The Gaming Den

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:14 pm**

ok, so dispite college having a reputation for having intelligent people, I'm not seeing it.

Maybe one of the intelligent people on here can explain to me, why do people care about preteens and teenagers knowing about sex(without having to be taught it) and having sex(with each other, I will not pretend there is no problem with adults having sex with pre-teens, especially in cultures with artificially low intellects in "children")

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:39 pm**

Why do I care? Well it has to do a lot with brain development in human beings. (Something I learned from NPR in of all things a report on why the US is the only state that has a penality of life without parolle for minors.)

"Adolescence is a critical time for brain growth. Significant intellectual processes are emerging. Adolescents are moving from concrete to abstract thinking and to the beginnings of metacognition (the active monitoring and regulation of thinking processes). They are developing skills in deductive reasoning, problem solving, and generalizing."

Teenage Brain: A work in progress

While this work suggests a wave of brain white matter development that flows from front to back, animal, functional brain imaging and postmortem studies have suggested that gray matter maturation flows in the opposite direction, with the frontal lobes not fully maturing until young adulthood. To confirm this in living humans, the UCLA researchers compared MRI scans of young adults, 23-30, with those of teens, 12-16.4 They looked for signs of myelin, which would imply more mature, efficient connections, within gray matter. As expected, areas of the frontal lobe showed the largest differences between young adults and teens. This increased myelination in the adult frontal cortex likely relates to the maturation of cognitive processing and other "executive" functions. Parietal and temporal areas mediating spatial, sensory, auditory and language functions appeared largely mature in the teen brain. The observed late maturation of the frontal lobe conspicuously coincides with the typical age-of-onset of schizophrenia—late teens, early twenties—which, as noted earlier, is characterized by impaired "executive" functioning.

Another series of MRI studies is shedding light on how teens may process emotions differently than adults. Using functional MRI (fMRI), a team led by Dr. Deborah Yurgelun-Todd at Harvard's McLean Hospital scanned subjects' brain activity while they identified emotions on pictures of faces displayed on a computer screen.5 Young teens, who characteristically perform poorly on the task, activated the amygdala, a brain center that mediates fear and other "gut" reactions, more than the frontal lobe. As teens grow older, their brain activity during this task tends to shift to the frontal lobe, leading to more reasoned perceptions and improved performance. Similarly, the researchers saw a shift in activation from the temporal lobe to the frontal lobe during a language skills task, as teens got older. These functional changes paralleled structural changes in temporal lobe white matter.

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:48 pm**

This still doesn't explain why it's supposed to be a big deal that teens and pre-teens already know about sex, or why it's supposed to be a big deal that they're having sex with people in their own age group. Nature and Evolution made us such that we sexually mature ~age 11.

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:02 pm**

Knowing about sex is a completely different thing. When I was in 6th grade I was allowed to watch a movie at school with my father. Then we were also allowed to see the girl's movie which honestly was much better in terms of information than the boy's movie.

At the time my reaction was mostly yuck. Learning about sex too early doesn't cause any one harm. But please note that one of the web pages I was looking at indicated that children of that age can only absorb so much information at any one time.

And actually it is not nature and evolution. It's a healthy diet. Puberty was considerably higher before the advent of the 20th century vitamin enriched diet. In areas where food is scarce or food quality is poor, puberty is significantly higher than it is in the developed countries.

Shock and horror to anyone other than MJH who would probably be telling people "I told you so." According to this webpage on babyreference.com "Two factors proven responsible for precocious puberty are detached parenting and consumption of cow's milk."

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:20 pm**

Prak_Anima at [unixtime wrote:1203533339[/unixtime]]This still doesn't explain why it's supposed to be a big deal that teens and pre-teens already know about sex, or why it's supposed to be a big deal that they're having sex with people in their own age group. Nature and Evolution made us such that we sexually mature ~age 11.

Because sex is taboo, and many parents don't want to think that "My baby daughter is going out with that boy! I hope that he doesn't take advantage of her!"

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:27 pm**

Because when children "know" about sex, or unicorns, or negroes, or whatever and they learned that from other children there is no guaranty that this information is in any way accurate. Sex is really dangerous. You can catch diseases, you can get pregnant. You can ruin or even prematurely end your life. And if you think you know how it works because some guy whose nickname is "Cheddar" told you during a marathon tehterball session; you don't know shit.

Yes, people in modern life sexually mature at an average age of about 11. But that's nutritional. When we were evolving in Africa we reached sexual maturity at age 15. And while you can get pregnant at age 11 or even 8, you don't reach normal adult size for years and carrying a pregnancy to term at that age is physically life threatening.

---

Yes. Children should know how sex works. And children will have sexual games and experimentation at a young age. And if you don't tell them anything they'll figure out the basics on their own because instinct is pretty hot shit.

But we live in a world with HPV and Gonorrhea. We live in a world where it takes 20 years of training to perform most high end job functions. We live in a world where high protein diets and environmental analogues cause children to be biologically capable of getting pregnant before they are biologically capable of passing a fully grown fetus through their hips.

Sequestering children away from sexual information is not a possibility. But it is legitimately alarming that children are learning about sex from each other and acting on this potentially dangerous information without supervision or input from nominally wiser people.

-Username17

Posted: **Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:46 pm**

Prak_Anima wrote:This still doesn't explain why it's supposed to be a big deal that teens and pre-teens already know about sex, or why it's supposed to be a big deal that they're having sex with people in their own age group. Nature and Evolution made us such that we sexually mature ~age 11.

Not quite true. There is a relatively new theory that states that a girl attains sexual maturity when she reaches a weight of 100 pounds. Advances in nutrition and medicine has meant that as a species we tend to grow larger, and more quickly. This results in earlier ages of puberty, faster than at any time in human history. So although this increased rate of growth is 'natural,' it is new. So, as a culture we have not prepared ourselves or our children for such an early onset of adolescence.

I did a quick search and couldn't find any good online sources. If anyone has any new information on this research, I would appreciate a link.

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 3:29 am**

Also, apparently, delaying responsibilities and education - like driving, driver's ed, sex ed, and sexual awareness - apparently does not insulate one from or lower the dangers of driving or sex.

It merely means the dangers come either earlier (and therefore more deadly) because of ignorance, or later (and then still a problem) because the danger is still present in those activities.

-Crissa

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 7:53 am**

I've always heard that it was cholesterol levels that lowered the age of puberty. Something about cholesterols being the building blocks of hormones and getting lots of them early allows large-scale hormone production earlier in life.

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:32 pm**

Crissa at [unixtime wrote:1203564567[/unixtime]]Also, apparently, delaying responsibilities and education - like driving, driver's ed, sex ed, and sexual awareness - apparently does not insulate one from or lower the dangers of driving or sex.

No but having said that it is important to note the developmental stage of the person and the environmental factors that sourround that person. Driver's ed is a perfect example; my gut feeling is that the biggest problem is to seriously convince young drivers that just like we needed to get good ways to convince that drinking and driving is a big no no, so too is driving and texting.

I know a lot of people with 16 year olds (especially girls) fall victim to accidents caused by not paying attention due to sending or receiving text messages. This goes back to the problem of frontal lobe development.

(On second thought perhaps I shoud not be worried about the potential problems of texting while having sex. I mean what really could possibly go wrong?)

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 7:33 pm**

Text messages take longer to type in as opposed to talking to the person on the phone. For some reason, they remain all the rage, so they will be a teenager's greatest enemy.

Consider a following example:

Teenager 1: *Dials cell phone to talk, not text messaging"

Teenager 1: "Hi, Stacy!"

Teenager 2: "Why didn't you send me a text message?"

Teenager 1: "Because it would take too long, and I'd rather hear from you personally."

Teenager 2: "Ohmigawd, can you get any more lame?"

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 9:02 pm**

Only if you inisit on using the English language.

Even then, from my brief encouter with twitter I could wip out a message in less than a minute. If I used text speak like my cousin's 15 year old probably under 10 seconds or less. In short before they answer the phone the message would be sent and delivered.

Posted: **Thu Feb 21, 2008 9:27 pm**

Driving is simultaneously the most boring and dangerous activity that I do on any regular basis, and I've gone rock climbing and sky diving in the last year in addition to having moved through the public education system and spent <8 straight hours coding in assembly.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:01 am**

Frank wrote:Because when children "know" about sex, or unicorns, or negroes, or whatever and they learned that from other children there is no guaranty that this information is in any way accurate. Sex is really dangerous. You can catch diseases, you can get pregnant. You can ruin or even prematurely end your life. And if you think you know how it works because some guy whose nickname is "Cheddar" told you during a marathon tehterball session; you don't know shit.

Speaking as a parent-soon-to-be and a woman who helped raise her two younger siblings after their father died, I'd like to add that there's a point where you want your kids to just be able to be kids and not have to worry about stuff like STDs and pregnancy.

A good education on sex should help kids realize the major responsibility and problems that go along with catching something and/or being a parent so that sex isn't just something you do to be cool or have fun.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:27 am**

I've known 'about sex' since around age 7.
Not from my parents, no. They tried to shelter me. I learned from them that talking about sex openly gets you targeted for punishment.

I learned from dirty little boys in elementary school.
Perhaps that's where officials and parents should be looking to educate kids.
And not in an ethical sense, but with a bare facts. Nothing is more disgusting to me than watching children spout conservative nonsense about marriage and fidelity when their own parents witheld info on how intercourse, sperm and eggs form new humans.

Gods bless those old textbooks, I really would have been lost without them.
Learning how to control urges and actually get sex took until highschool, though.
Perhaps that's where the focus should be?
How to do courtship rituals, choosing a match, challenge rivals verbally and not with guns or murder-by-car, and how to handle breakups.

The Count would benefit a LOT, among many others here!

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:34 am**

Sigma wrote:Learning how to control urges and actually get sex took until highschool, though.
Perhaps that's where the focus should be?
How to do courtship rituals, choosing a match, challenge rivals verbally and not with guns or murder-by-car, and how to handle breakups.

If kids are learning about sex before they're teenagers, then that would indicate to me that they need to know this stuff before high school.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:36 am**

They are learning the Wrong Things.
They should be learning the Right Things.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 4:34 am**

Learning about sex causes teens to not have it, thus preventing unwanted teen pregnancies.

Our birth rate is low enough. Stop destroying America!

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:05 am**

Probably true, K.
Just educate kids with pictures of common venereal diseases and say "This is sex in Baltimore. With or without a condom. Be careful and very, very picky."

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:09 am**

On driving, over here in Vietnam they finally started to enforce motorcycle helmet laws (which constitutes probably 80-90% of all transportation) and traffic fatalities have dropped 50% The down side? Girls are not as fun to look at with helmets on.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:17 am**

sigma999 at [unixtime wrote:1203660322[/unixtime]]
Just educate kids with pictures of common venereal diseases and say "This is sex in Baltimore. With or without a condom. Be careful and very, very picky."

Over here, cigarette packets have pictures of smoking-related lung/eye/heart/mouth/whatever conditions. I'm not sure it's actually dissuaded people.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:54 pm**

But they certainly avoid the packets that warn about erectile disfunctions.

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:19 pm**

Bigode at [unixtime wrote:1203688492[/unixtime]]But they certainly avoid the packets that warn about erectile disfunctions.

Ever notice how they have many more adverts for erectile dysfunction on TV during the sports events and chick flicks?

Posted: **Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:52 pm**

SunTzuWarmaster at [unixtime wrote:1203629252[/unixtime]]Driving is simultaneously the most boring and dangerous activity that I do on any regular basis,

You should try some of the New York parkway systems, most of the ones in Long Island have been expanded and are no longer as senic or exciting as they once were, but a few upstate are still wonderfully windy. There is a parkway in Connecticut that still has overhanging trees.

Posted: **Sat Feb 23, 2008 1:51 am**

Koumei at [unixtime wrote:1203679078[/unixtime]]
sigma999 at [unixtime wrote:1203660322[/unixtime]]
Just educate kids with pictures of common venereal diseases and say "This is sex in Baltimore. With or without a condom. Be careful and very, very picky."

Over here, cigarette packets have pictures of smoking-related lung/eye/heart/mouth/whatever conditions. I'm not sure it's actually dissuaded people.

Ah, we have that too. It hasn't changed anything.

The Gaming Den

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