Anyway, if I was going to be really generous, I'd translate that behavior into the desire that we put together write-ups of how crazy you have to get before a True Necromancer becomes vaguely playable rather than just writing it off as impossible.
Of course, I think that point is severely undermined by the fact that every single example posted by multiple different contributors of how you could come up with a True Necromancer that wasn't that bad - was also illegal. Often in several different ways.
It's one thing o pull out Flaws, which we all know aren't balanced (hell, none of the people posting flaw builds even mention what the flaws are actually going to be - the assumption is that you'll just pick something you don't care about). But even that kind of base hand-waving wasn't enough to post even a competiive build - they required hand waving like Precocious Apprentice and Southern Magician that don't work to try to get into the class.
The fact is that if you play the TN as written or intended - it sucks. In order to make a good True Necromancer you need your DM to rewrite the class progression or the class prereqs, or possibly both. Which is fine. As written there aren't any good Necromancer PrCs - we find ourselves suggesting that prospective Necromancers take War Mage or Loremaster because they are raw powerups of Wizards in general - not because they have any particular synergy with Necromancy. If a competent DM is running a home game, they'll probably work something out with the player to make a necromancer PrC that the player gives a damn about.
Obviously, people don't like that answer. That there is nothing anywhere in the tens of thousands of pages of official D&D material that is a prestige class that makes your wizard into a better necromancer - not even classes that actually have the word "Necromancer" in their title. People don't like it, but it's the truth. I don't know what else we could tell them.
I'm starting to think that we should do a Handbook of Necromancy (as opposed to a Necromancy Handbook) in order to create decent PrCs, feats, spells, and options for Necromancers.....basically all the things that Libris Mortis should have been.
Yeah, I'm thinking that a Tome of Necromancy needs the following sections:
1. An "update" of the Dread Necromancer that is viable for 20 levels.
2. Some Prestige Classes that are decent for a Wizard or Cleric Necromancer.
3. A collection of uniquely Arcane Spells of levels 1-4 that allow a Wizard to be viable in the mastermind school of necromancy at low and medium levels.
4. Some feats that anyone gives a damn about as a necromancer.
5. Some new rules that cover fix some of the deep stupid like high-end Rebuking. For starters, Turn Resistance shouldn't count against the maximum hit dice of control - Turn Resistance is something you should want to put on the undead you control. But also the control limits need to get much larger at higher levels.
6. Some methods of becoming Undead that are functional within the level system. That is, allow people to be a vampire or a mummy without crippling their character. Also front loading the part where you become undead and backloading the powers. I'm perfectly willing to play a vampire who doesn't turn into gas as a get out of death free card, but I'm not willing to play a vampire dsciple that has a charming gaze and isn't dead.
7. A complete restructure of the undead type so that it does what people want it to do - no more "vampires can't run" bullshit or "liches are mindless" - that's retarded. Specters have no constitution and can't run - we're fine with that. Skeletons have no Intelligence and can't be charmed - we're fine with that too. But damnit, Dracula has a mind and a body, and he can run and be affected by Sympathy - any rule that forbids that is a bad rule and needs to be over hauled.
8. Some pro- and anti-undead equipment that anyone gives a damn about..
9. Some new monstrous stuff that are usable. This is a good place to put in a "seige template" that can be used to make zombie turtles into seige engines without having to get really specific. It's also a good place to put in what people really want - low level unintelligent undead that are individually comptent. Something that you can kill without feeling bad that is somewhat threatening in anything other than the most contrived scenarios.
Maybe stuff like a Druid Necromancer, who would be different from a cleric Necromancer since it's less about undead domination and more about setting up a cool swamp domain with ghosts and will-o-the-wisps and zombies, and spending all the damn time ranting about how nature and civilisation both totally lack any respect for the non-living, non-dead creatures. Perhaps ending with some sort of undead type for the druid himself.
Boulie_98 at [unixtime wrote:1144571405[/unixtime]] Maybe stuff like a Druid Necromancer, who would be different from a cleric Necromancer since it's less about undead domination and more about setting up a cool swamp domain with ghosts and will-o-the-wisps and zombies, and spending all the damn time ranting about how nature and civilisation both totally lack any respect for the non-living, non-dead creatures. Perhaps ending with some sort of undead type for the druid himself.
This sounds really cool. Add some minor mind control and curse magics to give the class a voodoo flavor and you're set.
-Desdan
Don't bother trying to impress gamers. They're too busy trying to impress you to care.
Desdan_Mervolam at [unixtime wrote:1144603126[/unixtime]]
Boulie_98 at [unixtime wrote:1144571405[/unixtime]] Maybe stuff like a Druid Necromancer, who would be different from a cleric Necromancer since it's less about undead domination and more about setting up a cool swamp domain with ghosts and will-o-the-wisps and zombies, and spending all the damn time ranting about how nature and civilisation both totally lack any respect for the non-living, non-dead creatures. Perhaps ending with some sort of undead type for the druid himself.
This sounds really cool. Add some minor mind control and curse magics to give the class a voodoo flavor and you're set.
-Desdan
Make it Troll's favored class, and I'm sold.
"Stay away from da voodoo!"
In this moment, I am Ur-phoric. Not because of any phony god’s blessing. But because, I am enlightened by my int score.
