American Sniper Fappers

infected slut princess · Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:43 am

Wasn't Chris Kyle killed by his PTSD buddy? Didn't that buddy have PTSD because he participated in one of America's dumbest wars, murdering kids and stuff? Didn't Chris Kyle say "“No son of a bitch was breaking into my house and living to tell about it"? Isn't that sort of like what Iraq's anti-occupation fighters were thinking? But then doesn't the double standard make Chris Kyle morally tone deaf and hypocritical when he says all the Iraqis were just evil savages? Are people who fap to Chris Kyle (like Glen Beck who said going to American Sniper film was like going to church) totally fucked in the head? These are interesting issues to think about.

Ancient History · Post by **Ancient History** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:50 am

People that like American Sniper are totally fucked in the head because the movie is a dramatic re-enactment of a fucking documentary. It doesn't have a moral message, it doesn't have an ethical message, there is no real character arc or transformation. Chris Kyle was an exceptionally skilled soldier that went through a traumatic conflict in a high-stress role, and the stress of that role was also felt by his friends and family - but it was neither a paean to the conflict or a condemnation of it, it just was. There was no emotional payoff to the events because they're just the facts of his life. There's no narrative to it.

hyzmarca · Post by **hyzmarca** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:18 am

People who real political messages into it are utterly failing film criticism 101.

A cursory look at Eastwood's later directorial filmography will show that the dude is rather fascinated by the mental and emotional impact of war on the soldiers who fight in it, and that his work tends to be balanced and without political motivation.

Eastwood directed both Flags of Our Fathers and Letters from Iwo Jima, after all.

Hell, off the top of my head Million Dollar Baby, Gran Turino, Mystic River, and motherfucking Bridges of Madison County tend to be about how people deal with the emotionally painful shit in their lives, more than a conflict between good guys and bad guys.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:59 am

Of all the things to point out about Chris Kyle, the most obvious one should be that he's a liar.

http://mpmacting.com/blog/2014/7/19/tru ... chris-kyle

Count Arioch the 28th · Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:22 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsZMbs5PC64

Shrapnel · Post by **Shrapnel** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:30 am

Generally, whenever a movie comes along that's all about how great the American military is, and how awesome our wars are, I usually take that as a sign that said movie is bullshit.

erik · Post by **erik** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:43 am

Thanks for that article Maj. I didn't know anything about the American Sniper bidness other than that it had done well in theatres lately and that was quite informative.

Cynic · Post by **Cynic** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:15 am

I don't really see how anyone can call Eastwood a balanced and neutral purveyor based on his entire (or even recent) body of directorial work. Aside from "Flags of our Fathers" and "Letters from Iwo Jima", I'm pretty sure all his movies have a political message. They don't all match up with each other but they do exist.

I suppose that if you look at all his movies together, you can say that he's balanced because movie A leans to the left and B leans to the right and C does something else. But if you are judging the movie based on its political merit, I'm pretty sure "American Sniper" probably does have some bent to it. Since I haven't seen it, I can't tell you what the bent is but it's a dramatic movie meant to be a tearjerker so there will probably be some political message.
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ACOS · Post by **ACOS** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:22 pm

Bradley Cooper laid it out in a couple of interviews:
to the effect of "this isn't a political film; the point of this character study is a demonstration that these people are coming home and need/deserve our help".

In that respect, the film stands on its own. Let it be.

Cynic · Post by **Cynic** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:00 pm

ACOS: That's an admirable and good sentiment from the actor in the movie but the creator of the film has a larger role in determining what the movie means. IF Eastwood gives it a different meaning or does something else then it does lay at odds wiht what Cooper thinks the movie should do.

That's also another telling point, it is a creative work and can definitely be interpreted in multiple ways. It all ends up with who shouts their interpretation louder.

DSMatticus · Post by **DSMatticus** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:34 pm

Chris Kyle was a pathological liar, a racist, and a vigilante-wannabe who enjoyed fantasizing about murdering criminals (particularly brown ones trying to find food in the wake of natural disasters, it seems). If you think "but the Iraq War veterans are real victims" excuses the glorification of Chris Kyle, then I'm just going to fucking remind you that racism and vigilantism also have victims and you're a piece of shit for forgetting that those people exist. Chris Kyle is not an appropriate subject for a story meant to evoke empathy for our undersupported veterans, and polishing that particular fucking turd so that you can hold it up as a shining symbol of 'MURICA is straight-up harmful propaganda. The fact that Fox News latched onto it as a way to push their nationalistic groupthink bullshit really should have put your skepticism glands in overdrive.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:41 pm

So in other words, he was a real person?

You're not going to find an appropriate subject that ticks off all the boxes that apparently need ticking and is some saintly figure because those people don't actually exist. Most people are assholes in some way, some worse than others.

DSMatticus · Post by **DSMatticus** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:07 pm

Yeah, I guess you're right. We all lie about shooting those dirty brown people, don't we? I mean, it'd just be so awesome to start murdering people from the rooftops of a flooded New Orleans as they look for food. Who could you possibly find that wouldn't want to do such a thing? Who? What a saint of a man one would have to be to lack such urges!

Surgo, have what is quite possibly the sincerest fuck you I've ever said on these boards. Fuck you. It is not actually appropriate to suggest racists or people who boast loudly (and thankfully falsely) about committing murder are merely your everyday variety of asshole. Asshole is a term more appropriate for minor things, like accidentally suckering yourself into telling an internet forum that being a racist shitbag with vivid fantasies of committing murder that you routinely boast as reality is a completely ordinary character flaw. Surgo, asshole; Chris Kyle, shitbag.

Korgan0 · Post by **Korgan0** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:26 pm

Remember the Nazi propaganda film that was a plot point in Inglorious Basterds, about the dude killing all those Americans? That's basically what American Sniper is. Pure and simple. The only difference is American Sniper throws a few sots to the presence of PTSD in the military; beyond that they're both jingoistic propaganda films used to legitimate and further the cause of imperialism and neo-colonialism.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:05 pm

Surgo wrote:Most people are assholes in some way, some worse than others.

I think you missed the point. This guy is basically Hitler levels of bad, except without power. So yes, pick literally any other veteran alive or dead, and chances are, even if that guy was a confederate solider who owned slaves, that Chris Kyle would be the "worse than" in that comparison.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:06 pm

I just sort of assumed - given both Kyle and Eastwood's history - that the movie was essentially a modern Western with a bit of venue alteration to reflect where the fighting is taking place. That's never really been my genre.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:29 pm

hyzmarca wrote:People who real political messages into it are utterly failing film criticism 101

I guess it's a good thing you never graded my papers then. What Eastwood intends for his movie is not the only thing his movie can communicate nor is it the only thing worthy of discussion. The film is certainly a character study but the fact that it is willing to set aside the politics of warfare to such a degree says a lot about the relationship many Americans have with our military.

ACOS · Post by **ACOS** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 6:10 am

leave it to sheep to deride the sheepdog

Mistborn · Post by **Mistborn** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 2:28 pm

ACOS wrote:leave it to sheep to deride the sheepdog

You know it's always disheartening when a fellow Denner outs themselves as a horrible person. Get over yourself, there are no barbarians at the goddamn gates and this is the safest time in human history.

MfA · Post by **MfA** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 2:38 pm

ACOS wrote:leave it to sheep to deride the sheepdog

Just for the record, do you think there is a conspiracy which contributes the Superbowl and gas station shooting to him, do you think they really occurred or what?

nockermensch · Post by **nockermensch** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 5:36 pm

ACOS wrote:leave it to sheep to deride the sheepdog

It's remarkable how the author decides to ignore all the times the sheepdogs take a sheep by a wolf. I guess all the discomfort, pain or even deaths caused by sheepdog failures of judgement don't count.

DSMatticus · Post by **DSMatticus** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:52 pm

I wish I could say I was surprised that ACOS has turned out to be a total shitbag, but I still remember the time he posted that watermarked image macro from a website that turned out to be all about how awesome "masculinity" is, where masculinity meant beating the shit out of people for disrespecting you and keeping your woman in the kitchen.

But what I don't actually get is... why Chris Kyle? Shooting dozens of "looters" from the rooftops of New Orleans would not put you amongst society's defenders, it would put you amongst society's mass murderers. Lying about shooting "looters" from the rooftops of New Orleans does not make you a brave vigilante, it makes you a lying braggart who is desperate to have everyone around you acknowledge how totally badass you are. You can't beat your dick to Chris Kyle's heroism, because in Chris Kyle's fantasies he is a villain. You can't beat your dick to Chris Kyle's "manliness", because attention-whoring with a bunch of lies about how your life is an action film is straight-up pathetic. I seriously don't fucking get it. Is Robert Lee Yates one of those brave sheepdog? Is Manuel Pardo? Daniel Pantaleo? George Zimmerman? What, exactly, makes your manpanties drop? Is it the uniforms? Is it vigilantism? Is it murdering the underprivileged? Or is it - and I think it is - a shallow infatuation with the bravado?

infected slut princess · Fri Jan 23, 2015 8:25 pm

Lord Mistborn wrote:
ACOS wrote:leave it to sheep to deride the sheepdog
You know it's always disheartening when a fellow Denner outs themselves as a horrible person. Get over yourself, there are no barbarians at the goddamn gates and this is the safest time in human history.

You're all horrible people. Get over yourself.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 11:04 pm

People who want to see a good film about the American soldiers as victims of Iraq and the heartbreaking effects of PTSD should watch In the Valley of Elah.

Warning: It will crush your soul. But it is very good.

infected slut princess · Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:01 pm

Orion wrote:People who want to see a good film about the American soldiers as victims of Iraq and the heartbreaking effects of PTSD should watch In the Valley of Elah.

Warning: It will crush your soul. But it is very good.

Oh yeah. My heart is breaking. "Soldiers as victims of Iraq." Give me a break. Why should we feel sorry for people who got PTSD because they killed little kids? The volunteer soldiers of the American Empire are just too stupid and morally demented to understand that they are doing nothing justified in their service of enforcing the empire's will. All the while killing kids. Anyone who joins the American military is an idiot.

That movie blows.