Tag.
P Forced Movement stops, each round all adjacent targets take a 3 damage +1 [Neutral], [Lightning], or [Fire] attack.

Thunderstorm
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, target's Will -2.
A Target gets full cover unless attacker is also in Thunderstorm.
M Flying hampered, movement -2.
P Each round all adjacent targets take a 7 damage +0 [Lightning] attack.

Hypergrav
B Target's Dex -2
A Attacker must beat a soak of 5 in order to succeed.
M Flight stopped, movement -4, Dex save vs. falling prone.
P Forced Movement stopped, Dex save vs. falling prone, Dex -2, 10 damage done each turn.

Sunshine
B Target is illuminated
A No effect
M No effect
P Target is illuminated, [Light] tag enhance 1, [Dark] tag weaken 1.

Brightness
B Darkness effects negated.
A -1 accuracy
M No effect
P Adjacent [Dark] squares of equal or lower level negated, [Dark] type creatures take 1 wound every two turns.

Hallow
B [Dark] types take -2 Will.
A [Dark] types take -1 accuracy
M [Dark] type Flying hampered, charge bonus halved.
P Heal 1 wound every turn. [Dark] type takes 1 wound every turn.

Noontide
B Defender gains Combat Advantage.
A Target gets cover unless attacker is also in Noontide.
M Flying hampered, Will save vs. blindness.
P Adjacent [Dark] squares of lower level negated, Will save vs. blindness.

Heaven
B Defender gains Combat Advantage.
A Target cannot be damaged.
M No effect. [Dark] types Will save vs. stopping at the edge of effect.
P No damage taken. [Dark] types Will save vs. banishment.

Dusk
B Attacker's accuracy -1
A Target gains half cover.
M No effect
P [Dark] tag enhance 1, [Light] tag weaken 1

Darkness
B Attacker's accuracy -2
A Target gains full cover.
M Flight hampered, Movement -1
P Must guess what square target is in to hit. Gain Combat Advantage for attacks against those not in Darkness square.

Unhallow
B [Light] types gain -2 Will.
A [Light] types gain -1 accuracy
M [Light] type Flying hampered, charge bonus halved.
P [Dark] type heals 1 wound every turn, take 1 wound every two turns.

Witching Hour
B Attacker gains Combat Advantage, [Light] type Will -2.
A Target is invisible
M Flying hampered, Will save vs. stopping inside.
P Adjacent [Light] squares of lower level negated. Target makes Will save vs. losing action. [Light] types take 1 wound every level.

Void
B Target's Dex -2, and can't take retreat option.
A Attack must beat soak of 7 to succeed.
M Dex save vs. stopping.
P Adjacent squares negated, Forced Movement stopped, Dex vs. banishment.

For Valor · Post by **For Valor** » Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:46 pm

TheWorid wrote:
FrankTrollman wrote: As rounds get shorter, the ability to have real world events occur goes away. The police have a response time. The cavalry have a response time. Everything has a response time. Poison has a progression time. Bleeding has a progression time. And so on.
A very good point. However, I wonder how movement should work in a long-round system; as was previously noted, it seems difficult to have interesting man-to-man tactical movement when you can easily move a great distance, dancing around threatened areas, in one turn.

To be perfectly honest, I don't think time should be brought up by anything past 12 seconds. Battles that we watch are very unrealistic in that the cavalry is usually late unless they were camped out right next to the battlefield, and police always come after the fight is finished (following the trends of both reality AND movies here). The whole bomb-ticking-down thing... well, bombs could go off in a minute, which isn't very much time and would make for a decently tense combat (if you're fighting someone a little stronger than you).

I understand the combats can happen damn fast, but making a round something even like 20 seconds is just ridiculous. I was thinking 10 seconds per round, making a 1-minute combat 6 rounds, or 15 seconds--so 1-minute combats could be 4 rounds. THEN things would be tense. And you might even get lucky and have the police come!

Mass combat is probably going to have ridiculously long rounds... but we're not getting to that yet, I don't think.

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:49 pm

It should just be a function of how long you want combats to last and how many rounds you want them to be. With due consideration for our stupid system of time.

For Valor · Post by **For Valor** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:14 am

Would we also have to modify movement speeds based on the roundtime, too? I mean, speeds work out normally in the 6-second round time for D&D, so making the rounds longer would make speeds work out to be a little more, wouldn't it?

IGTN · Post by **IGTN** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:52 am

For Valor wrote:Would we also have to modify movement speeds based on the roundtime, too? I mean, speeds work out normally in the 6-second round time for D&D, so making the rounds longer would make speeds work out to be a little more, wouldn't it?

The numbers in feet, yes. The numbers in squares, not necessarily.