Little help...

[angelfromanotherpin]

Is there a list of non-core classes that make the grade? And explanations for how to make them do so if it's not obvious?

I know about the Beguiler, which needs no explanation. I also read good things about the Dread Necromancer, though I don't know any of the details, like how the 'unlimited healing' thing works. Any others people have good experiences with?

[Juton]

The obvious ones are:

Archivist - Learns any divine spell
Artificer - Can make any magic item
Favoured Soul - Spontaneous Cleric
Psion - Best psionic class

There are others, depending on how broadly you define 'make the grade'.

[koz]

The obvious ones are:

Archivist - Learns any divine spell
Artificer - Can make any magic item
Favoured Soul - Spontaneous Cleric
Psion - Best psionic class

There are others, depending on how broadly you define 'make the grade'.

Ummm, no. The only thing on that list that makes the grade is the archivist. The reasons are quite simple: the artificer and favoured soul suck for protracted game periods before winning the game in every orifice (for the artificer) or becoming somewhat marginally decent (for the favoured soul). As far as the psion goes, it uses a system which is basically 'I can't believe it's not magic' to not achieve anything particularly interesting or meaningfully different to magic. In fact, only something like a half-dozen unique psionic effects have been identified ever, which means that as a psion, you're playing a weird form of sorcerer.

[Mask_De_H]

Beguiler, Warblade, Dread Necro (take something like Tomb Tainted Soul or something that gets you "healed by negative energy spells" and touch yourself constantly) are the big three.

Artificer is shit until about level 7, where it breaks the game in a myriad ways. Archivist is a Cleric with a shittier base chassis, but learns divine spells like Wizards (i.e. if you want a bullshit spell early, you can get it if it's on the Pantysniffer Domain or something.) Favoured Soul is to the Cleric as the Sorceror is to the Wizard: a hit in power, but can still get by. I have no fucking clue about Psionics.

The Binder has some neat tricks, and is basically a more fanciful melee guy until you get Karsus. Those sort of make the grade. If you can slog through Magic of Blue, the Totemist is worth it if you go melee and make a charge build or find a way to get precision damage and use Manticore Belt (making you a worse flask-thrower Rogue).

[Username17]

There's a reasonably coherent discussion on what "the grade" entails on the D&D Wiki.

-Username17

[PhaedrusXY]

As far as the psion goes, it uses a system which is basically 'I can't believe it's not magic' to not achieve anything particularly interesting or meaningfully different to magic. In fact, only something like a half-dozen unique psionic effects have been identified ever, which means that as a psion, you're playing a weird form of sorcerer.

Some of the magic-equivalent psionic effects are WAY better, though. Compare Remote Viewing to Scry, for example. Remote Viewing is better in almost every imaginable way. The same goes triple for the psionic version of Clairvoyance/Clairaudience.

And last I looked, Sorcerer is listed under the "Wizard" balance level. So if you think a psion is a "weird form of sorcerer", then it makes the grade. I greatly prefer playing a psion to a sorcerer, as they don't have the stupid-assed gimped progression, use a better casting stat (I like skill points), and actually have bonus feats. Also, psicrystals are cooler than familiars.

[Blicero]

Sorcerers can be almost as good as a wizard or shockingly useless, depending on the spells they choose to learn. Psions are sorcerers with a shittier spells-per-day system, (to me at least) bizarre flavor, and a smaller variety of spells.

As long as a campaign has a lot of time to scribe scrolls and such, archivists are not bad.

The themed spellcasters are generally useful and capable of doing level-appropriate stuff on a regular basis without getting wacked out power. They are also easy to play.

The warblade is a wotc martial class that, somehow, does not suck. It's still not great, mind you, but it's lots better than most fighters and barbarians.

Psychic warriors are essentially less powerful clerics.

[hogarth]

And last I looked, Sorcerer is listed under the "Wizard" balance level. So if you think a psion is a "weird form of sorcerer", then it makes the grade.

Oh god -- we had a rather tedious "debate" a while back on this very topic.

[Akula]

Fuck, I don't want to hear the psionics rants. The subsystem sucks, but there are reasons to use multiple powers. There are rarely, if ever, reasons to cast with less than max augmentation. Except for utility spells, or spells that will not augment evenly at your current level.