FrankTrollman wrote:There are 591 spells in the 3.5 Player's Handbook alone. Now I'm willing to accept that a lot of those spells should go away, but there are also a bunch of spells that should be introduced from other sources as well. And that's not even counting the "non-spell" abilities that D&D hands out now and again.
Putting up 120 abilities for each of 5 class lists and another 120 abilities for a universal list isn't even hard.
Where it starts getting hard is when you start dividing up abilities. I mean seriously, how many "Barbarian" abilities have ever been printed?
-Username17
No, it's not hard.
It is however annoying to have to look at.
It is however harder to present to other groups or people that don't go here, and I think that we'll have to do that, since the people on TGD don't all play in the same campaign or even game together at all.
The way that feats were presented in Dungeonomicon and RoW was excellent. I was able to show that material to people who not only didn't know a thing about optimization, but also tended to not want to play certain character classes or even have full on fears in real life about other classes; play the specific classes that they would previously never touched, simply because you and K wrote up them up in a simple and easy to present fashion.
The first case is a monk, played by someone that has pretty much only played characters covered in armour with big weapons, or played big monsters whenever given the chance. His actual selection of monk was a bit of a surprise to most of the group, but he really took to it; leaping around and punching for Con damage.
The second is a girl that has a severe fear of clowns, who played a jester. Clowns still freak her out, but having played a character that wore clown's face paint might have helped. I didn't find out about this fear until a long while afterwards.
I've had an other case where a player who simply cannot understand mathematical optimization (they've told me that it makes them feel confused to see numbers, whatever I can't see angles right when I draw) was able to easily make a character simply because they picked options that "made sense" for their half-elf barbarian character (horde-breaker, blitz, juggernaut, blind figthing; wear adamantine armour, use a greatsword).
I know that 120 abilities could be written for 5 different classes; but I hope that it's not necessary. Mostly because it will be hard to sell a class with such a long list of options.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
Judging__Eagle wrote:whatever I can't see angles right when I draw
Angle detection is one of the things that he human visual system is worst at. Aside from right and flat angles.
Totally unrelated to the thread, but that's why measuring stuff out or actually using a physical reference is so vital to getting perspective and 3D appearance right in art.
Strengths & Weaknesses
Every class has a defined strength--something like "mobility" or "battlefield control" that they're especially good at--and a two weaknesses, which are essentially the opposite. A few classes may have two strengths and four weaknesses.
...
Strengths & Weaknesses
...
The following are proposed as things the universal list can do well, and which can therefore be used as "strengths" for a class, but not as "weaknesses":
Consistent Melee Damage
Consistent Ranged Damage
Spike/"Set-Up" Damage (e.g. sneak attack)
Speedy Movement (but not the ability to reach places you couldn't otherwise)
Personal Defense
The following are proposed as things that can be either strengths or weaknesses (these might still show up on the universal list, but only at a "weak" level):
Horde-Fighting (lots of weak enemies)
Hero-Slaying (small number of powerful enemies)
Area/Group Defense
Battlefield Control
Alternative Movement (climbing, flying, teleportation, etc.)
Healing / Reversing Enemy Effects
Coercion / Limiting Enemy Behavior
Action Denial
Level Thresholds "You must be at least this tall to break the game."
Certain kinds of powers have a major impact on tactics or the world as soon as they show up, and thus cannot necessarily be scaled down to all levels. The following describes one possible progression for these effects.
Note that the number of levels in the game is essentially arbitrary, so I'm going to assume a ten-level progression for discussion purposes. One could fluff out the numbers throughout, or add extra levels after the end (when everyone has everything), without fundamentally affecting the progression.
Level 1: There are AoE attacks, but it isn't expected that everyone has them, and you probably can't get one if your weakness is horde-fighting. Some people can conceal themsevles in the middle of a combat, but can't actually fight while doing so. Specialists can bypass appropriate barriers (bruisers can kick down doors, tricksters can pick locks, etc.). It is expected that every PC has a decent ranged attack.
Level 2: Mobility specialists get flight (or similar effects), and can attack while using it, but it's inherently unstable and hitting them with any attack has a good chance of grounding them.
Level 3: Everyone has AoE if they want it. Most people have at least one trick for getting past obstacles (shatter walls, jump over, short teleport, etc.)
Level 4: Controllers can trap people in cages that take a while to get out of if you don't have a suitable counter, but anyone can get out. Personal defense specialists start getting effects like incorporeality that make them invulnerable to many opponents, but they can't contribute to the battle (even indirectly) while using them, except for things like scouting.
Level 5: Some people have stealth that remains effective while they're actually fighting, but it always has some drawback to its use, and the stealth isn't perfect. All PCs are expected to be able to initiate melee with flying opponents, though this may involve super-jumping, teleport-and-grapple, or sucking an opponent down to you rather than actually flying yourself.
Level 6: Some people can "snipe," attacking from so far away that unless you can snipe or have a relevant mobility power, you're pretty much going to have to break off and re-engage later. No one can do this from the air.
Level 7: Personal defense specialists can aid allies while using incorporeality or similar hard-to-counter defenses, but their actions are still very limited and they can't attack directly. All PCs are expected to excel with at least two completely different forms of attack, or have special abilities making their primary attack extremely difficult to counter.
Level 8: Fliers are pretty stable, and you need a specific counter to bring them down.
Level 9: Many people can throw down narrow but arbitrary defenses, such as immunity to temperature or to metallic weapons. It is expected that you'll often have to try two or three things against an opponent before you find something effective.
Level 10: PCs are all expected to have a full suite of counters for standard effects. You have to do something genuinely surprising to seriously screw someone in a fair fight.
I suggest leaving the specific power sources for later. Since every class is to be able to support the 4 standard fantasy archetypes "bruiser, trickster, blaster, and support" it will be easiest to create a simple system for generating balanced classes.
It will require creating the automatic list (things which each character gets as he levels) and the "weak", "normal" and "strong" power progressions for each of the "specialties" defined by Manxome.
Of course, the universal specialties:
Consistent Melee Damage
Consistent Ranged Damage
Spike/"Set-Up" Damage (e.g. sneak attack)
Speedy Movement (but not the ability to reach places you couldn't otherwise)
Personal Defense
will have only "normal" and "strong" versions.
With those progressions defined, it will be possible to create a class by simply picking a strong progression, two weak progressions, and optionally changing the flavour of powers. A character gaining a level will get the abilities from "automatic list" and will be able to select powers from any of the "specialty" list appropriate for his class. If a class has strong Battlefield Control specialty, a character can select level-appropriate powers from the strong Battlefield Control list.
With this, we will have a functioning game and the benchmark for all further classes. It will be possible to create more complicated classes, monsters etc by starting with those lists and creating something of equivalent power.
Last edited by baduin on Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:41 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Monsters can actually afford to skimp on much of the automatic list. A fire golem, for example, has no need for the ability to speak or sneak around. He's just sitting there burning away guarding the serpent blade until someone sneaks past him or beats him up.
But regardless, it occurs to me that the automatic list can be bigger than you might think. We can, and should, give people a set of "weaknesses" - hooks and such that they have to assign. And so some people can take the "weakness" that they are blind or illiterate or whatever, and in that way the automatic list can be expanded to include things that everyone at the table except one guy has.
But of course most of the weaknesses are going to be things like family members and criminal records whose primary contribution to the game is plot hooks.
FrankTrollman wrote:
But of course most of the weaknesses are going to be things like family members and criminal records whose primary contribution to the game is plot hooks.
-Username17
I'm guessing that things like....
Physical Dysfunctions
Sterile: You can't have kids. Don't ask. STDs can still get you of course, so make sure you're using Mage Crotch Armour. This will keep you from being able to do certain things that are related to procreation; like creating a lineage or forging a successful marriage.
Blind: No visual acuity. That's it.
Psychological Dysfunctions
Narcissitic: You're a selfabsorbed asshole. You get a penalty to your social interaction checks equal to how powerful you are.
Hedonist: You spend your money on useless shit. Pork snouts in gravy; whores, magical crack. Any temptation of physical pleasure will always have you follow it.
Social Limitations
Significant Other: You trust someone enough that they share your personal space while you are sleeping. You are also at a penalty if anything happens to your Sig other.
Royalty: You has a land. If Lolrus hordes invade in the search for bukkits, you must defend your land. This serious defending of land is serious.
Criminal: Bounty on your head. You can't say your name in public and expect to remain safe. People/Bounty Hunters/Sith Lords can attack and kill you and not have to hide or expect or worry about legal reprecussions; or the fact that they're bad guys to begin with.
Note: Some clever players that trust each other can do stuff like pick up Significant Other and Hedonist and declare each other as their Significant Other. Which is good, because you'll follow your fellow Spartan soldiers instead of the that vile Elven temptress Leg-of-lass. Other times you'll drops your weapons, pounce each other, begin stripping each others armour off and try to consumate your relationship when a succubus drops a Lust Bomb on the party. This second case would effectively remove both of you from combat. Until you finish, or can otherwise disengage yourselves. Even then you'll probably only be able to pick up your sheilds and weapons, armour taking too much time to put back on.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
Regarding level thresholds, I had something that divided them somewhat more finely than just "at level X, ability Y comes online."
Every tactical ability (eg Invisibility, Flight, Incorporeality; not an "ability" in the game-rules sense, more of a set of them) had three separate level thresholds, called Phase 1, Phase 2, and Phase 3, for now.
At and before Phase 1, few if any counters exist, but that's fine because before Phase 1 nobody has it anyway, and in Phase 1 it's only available to specialists and very tightly limited. Your Ninja's Phase 1 Invisibility would, essentially, be an invisibility-themed dodge/attack prevention and/or bonus damage; you can't maintain it for very long, and it doesn't have a major tactical effect. Those with countering this tactic as one of the things their class is good at might have counters.
In Phase 2, nonspecialists get it, the specialists get a better version (the Ninja might be able to stay invisible for longer than one round at a time, for instance), and everyone gets the ability to counter it, with effort. The counter is automatic; you cannot choose not to be able to counter the ability. "Effort" might cost you an action to counter for the whole battle, but it still is a real cost.
In Phase 3, specialists move on to something else and everyone can counter with low effort; defeating an ability in this phase costs less than an action, and one in a class good at defeating this ability should be able to defeat the ability for free.
How this might look, for a Ninja, Elementalist, and Paladin with Invisibility. The Paladin can never turn invisible, but is good at countering invisibility. The Elementalist is neutral on both, and the Ninja specializes in using invisibility, but only neutral at countering it (there is nothing worse than neutral for a counter, because being bad at a counter means you aren't a viable character).
In Phase 1, the ninja can turn invisible in a very limited way. It might be for a full round (begins at beginning of turn, ends at beginning of next turn), or it might be until the next end of the ninja's turn (either end); the Ninja also can't do this very often, probably not two rounds in a row (a cooldown, but one that people can remember easily).
In the latter case, the Ninja then has two mutually exclusive abilities: no targeted attacks on me until my next turn starts, a defensive ability, or an offensive/mobility power by turning invisible, running past someone and stabbing them in the back for bonus damage. In the former case, the Ninja has both at once. They might start with the latter case and then gain the former halfway through as an upgrade. They might also have to spend something on this.
The Elementalist can't really do anything about this. Maybe he can try to AoE the hiding ninja or passive AoE the attacking ninja. Mostly, though, he targets someone else when the ninja is hiding.
The Paladin might have a Holy Sight ability that gives him +senses and the ability to detect invisibles, when he uses it actively. It is, however, usually a bad tactical decision.
In Phase 2, the Ninja can remain invisible for longer (maybe two rounds out of every 3), and the Elementalist can learn to cast Visage of Air, which makes him look like a mass of normal air, effectively invisible. The Paladin still can't turn invisibile. His Holy Sight, however, is cheap to use.
The Elementalist also has a spell that lets him see invisible creatures; associating it with the elements is left as an exercize for the reader. The Ninja has a sneezing powder that he can blow over an area, allowing him to locate invisible creatures by hearing, or an ability to close his eyes and access some form of shadowsight or superior ninja hearing (with an action) to make fighting invisible enemies possible, but (somewhat) more costly than visible.
In Phase 3, the Ninja's needs to replace his invisibility with something else. Maybe he can become incorporeal now or something. This is because countering it is practically irrelevant. The Paladin's Holy Sight always lets him see invisible creatures without trying, the Ninja doesn't need to see to melee just fine (or something similar), and can take a support action (move or minor, in 4E terms) to make range easy, and the Elementalist is forced to use Circle of Lighting People on Fire so that he can see invisible enemies before he uses Instant Crispy-Fry and Zappinate to kill them like he normally would. He doesn't care, because CoLPoF is a good spell, just, against most things he'd want to use ICF on, not as good a tool as ICF; invisibility is a mild inconvenience that forces him to use a slightly weaker attack spell before he unloads the good spells; in D&D3 this would be casting, for instance Fireball to set someone up for your Disintegrate, except with less suck.
You then assign each tactic three levels, one for Phase 1, one for Phase 2, and one for Phase 3, make sure everyone and their ankheg have phase-appropriate counters, and then don't add any more after your finished designing without also establishing counters and giving them to everything in the world (or tacking them on at the top of the level scale, so that nothing that already exists needs to counter them).
I don't think that abilities of this sort should ever have to be removed. Even if adventurers have mandatory defenses against this sort of thing by a certain level, characters are still going to be occasionally facing lower level characters and of course monsters (who have less diversity in their abilities), against whom such abilities may still matter.
While the D&D concept of trading away low level ability slots for small stacking bonuses that unite to become Devastator is, I think we can all agree, bad, people having lower level abilities that are not of a tremendous amount of use against enemies of the same power and diversity as themselves is fine. It's good for continuity of character concept and it's good for making the higher level abilities seem good. If our Paladin in this example got always-on Holy Sight only to find that no one bothered to turn invisible under any circumstances anymore, that would be pretty sad.
If, on the other hand, one might still be expected to fight Sirrush (who had no ability to see invisible enemies and were at a substantial disadvantage when facing such), the Paladin gets to feel somewhat special. Every so often someone would use invisibility to beat the snot out of a some monster in the Paladin's vicinity, but he personally has Holy Sight so that never happens to him.
Of course these abilities shouldn't have to be removed; continuing the Invisibility example, the Ninja doesn't lose the ability to turn invisible just because he hit the Phase 3 level; it just becomes next to useless against most things his level. A high-level ninja fighting a horde of mooks will stab them all in the face and never even be seen.
Of course, it's not completely useless; my envisioning of these powers has CoLPoF as an area damage-over-time that also reveals invisible enemies; an Elementalist who uses it will be behind on damage-dealing, slightly (If they use it on round 1, they might have, by round 3, done 2.5 times the normal per-round damage output of their single-target blasting spells). Still, yes, it is mostly useless against level-appropriate enemies; that's kinda the defining point of Phase 3. This already happens in D&D3, just not very well (Ghost Step brings us into Phase 1, Greater Invisibility into Phase 2, and Permanent See Invisible or Arcane Sight into Phase 3. Of course, only the wizard gets to benefit, but such is D&D).
The Paladin gets a bit of specialness as suggested because, if an enemy decides to turn invisible (which should be cheap, to match the suck, at that level), he can smite them straight away with powerful single-target shots; the Elementalist has to spend an action on lighting them on fire first. Designing things so that he occasionally sees his invisible Ninja buddy stabbing things to death is a bit more complex, but doable.
High-level monsters that are likely to fight alone or in groups of like kind need all of these; if the Ninja is capable of staying invisible for an entire battle (this should be possible in mid-to-late Phase 2), even if they have to burn longer-term resources to do it, then a Ninja fighting your Sirrush kills it without necessarily taking damage, depending on how hard it is owned by invisibility.
This could be fixed by giving monsters circumstantially variable challenge ratings. The Sirrush might have a CR of "it eats you. If it doesn't, that's because of DM fiat or significant circumstantial advantage; award EXP accordingly" if your level is less than the Phase 2 point for invisibility; it has a CR equal to the Phase 2 point for Invisibility if your level is greater than it and it is alone. Finally, it has a third CR somewhere above the Phase 3 point if it is part of a balanced group of monsters where the others can deal with invisibility; the Sirrush can be killed by going invisible, but the Demon next to it knows where you are, so half the party has to distract the demon while the Ninja guts the Sirrush like a fish. PCs should still probably get all of the counters.
Of course, if you have a CR 24, under ideal circumstances (no invisibility or spotter) Sirrush and a CR 15 spotter, the Sirrush needs yet another CR (probably just borrow its spotter's), because the fight should be balanced on the expectation that the party will kill the spotter, then everyone who can will go invisible and cast invisibility spells on those who can't, and then kill the now (effectively) blind Sirrush.
The variable-CR system also solves the problem of people liking to make monsters like the Devastation Vermin that you can strafe/bomb to death at level 9 but that have CRs upwards of 30 because you're expected to melee them like an idiot; Devastation Vermin are CR 30+ if you can't fly (whether because you're too low level to fly, or in a low-ceilinged cave, or wherever) or if they have someone/thing with them, appropriately leveled, to deal with flyers (if average people can become more powerful by forming large groups, then you might have, say, a Devastation Centipede with a pack of archers on its back, as a viable high-level monster). The question left is "is the ability to have tactically incomplete monsters, to keep abilities occasionally relevant even in their Phase 3, worth the added complexity of including rules for monsters with variable challenge ratings (and possibly scaring off DMs)?"
Another option is to simply not include Phase 3 for abilities that are iconic to certain classes. If the game goes up to 10 and Invisibility has Phase 1 at level 3, Phase 2 at 7, and no defined Phase 3, then the Ninja's invisibility never becomes obsolete.
Significant Other: You trust someone enough that they share your personal space while you are sleeping. You are also at a penalty if anything happens to your Sig other.
However, Tree Fort and Wood Shape are awesome powers.
Tree Fort – Tree becomes a tower.
Wood Shape – Carpentry carpents itself
Oh lord, Improved Apoptosis – Creatures dissolve, is horrible.
I`m assuming that (Rain of Jaguars – Holy crap, why?!) can be changed to any other forest feline. I have a personal preference for tigers, flavourfully b/c they look cool, and mechanically b/c they kill lions.
How does picking up an ability work? That`s the real question.
Is there a tier? Do we pick up any and they scale as you level or what?
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
So, lets create the Automatic list of abilities. Those are the things that each characters has to get - no choice about it, but they are generally weaker than the freely chosen powers.
If we're going to have a "Narakan powers list", a "Pretalokan powers list", a "Yaman powers list", a "Tiryagyonian powers list", and an "Asuralokan powers list", it stands to reason that the 'universal' powers list should be the "Sumerian powers list".
In a generic game they can be "colorless", which bucks the Magic status quo, but works out nicely.
[Edit]
As far as the standard attacks, we also probably want to have damage type tags (which are factored into the damage roll rather than the attack). Attack rolls aren't level-based, so using that instead of an attribute won't work very well.
Last edited by CatharzGodfoot on Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Judging__Eagle wrote:How does picking up an ability work? That`s the real question.
Is there a tier? Do we pick up any and they scale as you level or what?
Most people seem to favor scaling abilities (or at least most of the people who bothered to answer the question in this thread). The description given in the OP specifies scaling abilities, but a few have minimum level requirements or the like for arbitrary effects (like flying) that we don't want to show up until a certain point, or for things that just can't be made to scale all the way from 1 to X for random reasons.
Nice list, Frank. Some of those look like strictly out-of-combat abilities, and a few obviously have overlapping flavor, but you can also see how it'll be easy to subdivide many of those based on specific mechanics if we want. For those who don't feel like counting, there are about 120 powers on that list.
Judging__Eagle wrote:Tree Fort – Tree becomes a tower.
Wood Shape – Carpentry carpents itself
Tree Fort works well with Instant Tree too.
Also, "Instant Tree - A Tree"? Hilarious.
Yeah, the combat utility of an ability is almost completely dependent on its casting time. Instant tree could be a great combat ability if it works like a tree token. Otherwise, it's pure utility. Similarly, the tree fort.
And an unrelated question: is there a reason "field of ears" was chosen instead of "the tree have ears"?
Last edited by CatharzGodfoot on Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
FrankTrollman wrote:
[*] Crossbreeding – Create new beasts by combining others in unusual ways.
[*] Monster Making – As crossbreeding, but beasts are extremely dangerous.
Say what?
I'm intrigued but unless you have a sackful of restrictions or rock solid beast-making mechanics this looks like disaster in the making.
Honestly Sigma, what the hell do you think?
It will probably be based on creating creatures that are X-Y power level creatures; where X is your power level, and Y is a suitabley low enough value compared to your power level.
So, in Tome 3.5 it's probably you can combine creatures whose EL if put as an encounter is your CR-4. For both you either take the superior ability score of either creature, or the average ability score of each creature. Special features of either creature are in the resultant creature.
The animals one lets you mix animals to create new animals, the monster one lets you mix magical beasts or animals to create magical beasts.
On a related note, Frank, I'm sure that I speak for nearly everyone when I say that the list you've written is hilarious and interesting.
Also, Frank, please don't answer Sigma's request until you feel like it.
Nothing disparaging about either your writing (obviously) or Sigma's request (perhaps less obvious, but just as true), it's that you're doing most of the heavy lifting on TNE, and I doubt that you churning stuff out while balancing school is going to be good with respect to your energy levels.
The rest of us are pretty much sitting in ditches shoving pinecones up our noses with respect to contributions to TNE. Well, not really, but we're not really contributing that much to TNE aside from what we greedily or misguidedly think that we want in it. I'm sure that the encouragement that we give is good, but you've obviously got your own ideas and direction for where you want to take TNE.
I'm also sure that most of the Denners want TNE as much as I do (some more, some less, but that's expected, we're not binary creatures), but you burning out before it's done is worse than you taking your time and writing when you have the time and energy.
If you do work as hard as possible and burnout inevitably happens, you'll probably stop for a while to recuperate from over-writing burnout. Possibly even abandoning the TNE project. Which is worse than you just taking your time and writing at your own pace.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
Wraith Sight – The character can see as if animal spirits were flames that cast light into darkness.
Power of Darkness – The character can replenish their personal power points when he sun sets.
Available Powers
Attenuation – Life is depressed in the area.
Bane Blade – Attack causes withering.
Banefire – Withering spectral fire burns past and future.
Biting Strike – Attack burrows into living creatures.
Bitter Pill – Curse heals target at unfortunate cost in nausea.
Black Arrow – Arrow becomes lethal and black.
Body Double – Witless flesh sculpted into the likeness of a living person.
Bone Distortion – Bones get lost and forgotten in the shuffle.
Bone Grinding – Bones fix together and grate themselves apart.
Bone Shards – Weapon attack sends flakes of bone as additional projectiles.
Bone Spirit – Bones are animated by a yappy spirit under limited control.
Chains of Lamentation – Metaphorical regrets drag target down literally to the floor.
Charon's Due – Coin is lost, target dies.
Children of the Night – Ghosts of children brought from shaded lands.
Chill Touch – Melee attack chills victim, drinks.
Compel Spirit – Spirit is coerced to perform 4 tasks.
Corpse Explosion – The recently dead become unidentifiable. The living become recently dead.
Cruelty Beyond Measure – Wounded victim wracked by agony. Family members injured.
Crush of History – Target is slowed and suffers the ravages of time.
Dark Matter – Black shapes crush foes.
Dark Void – A mighty wind hurls things into a gaping black crevasse.
Decay – Target rots away to dust.
Decrepify – Victims are weakened and their hair becomes brittle and white.
Defile Lineage – Close relatives of the target are defiled.
Depths of Despair – Abject misery precludes action.
Desert Walk – The very land turns to dust and there is naught to drink but dust.
Destiny Bond – Two targets suffer each other's wounds.
Devouring Darkness – Light is snuffed out as are the lives of small creatures.
Draw Back Shroud – Space is rended and the Shaded Lands leak into the world.
Dust to Dust – That which is dead dies anew.
Enervation – Strength is lost.
Enfeeblement – Coordination is lost.
Entropy Whistle – A silent, yet uncomfortable sound precipitates the dissolution of things in the area.
False Life – An inanimate object forgets that it is not alive.
Fetters of Bone – Black lines attach themselves to the bones of the target, holding them fast.
Fetters of Tears – The target believes that they cannot and should not move.
Finger Darts – You rip your fingers off and transform them into deadly black bolts that flense victims from their souls. The fingers lost in this way grow back when the sun next sets.
Finger of Death – Pointing at the victim ends the victim.
Forces of Darkness – Spirits from the shaded lands fade in to join your army.
Forgetfulness – All that is important is lost.
Gateway to Oblivion – A rift appears and pours entropy and decay forth like oil from a jar.
Gaze of Contempt – Victim is struck by meekness and stuttering.
Ghost Bargaining – The services of ghosts can be purchased with milk, copper, and bread.
Ghost Grab – A spectral hand rends the soul of a target.
Grasping Darkness – Light is extinguished and the shadows themselves hold fast.
Gravedirt – The ground sends up a cloud of dust that chills to the bone.
Great Gibbering – The soil reverberates with a meeping and chortling that drives men to madness.
Grim Proceedings – The blood is cooled and emotions lay forgotten.
Grim Ward – The recently dead are conscripted to protect their final resting place.
Guided Vengeance – Weapons seek the lives of those who have killed.
Hand of Death – Your melee attack ends lives.
Harvest Misery – Misery is stolen from the target, improving their condition and giving you power.
Horror of Horrors – Worse than you could imagine.
Howl from Beyond – Attacks are instilled with spectral might
Imprisonment – Victim cast into Naraka.
Invoke Vetalas – Wicked monkey ghosts are drawn to you.
Iron Maiden – Target's joints are tacked together.
Leeching Darkness – Life fades within a clinging darkened region.
Legion of the Damned – You make an army of the long dead.
Lingering Wretchedness – Target is befuddled and does not heal.
Liquor of Torment – Agony is distilled into a delightful and potent beverage.
Malaise – Meaninglessness pervades large area.
Mark of Loss – Symbol is branded into target that seals target away from knowledge of themselves.
Methodical Dismemberment – You hack an enemy to pieces with great deliberation.
Nether Darts – Shining bolts from the shaded lands fly towards living targets.
Nightmare – The world of reality is forgotten.
Ominous Silence – Sound is devoured. Panic spreads.
Ominous Wind – Slight breeze puts out all fires, panic spreads.
Oppression – A rune is emblazoned in the sky, everything falls.
Ossify – Flesh turns to bone.
Patchwork – Body parts are put together to make a serviteur.
Pestering Spirit – Spirit heckles foes.
Pound of Flesh – Chunks of enemies are removed.
Price of Failure – Stance curses those who miss you.
CatharzGodfoot wrote:Yeah, the combat utility of an ability is almost completely dependent on its casting time. Instant tree could be a great combat ability if it works like a tree token. Otherwise, it's pure utility. Similarly, the tree fort.
And an unrelated question: is there a reason "field of ears" was chosen instead of "the tree have ears"?
I'm not sure on the timing, but I see it pretty much as: "Hey look, over there. Some mean people."
Instant Tree, Tree Fort. Climb into tree. Start shooting.
At that point, it doesn't have to be tree token fast to be useful, as long as you can get it up relatively quickly.
Kaelik wrote:I'm not sure on the timing, but I see it pretty much as: "Hey look, over there. Some mean people."
Instant Tree, Tree Fort. Climb into tree. Start shooting.
At that point, it doesn't have to be tree token fast to be useful, as long as you can get it up relatively quickly.
What I'd like to see is a system where you have the option of shifting utility powers, at appropriate levels, to combat powers. Instant tree is probably only ever useful if it's fast, but spending a day to make a tree fortress is fine at low levels, and it's neat if you can transition from that to doing it as a single combat action.
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Also: is "personal power points" a placeholder or a serious mechanic?
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Finally, I'm still not sure exactly how the spheres are divied up. Is this reasonable?
Asuraloka:
[*]Ancient Arsenal – A weapon recovered from the God War
[*]Call of Cthulhu - Dreams of the Deep
[*]Chain Lightning – Everybody knows what this does
[*]Control Water – You animate and control a body of water.
[*]Control Weather – Make it rain, make it shine; calm or call up the winds
[*]Great Shout – You channel your rage into a wild yawp, shattering reality
[*]Storm of Vengeance – Category 5
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And does everybody get a special overlapping sensory power?
virgileso wrote:Frank, is there a particular method/theme to each list you're making, particularly in regards to 'role protection'? Full-on curiosity here.
Your role is adventurer.
Your class determines what flavour of powers that you use, not your place in the party.
You decide that based on your powers selections.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
Judging__Eagle wrote:
Honestly Sigma, what the hell do you think?
It will probably be based on creating creatures that are X-Y power level creatures; where X is your power level, and Y is a suitabley low enough value compared to your power level.
So, in Tome 3.5 it's probably you can combine creatures whose EL if put as an encounter is your CR-4. For both you either take the superior ability score of either creature, or the average ability score of each creature. Special features of either creature are in the resultant creature.
The animals one lets you mix animals to create new animals, the monster one lets you mix magical beasts or animals to create magical beasts.
Honestly thinking that, no matter what best intentions and math genius are at work, some goober is going to put Monster A and Monster B together and get a fucking Tarrasque.
Base Encounter Level of the combined creatures has to be your CR - Y. If the baseline is Your CR-4, it won't be a big deal. Ever. Since everything you make would be smaller than you. Doesn't mean that if you make a bunch of CR 2 or 3 (would have been two CR 1 monsters) monsters at level 7 won't be handy.
Really, the simpler the system the better. Since the Tarr has tons of unique abilities, those can't ever be bred.
.... this would allow the creation of Tigons though. Which is cool.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
