The Story of BattleTech: What's wrong with it?

[Stahlseele]

i like the stuff of Pawel Czarnecki better, but for a webcomic, that would be overkill and completely unfeasible . .
While that really basic stuff would be pretty much perfect for a webcomic i think . .

[magnuskn]

I have no idea what's going on in this thread.

Eh, it drifted into old territory.

We were discussing what was keeping BattleTech from being a roaring success. Someone took a swipe at me for not apologizing publicly for doubting TPTB at CGL could get TRO:3085 out.

And like a fool, I bit.

Then Clutch Cargo comes along and starts in with his babbling and before you know it, I am unloading on him. And he earned every bit of it. Just, this wasn't the plce for it. The event is seven years gone and to be honest, I have forgiven the man for what he did - then, and today.

I apologize for de-railing the conversation and the thread.

I'm sorry, guys.

But - you know? Clutch is another reason the game is not a roaring success. What is wrong with BattleTech? Well, one thing is the hubris of the High Priesthood, those heads having been turned by fanboy worship. The game goes from what is essentially an enjoyable hobby into Ego Food for a select few - and a mansion for certain others.

And people accept it. It's normal. There are certain players who don't want to upset the applecart, not because there's nothing going on, not because the game might disappear, but because if they did, they might not get their turn.

The same thing which led Coleman to loot the company is what led Clutch to his downfall. It's behind every cold shoulder, every snooty gamer who looks down his nose at you and quotes from some obscure House Handbook... and snorts when you don't immediately agree. Or sneers at your unpainted minis or your tattered fourth-hand rulebooks. Or greets your rules questions with uncomfortable silence.

It's the same thing that breaks up established gaming groups over seemingly petty squabbles, the thing that makes it so darned hard to stay the course when making good product in the company or even just organize a game down at the local shop.

Man, am I happy that my two roleplaying groups are composed of nice, reasonably sociable people. It took me about six year to find two groups of good people and players, but I got there. Nothing more uncomfortable than playing with persons who are assholes.

That said, most German BT players I have interacted with in the last ten years are reasonably nice and okay. Most of them, anyway. Although I have mostly kept to the north... there have been some strange people further down south. ^^

Everyone likes that art style. That's why it was sold so well and defended.

-Crissa

Watch Macross Frontier. That's art from the original creators.

[Stahlseele]

there have been some strange people further down south. ^^

What did you expect?
Everything south of the Elbe is Bavaria after all *snickers* ^^

[magnuskn]

there have been some strange people further down south. ^^

What did you expect?
Everything south of the Elbe is Bavaria after all *snickers* ^^

True enough. Hamburg forever!

[Centurion13]

there have been some strange people further down south. ^^

What did you expect?
Everything south of the Elbe is Bavaria after all *snickers* ^^

True enough. Hamburg forever!

You two stop it! I actually had to go get a map of Germany to see what the hell you were talking about. Where are you guys living now, anyway?

The strength of BattleTech, and the only thing which can go seriously 'wrong' with it are the players. I have seen players working with 3025 tech who are perfectly happy. Others are piloting twenty-ton 'Mechs. They are happy too. Still others are pirates operating the latest in stolen tech while trying to find the Green Ghost. Funny - they're happy too!

It is the Game Master who organizes the play and conducts the scenarios with a careful hand who will, in the end, make or break the game. The company and its employees who think they are the ones in charge? are just along for the ride.

Cent13

[Stahlseele]

You two stop it! I actually had to go get a map of Germany to see what the hell you were talking about. Where are you guys living now, anyway?

Make me! :P ^^
I'm living in Hamburg, Germany.

[Centurion13]

You two stop it! I actually had to go get a map of Germany to see what the hell you were talking about. Where are you guys living now, anyway?

Make me! ^^
I'm living in Hamburg, Germany.

You're rotten, you hear? You've just dissed 80% of Germany - most of it is south of the Elbe.

Ahhh... Google Maps. I bet I could find your street and tell you the color of your car.

Cent13

[TheFlatline]

The strength of BattleTech, and the only thing which can go seriously 'wrong' with it are the players. I have seen players working with 3025 tech who are perfectly happy. Others are piloting twenty-ton 'Mechs. They are happy too. Still others are pirates operating the latest in stolen tech while trying to find the Green Ghost. Funny - they're happy too!

It is the Game Master who organizes the play and conducts the scenarios with a careful hand who will, in the end, make or break the game. The company and its employees who think they are the ones in charge? are just along for the ride.

Cent13

I'll add an addendum to that. The game is not going to change mechanically, and the plot is meandering enough that if you don't like what's happening now you can go back in time and play something else that you do like.

That means that the two things that will make or break BT is, as you said, the community, but also it's marketing.

And CGL sucks a fat pile of crap when it comes to getting their presence out in the gaming market.

[magnuskn]

You two stop it! I actually had to go get a map of Germany to see what the hell you were talking about. Where are you guys living now, anyway?

Make me! ^^
I'm living in Hamburg, Germany.

You're rotten, you hear? You've just dissed 80% of Germany - most of it is south of the Elbe.

Ahhh... Google Maps. I bet I could find your street and tell you the color of your car.

Cent13

Meh, they're dissing us, too, so it's all in good fun.

[Stahlseele]

You two stop it! I actually had to go get a map of Germany to see what the hell you were talking about. Where are you guys living now, anyway?

Make me! :P ^^
I'm living in Hamburg, Germany.

You're rotten, you hear? You've just dissed 80% of Germany - most of it is south of the Elbe.

Ahhh... Google Maps. I bet I could find your street and tell you the color of your car.

Cent13

It's good to be the King . . eh, rotten ^^
And no, you are talking about bavaria. Germany is north of the Elbe *snickers*
And yes, you probably could, it's Rennbahnstraße . .
But i don't own a car, so nya to that *grins*

[Centurion13]

Make me! ^^
I'm living in Hamburg, Germany.

You're rotten, you hear? You've just dissed 80% of Germany - most of it is south of the Elbe.

Ahhh... Google Maps. I bet I could find your street and tell you the color of your car.

Cent13

It's good to be the King . . eh, rotten ^^
And no, you are talking about bavaria. Germany is north of the Elbe *snickers*
And yes, you probably could, it's Rennbahnstraße . .
But i don't own a car, so nya to that *grins*

Nearer to Tribunenweg? Or Am Husarendenkmal? Does Spielhaus Horner ring a bell?

Ach! The more I look at the maps, the more I realize just how big the world is. I could live my entire life in Hamburg and never want for anything and walk every day and still never see it all.

Which is why taking over a planet with a handful of 'Mechs seems silly. They would get swallowed up without a trace in Germany, never mind the world.

Cent13

[Stahlseele]

Corner Rennbahnstraße and Rhiemsweg.
Tribühnenweg is close enough though.
Also: No, they would not get lost in germany.
We would capture and reverse engineer them.
Probably improve upon them while we're at it.
German engineering baby!
Just think about it . . Battlemechs made by Thyssen-Krupp!
Or BMW. Or Hekler and Koch. Or any other of the better known names.
*sigh* well, probably better if it did not happen, else we'd be on a new crusade to distribute the metric system and 24 hour clocks/army-time all over the world . .

[Centurion13]

Corner Rennbahnstraße and Rhiemsweg.
Tribühnenweg is close enough though.
Also: No, they would not get lost in germany.
We would capture and reverse engineer them.
Probably improve upon them while we're at it.
German engineering baby!
Just think about it . . Battlemechs made by Thyssen-Krupp!
Or BMW. Or Hekler and Koch. Or any other of the better known names.
*sigh* well, probably better if it did not happen, else we'd be on a new crusade to distribute the metric system and 24 hour clocks/army-time all over the world . .

Too late, my watch tells me it's 1830 - time to make dinner.

Cent13

[Clutch9800]

Back on track.

Why do people think that the Jihad is "increadible"?

Clutch

[Juton]

Back on track.

Why do people think that the Jihad is "increadible"?

Clutch

The reasons I've heard are generally that they go from being a minor faction to annihilating large parts of the inner sphere in the span of a few months. I think if you look over what they actually did, you'd see a bunch of stealth attacks using WMDs, and using their intelligence networks and communications to trick nations into believing crap. Prima Facie though it looks like another Clan Invasion, a mysterious super-powerful faction comes out of nowhere and kicks ass, the first time it's novel, the second time it's stupid.

[magnuskn]

Back on track.

Why do people think that the Jihad is "increadible"?

Clutch

The reasons I've heard are generally that they go from being a minor faction to annihilating large parts of the inner sphere in the span of a few months. I think if you look over what they actually did, you'd see a bunch of stealth attacks using WMDs, and using their intelligence networks and communications to trick nations into believing crap. Prima Facie though it looks like another Clan Invasion, a mysterious super-powerful faction comes out of nowhere and kicks ass, the first time it's novel, the second time it's stupid.

Especially since the Wobbies are a known entity. For all that Clans were presented as super-powerful, we didn't know which kind of assets they had. The Wobbies were former ComStar, so them pulling incredible caches of supertech out of their asses, which all the other half of ComStar apparently didn't know did exist, is ridiculous. And don't get me started on them being Clan Wolverine.

[Juton]

Especially since the Wobbies are a known entity. For all that Clans were presented as super-powerful, we didn't know which kind of assets they had. The Wobbies were former ComStar, so them pulling incredible caches of supertech out of their asses, which all the other half of ComStar apparently didn't know did exist, is ridiculous. And don't get me started on them being Clan Wolverine.

To be precise the Word of Blake/Comstar hid Clan Wolverine on one of the forgotten worlds. They where there own entity. But it is so spectacularly anticlimactic how they used the Wolverines, to think that 20 years of obscure references and hints yielded a footnote in a story-arc most Battletech players want to forget.

If WoB somehow completely subsumed Comstar the Jihad would have been much more believable, to have the most cunning faction go to one of the weakest and most inept with no exposition is completely disappointing.

[Kithkanan]

The TRO did in fact hit the stree... well, the internet, anyway. It has yet to be in dead-tree format, but who knows?

I like how you backpedal so well. Hard copy is for sale at GenCon.

[/img]

[magnuskn]

Especially since the Wobbies are a known entity. For all that Clans were presented as super-powerful, we didn't know which kind of assets they had. The Wobbies were former ComStar, so them pulling incredible caches of supertech out of their asses, which all the other half of ComStar apparently didn't know did exist, is ridiculous. And don't get me started on them being Clan Wolverine.

To be precise the Word of Blake/Comstar hid Clan Wolverine on one of the forgotten worlds. They where there own entity. But it is so spectacularly anticlimactic how they used the Wolverines, to think that 20 years of obscure references and hints yielded a footnote in a story-arc most Battletech players want to forget.

If WoB somehow completely subsumed Comstar the Jihad would have been much more believable, to have the most cunning faction go to one of the weakest and most inept with no exposition is completely disappointing.

Do I remember correctly one of those "forgotten worlds" being smack dab in the Hesperus system? You know, the one system with Hesperus II in it?

And I don't see WoB subsuming the rest of ComStar. The people who stayed in ComStar were the ones who explicitly didn't like all the pseudo-religious hoo-ha the Wobbies loved so much. Unless by subsuming you mean "completely wipe out". ^^

[Crissa]

Maybe it was forgotten like you forget about Palmdale or Milpitas.

-Crissa

[Centurion13]

The TRO did in fact hit the stree... well, the internet, anyway. It has yet to be in dead-tree format, but who knows?

I like how you backpedal so well. Hard copy is for sale at GenCon.

[/img]

And yet you still have not PMd me for my addy. Don't want your apology in person?

Heh.

Cent13

[Clutch9800]

The TRO did in fact hit the stree... well, the internet, anyway. It has yet to be in dead-tree format, but who knows?

I like how you backpedal so well. Hard copy is for sale at GenCon.

[/img]

And yet you still have not PMd me for my addy. Don't want your apology in person?

Heh.

Cent13

You know,

Why don't you just follow through with what you said you'd do and take some pictures.

Then post them.

You could also just man up and say, "Wow, they actually did it. Well, I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again."

But you'd have to have some balls to do that, and not just be a fucking kook.

Clutch

[magnuskn]

I like how you backpedal so well. Hard copy is for sale at GenCon.

[/img]

And yet you still have not PMd me for my addy. Don't want your apology in person?

Heh.

Cent13

You know,

Why don't you just follow through with what you said you'd do and take some pictures.

Then post them.

You could also just man up and say, "Wow, they actually did it. Well, I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again."

But you'd have to have some balls to do that, and not just be a fucking kook.

Clutch

Says the guy who began here posting incomprehensible BS gibberish.

[Centurion13]

Says the guy who began here posting incomprehensible BS gibberish.

Ha!

Clutch =

[Clutch9800]

Says the guy who began here posting incomprehensible BS gibberish.

Can you provide an example of this incomprehensable BS? Because most of my posts are full of wisdom.

Clutch