[OSSR] Cyberpunk 2020

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[OSSR] Cyberpunk 2020

Post by pragma »

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This seems like the right year for this review that no one asked for! I’m not thrilled about being in a battle of the bands against Libertad (loved the Dragonlance OSSRs!), but gosh dang it, there’s nothing more cyberpunk than being confined to my home and forced to find community on the internet.

CP2020 was my first RPG and the first piece of cyberpunk media (though I saw The Matrix about the same time as I got this book), so the ghost of teenage Pragma is going to weigh in on a variety of rules interpretations throughout the review. This book inspired me to dive deep into cyberpunk literature and RPG sessions of CP2020 glow warmly in my memory, so I get to find out whether I should be disappointed in retrospect! Given that I recall a player shooting ten people in the head with a single mighty spray of assault rifle fire, I suspect I should be.

Cover art:
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The cover features a dangerous gunman with a tiny head, sporting a haircut that feels like it was the bleeding edge of 1990. Indeed, the haircut may have been ripped from the fashion magazines of the day because this was published in 1990. That fact continues to stun me, because the book feels so much like a product of the 80’s in aesthetic, theme and (especially unfortunately) rules. Those rules should naturally be compared against Shadowrun, which was published in 1989 (though the first edition of Cyberpunk, Cyberpunk 2013, was published in 1988). I can’t comment on SR1e or 2e because I started playing with SR3, but 15 year old pragma recalls being stunned at how much more modern SR3 felt compared to CP2020. He was also stunned at being able to buy the SR3 books he wanted; CP2020 books were few and far between in midwestern FLGS’s, and internet bookstores were in their infancy.

The second page leads with six main writers, the most famous of whom is Mike Pondsmith. Pondsmith is a gaming industry institution, who has babysat this franchise for thirty years (not always well, he issued an apology for Cyberpunk 3.0). The persistence has paid off, and the Cyberpunk universe has seen continued life, most recently with Android:Netrunner, a (sorta) CCG darling of the 2010’s, and a AAA video game, Cyberpunk 2077, licensing the IP. He’s contributed to things as diverse at the Forgotten Realms and the Matrix video games.

It’s also worth noting that the line art here (and throughout the book) is dynamic and evocative: I like a lot of the black and white are and typesetting throughout. I feel like they do a good job of setting the tone. See below.
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Table of contents shows that there are 250 pages split into 11 rules chapters – Soul and the New Machine, Getting Cyberpunk, Tales From the Street (Lifepath), Working, Getting Fitted for the Future, Putting the Cyber Into the Punk, Friday Night Firefight, Trauma Team, Drugs and Netrunner – and none of the chapter titles give you any idea what’s going on. The book also contains setting and game-mastering sections: All Things Dark and Cyberpunk (world history), Running Cyberpunk (a 3 page DMG), Never Fade Away: A Cyberpunk Story/Adventure, Megacorps 2020, Night City, Face of the City and Screamsheets.

We’ll try to tackle this in five or six installments (some of the chapters fit together well). I’m going to try to write like a man posessed before my students get back on line and demand attention, so if this thing isn't done in two weeks you can look forward to fits and starts over the next few months.
Last edited by pragma on Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Ancient History »

"Features new artwork" was a genuine concern when it came to new editions in the late 80s/early 90s.
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Re: [OSSR] Cyberpunk 2020

Post by Iduno »

pragma wrote:The cover features a dangerous gunman with a tiny head, sporting a haircut that feels like it was the bleeding edge of 1990.
His hands and body also look small, so maybe the jacket is just twice as big as it should be? Either way, cover art of this quality certainly makes an impression.

Also, I am here for a team-up review between you and younger you.
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Post by pragma »

Who said I was going do more than one chapter a post? That person was a liar or a fool. New schedule: trying for one chapter a night. I've got a bit of runway from my earlier, crazier, schedule proposal.

Soul and the New Machine

Other cyberpunk reviews around here have suggested that cyberpunk is all about the aesthetic, and if you dig too deep, then you’ll find precious little unique substance. My thesis that this this book is an embodiment of that sentiment. Take the flavor quote that opens this chapter as an example:
As a cyberpunk, you grab technology by the throat and hang on. You’ve got interface plugs in your wrists, weapons in your arms, lasers in your eyes.[sic] biochip programs in your brain. You become the car you drive, the gun you shoot … With cyborged fingers you pick computer locks; with enhanced senses, you see into the Future.
Taken literally, it gets me hyped for strangling toasters, but if you let your eyes unfocus a bit it captures what the game is about: turn partially into a robot and fight something in the future. And it gets that point across with enough panache to get a 13-year-old readily on board, even if he has little idea what the whole affair is about.

The next two pages are a rambling cyberpunk primer that tries to explain what your character is doing, what the world is like and, importantly, how your character acts and dresses. The book commits hard to fashion and attitude mattering in the game (to the point it elevates both to attributes), and this diatribe tries to lay the foundation for that sentiment. Though having a short world motivator and statement of purpose up front is crucial to an RPG, this really falls flat overall: like the opening quote it’s all style and little substance.

It's worth noting that the text was copied wholesale from CP2013, but the layout is new. I think the layout choices are baffling: a way to get three essays running side by side (SR3s Corporate Download side-by-side dueling essays is the only layout that I've seen that's worse). You can assume that some of the confusion of the book is from trying to shoehorn old text into a new container.

However, the chapter saves itself by introducing character archetypes with full page art. Reading through these two pagers is enough to kick off character ideas and hook you into reading the rest of the book. I think this is a sharp marketing move that adroitly straddles two tensions: you can’t put character generation nuts and bolts first because readers have no idea what’s going on (and adding up build points is boring), but you need to hook readers early by getting them to imagine themselves in your world. This is arguably better than rambling opening fiction.

A quick rundown of the archetypes and their special abilities, which we'll discuss in more detail later:
  • Rockerboys -- rebellious rock stars who can inspire the masses to shake off their chains using Charismatic Leadership
  • Solos -- guns for hire with unusually good Combat Sense
  • Netrunners -- hackers, who have the unique ability to bend the net to their will with the Interface
  • Techies -- rogue technologists, who can get almost anything to work for a little while with Jury Rig
  • Medtechs -- close cousins of Techies who can perform major surgery using Medical Tech
  • Medias -- daring reporters who can influence the world with their Credibility
  • Cops -- police officers who can cow others using their Authority
  • Corporates -- ambitious suits who can utilize the vast Resources of their corporations.
  • Fixers -- streetwise operators who can leverage their extensive network of contacts through Streetdeal.
  • Nomad -- road warriors who patrol the highways with the ability to call in their Family
The art in the section is an essential piece of world-building even though the artist for this chapter had apparently never seen human lips. The art consists of burly men and scantily clad ladies (spoilered below). Scantily clad women are scattered throughout the product line, and are a relic of gender norms in the RPG subculture of the time. However, they made it much harder for teenage pragma to justify to his parents the great lengths he went to to find these books. If Chromebook could have put the full page topless robot lady on an inside page, it would have saved him a lot of grief. Setting aside the dicey gender implications, I'm not sure it was a strong marketing move at the time, and I don't think it would fly today.
[spoiler]
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The archetype introductions don’t address one of the main challenges of CP2020, which is that some archetypes have no business working with each other in a cooperative RPG. What are you supposed to do if your players roll in with Gordon Gecko (who is given explicit rules power to charter teams of killers), Mad Max and Robocop? Some of these characters don’t even belong in the same genre, and some would be the villain of a story while others are the heros. I think this is an example of the book being long in the tooth: I suspect the winning formula of “you are adventurers, you go on adventures” was a happy accident, and many of the books in the 80s and 90s instead said “you’re 80s sci-fi stereotypes, go do 80s sci-fi,” which lacks some all-important direction. Shadowrun clearly has its predecessor beat in this regard: "you are shadowrunners, you go on shadowruns" is an much better premise.

The archetype introductions each have a page-long block quote from a named example character of the archetype. This either presages or copies from Shadowtalk, an editorial convention where named Shadowrunners had sidebars throughout your Shadowrun rulebooks. Glancing through the SR1 book I’m inclined to say presages: SR1 appears pretty light on quotes from named characters (though I did see mention of Ghost who Walks Inside). Even if this was inspired by SR1, it took a lot of the art of Shadowtalk to a new level by making the Shadowtalker’s personalities and biases bigger and more visible, which makes it a worthy historical note. Perhaps inevitably, many of the Shadowtalkers are the authors’ personal characters. For instance, iconic solo Morgan Blackhand is Pondsmith’s character.

Join us next time for Getting Cyberpunk, and I dare you to guess what the chapter's about from the title.
Last edited by pragma on Fri Sep 30, 2022 6:17 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by pragma »

Ancient History wrote:"Features new artwork" was a genuine concern when it came to new editions in the late 80s/early 90s.
Some of the CP2013 art assets are reused in this, but they hid them in the back of the book. I suspect readers came away pleased: this definitely feels like a real product while CP2013 was 50 pages of some dude's house rules.
Iduno wrote:maybe the jacket is just twice as big as it should be?
Giant jackets are explicitly described as part of edgerunner culture in later sourcebooks, so that's as reasonable a guess as any.
Last edited by pragma on Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by violence in the media »

pragma wrote: The archetype introductions don’t address one of the main challenges of CP2020, which is that some archetypes have no business working with each other in a cooperative RPG. What are you supposed to do if your players roll in with Gordon Gecko (who is given explicit rules power to charter teams of killers), Mad Max and Robocop? Some of these characters don’t even belong in the same genre, and some would be the villain of a story while others are the heros. I think this is an example of the book being long in the tooth: I suspect the winning formula of “you are adventurers, you go on adventures” was a happy accident, and many of the books in the 80s and 90s instead said “you’re 80s sci-fi stereotypes, go do 80s sci-fi,” which lacks some all-important direction. Shadowrun clearly has its predecessor beat in this regard: "you are shadowrunners, you go on shadowruns" is an much better premise.
The way we played this was that whoever was running the game would say something ahead of time to the effect of, "Ok, you need 1 Medtech, 1 Corp, and the rest of you are Solos, Cops, or Nomads." Or "Everyone is a Rockerboy and you can have 1 Fixer or Media if you want."

So we never really played this as a connected campaign like we did with D&D. The closest was if you had a character that survived a prior adventure that fit in with what we were doing this time and you wanted to use them. Otherwise, we rolled new characters for each adventure.
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Post by OgreBattle »

I figured the cover art was meant to feel like an 80's anime OVA.
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Post by pragma »

Getting Cyberpunk

The next chapter (2) is called “Getting Cyberpunk” and it’s about generating characters, obviously. It opens with the quote
CP2020 wrote:Headware is the hardware – the frame which allows the character to interface with the rules. Remember, the disk is not the software, and dice rolls are not your character. Don’t get too caught up in the statistics.
A box on the page proudly displays a different quote about headware, presumably for visual interest, but also so the audience has no idea what’s happening
CP2020 wrote:Headware: the stuff you need to make a cyberpunk persona interface with the Rules of the Game [the crazy capitalization is sic]
Opening with a Zen Koan does little for helping me understand what’s going on (nor presumably did it help 13-year-old Pragma), but emphasizing flavor over comprehension is characteristic of the writing style throughout the book. e.g. three paragraphs in, the text combines good GM advice with shitting the bed within the same paragraph:
CP2020 wrote:Note: We could, at this point, warn prospective Referees about the various dodges their players will have for making “supercharacters.” But face it; if they want to create a mondo character, who are you to stop them? You’re all big boys and girls now, and if you, as Referee, think your players are getting way outta line, why not just go ahead and waste ‘em? That’s the Cyberpunk way.
Why indeed, other than the implied social contract of an RPG? 13-year-old Pragma didn’t take away anything other than “make players use random d10 rolls for every stat,” which is neither good nor terrible advice. He missed the better advice -- “it’s OK to let your players do what they want” -- but he wasn’t a particularly good GM and wound up doing that by accident, largely because of one friend who was a whirlwind force of personality. Though the text is hit-or-miss in communicating good ideas, it does evoke the casual disregard for human life that permeates the setting, and I’m not sure people knew better than to spew Gygaxian bullshit 30 years ago.

Players have too many stats: Intelligence, Reflexes, Cool, Technical Ability, Luck, Attractiveness, Movement Allowance, Empathy and Body Type. From these you derive Save Number (equal to body type, don’t know why they make it a separate stat) and Body type modifier (which is DR for big people). Many of these make intuitive sense to an RPG veteran, but a few break from the norm. Empathy is linked to a few skills, but it also serves as a budget for how much cyberware you can install before turning into a serial killer; luck is metagame currency added to die rolls; and cool and attractiveness are attributes that won’t get rolled in a lot of games, but which add to the ambiance. The idea was your game-master would treat pretty and composed people better. Good thought, but pretty people can get shot just as effectively as ugly ones: best to go first and shoot straight unless you know the GM’s mind well.

There’s a fast character generator for NPCs. I like it better than the actual chargen rules. Not least because the actual chargen rules are missing: the chapter tells you to generate attribute points, assign them to attributes, and then forgets to tell you the remaining steps of making a character. The fast generation process does include forward references to parts of the book where the rest of character creation lies (in the skills chapter and the weapons chapter, it turns out), but that leads to an obvious organizational nightmare. I was ready to make fun of younger me for forgetting and missing rules, but I can hardly blame him when he had to navigate this morass.

Join us next time for Tales From the Street
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Post by Username17 »

pragma wrote:This either presages or copies from Shadowtalk, an editorial convention where named Shadowrunners had sidebars throughout your Shadowrun rulebooks.
Shadowtalk became a thing in the Street Samurai Catalog, which was the first expansion book for Shadowrun back in 1989.

Now Cyberpunk 2013 has some punch quotes in it. But they are modeled self consciously on pull quotes from magazines. Cyberpunk 2013 has the production values and design sensibilities of a late 80s fanzine.

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Post by Prak »

pragma wrote:There’s a fast character generator for NPCs. I like it better than the actual chargen rules. Not least because the actual chargen rules are missing: the chapter tells you to generate attribute points, assign them to attributes, and then forgets to tell you the remaining steps of making a character. The fast generation process does include forward references to parts of the book where the rest of character creation lies (in the skills chapter and the weapons chapter, it turns out), but that leads to an obvious organizational nightmare. I was ready to make fun of younger me for forgetting and missing rules, but I can hardly blame him when he had to navigate this morass.

Join us next time for Tales From the Street
Oh good. I was actually looking forward to chargen, because the one and only time I tried to play this with friends, somewhere back in time, I could not find the rules for how many skill points you get. It's actually comforting to know that it was not really my failing, but rather the book just... didn't have that information.
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Post by Josh_Kablack »

I only dabbled in CP 2020 in my younger days, but my group's consensus from back then was that a Reflexes of 8 was the absolute minimum you could get away with -- and going that low was only acceptable for characters who were trying to specialize in non-combat roles.
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Post by phlapjackage »

I vaguely remember my group trying a gaming session of CP20xx(?), and we had no idea what we were supposed to do. Partly a failure of imagination (in my defense we were very young) but also it just wasn't clear what you do in a game of CP. Games like D&D and Shadowrun were easier to get into as kids, even the names kinda hinted at what you were supposed to do.
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Post by pragma »

Tales from the Street

Mike Pondsmith mentioned in many interviews that Traveler was the game that got him into RPGs, so it’s little surprise that we get a lifepath generator in here. It’s a rather civilized one: you can’t kill yourself before getting out of chargen.

You roll for dress and personal style (with another promise that “Fashion is action, and style is everything”; 13 year old pragma remembers no such rules), ethnic origins (which, admirably for the 90s, offers a chance of being African, pacific islander or Chinese/southeast Asian, but neglects the Indian subcontinent), family background, motivations and life events. You may notice a lack of snarky parentheticals for the latter three, that’s because they are determined by flow charts and I can’t be bothered to read all the small print and follow arrows. Suffice to say that there are a variety of possible outputs from rolling dice a few times.

As a 13 year old, I had no appreciation of how significant making friends and enemies could be, how much romantic life could affect you, or how much fun GMs hooks from friends and lovers could be, so I hoped desperately that my life path rolls would dump me on the “Big Wins / Big Losses” table to harvest the handful of minor mechanical benefits it could confer. e.g.: one point bonuses to technical skills or martial arts if you went to school or found a sensei. The game in general assumes a level of maturity on the part of the players that’s kind of refreshing after reading a lot of the nonsense RPG books get up to, but that level is largely absent in new roleplayers. This is a fun reference but a terrible tutorial.

This chapter includes the inevitable cyberpunk slang dictionary. Some of it feels like great cheesy cyberpunk (“input” is girlfriend, “output” is boyfriend), and other bits are just the usual international argot. I feel like it’s the argot is better chosen and more representative of the whole world than most cyberpunk slang, and I have always preferred “choomba” to “omae.” It’s possibly worth noting at this point that Mike Pondsmith is black, a rarity in the usually lily-which RPG industry, which might account for the book’s consciousness of ethnic origins and slang that didn’t come from northern Europe.

The line art in this chapter continues to pop. Adult pragma still likes it. Most importantly, these people have 80’s hair like they should!
ImageImage

I guess I'm committing to this "join us next time" bit: we're doing Working, which is definitely what I want to hear during my leisure activities.
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Post by pragma »

FrankTrollman wrote:Cyberpunk 2013 has the production values and design sensibilities of a late 80s fanzine.
Preach: CP2013 is obviously not a professional undertaking, and you can trace a lot of the bizarre organizational choices in CP2020 directly back to wanting to preserve the order and tone of the crazy rants in CP2013. A serious editorial pass between the editions could have vastly improved the reader's experience. (It's worth noting that SR1 definitely felt like more of a product than CP2013 did.)

Chargen is my favorite recently discovered example of this lack of editing. All of CP2013 chargen was baked into the lifepath system. When the authors decided to write a few additional chapters and split the mechanical parts of chargen from the RP heavy lifepath, they forgot to make one unified character generation starting point.

An aside that didn't make into the review: Pondsmith still refers to the game mechanics of CP2020 as the Interlock system, which is a fancy way to talk about a bad set of attributes and a commitment to 1d10+stat+skill.
Last edited by pragma on Sun Mar 22, 2020 8:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by pragma »

Josh_Kablack wrote:I only dabbled in CP 2020 in my younger days, but my group's consensus from back then was that a Reflexes of 8 was the absolute minimum you could get away with -- and going that low was only acceptable for characters who were trying to specialize in non-combat roles.
I've got more to say about that in the next few chapters, but that's a totally reasonable conclusion for a group to come to.
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Post by Libertad »

Is it wrong to say that I'm more interested in Cyberpunk 20XX on account of how terribly awful Shadowrun 6th Edition turned out to be?

I'm a bit curious as to how much role protection there is for the archetypes, at least in terms of ability to branch out "able to do the job, but not as well" vs "not being able to do the job at all." Like can a Netrunner repair their broken hacking hardware in the event there's no Techie on hand? Will a party without a Medtech be like an AD&D party without a Cleric?
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Post by pragma »

Working

The chapter called working is obviously about the skill system.

There’s a sidebar on this page which gives time estimates for various tasks. My favorite of which is “Searching a database … 5-20 mins,” which would make Facebook work much differently if it were true.

I’ve been dancing around the core mechanic of the game because, unlike sensible games, it hasn’t spelled it out in detail. We got a bit of it, mixed in with rules to calculate running speeds, when we were going over attributes, but the pages in the first chapter that are usually dedicated to setting up big ideas in the game (like “what dice do I need”) hadn’t been invented yet. The start of the skills chapter introduces the dice mechanics properly: 1d10 + stat (1-10) + skill (1-10) + optional luck points vs. GM set TN (10-30) or opposed roll, 1s auto fail with a fumble and 10s explode. Teenage Pragma totally missed the opposed roll bit on his first read-through, which made the combat chapter much more confusing than it needed to be.

Skill TNs are set by the GM comparing his/her understanding of the difficulty of a task to a master table (10 is easy, 30 is impossible, there’s a gradation every 5 in between). A list of difficulty modifiers (+4 for being drunk, +6 for very hostile environment, only +1 for never having done this task before, oddly) is provided along with some solid GMing advice: you only need to use modifiers to construct a TN for high stakes rolls or other situations where your players will rebel when you ass-pull a big number.

I’m conflicted when evaluating this fast and loose skill framework. I think it’s an accurate summary of what most games boil down to, but the veneer of respectability granted by baroque rules is important for deflecting blame as a GM. The whole thing feels uncomfortably close to rules lite nonsense.

The chapter continues with a bit of character creation that somehow wound up here. You start with 40 points to spread among career skills, ten skills which are set by your choice of archetype that include your special ability, and REF+INT points to spread among any non-career skills you like. If you play this without nuance, you’re going to get every career skill at 4 and a smattering of other skills.

At face value this seems OK, but the skill list is ~100 skills long, meaning that being trained in 10 of them makes you a relative nincompoop who has ~50% chance of failing easy tasks in 90% of skills rest of them. It’s the same problem that Call of Cthulu or Eclipse Phase has: long skill lists result in very narrowly competent characters grubbing to apply their one trained skill to every problem. Also like Call of Cthulu, the frequency with which skills are rolled depends a great deal on the skill and the GM (I bet handgun comes up more than Pilot Dirigible), and the skills aren’t remotely balanced between attributes: attractiveness only has two linked skills while reflexes has 20 (which include running, shooting people and avoiding being shot). Though, to the game’s credit, the career skills do often cover the bases for doing the most narrowly defined version of the archetype’s job.

One oddity is that Awareness/Notice, the Perception of this game, appears on every single skill list. Rolling to see things is one of the most common rolls in RPGs, so stacking this skill is a no-brainer. This skill is so important in so many games that I’d prefer to see it elevated to an attribute or something; it feels like a trap to let players not put points into this. (“But how do I play someone hyper-aware or oblivious?” Edges or flaws that you go out of your way to take.)

As mentioned above, you put points into your archetype’s special ability when picking your career skills, and one quirk of the game is that your starting ability is linked to your starting cash. This probably comes from trying to simulate the real world in some way, but it’s an obvious power gaming move to stack your starting ability as high as possible. 13-year-old pragma devised the ingenious solution of menacing players with income taxes – just flat reductions to their starting cash – if they picked too high of a rank in their special ability. He apparently thought that marauding motorcycle gangs gave out W2s.

This misplaced character creation section is followed by the skill descriptions, almost all of which include benchmarks for what a rating of 3, 6 and 9 in the skill looks like in the world. I’ve mentioned before the skill list is too long and quite silly for it: Pilot Dirigible is one example, the extensive discussion of Interview vs. Interrogate (which is different from torture) is another. However, the format is compact and the descriptions help. Good skill chapters require word count, and this skill chapter puts in most of the work, though example TNs for each skill would be more useful than the renown of people with different skill levels.

In the skill list we get the first mechanical description of the archetype special abilities, and they all seem fun and somewhat balanced. Special Abilities can be divided into three broad classes – abilities that grant you a new power (interface lets you hack, credibility lets you break news), abilities that let you request resources (resources lets you get a corporate jet, family gets you a motorcycle gang), and abilities that are flat modifiers to other rolls (combat sense adds to awareness and initiative). Each of these feels powerful and interesting, but they don’t play well together. Resources is the real sinner here: a dedicated Corporate could just buy a team of solos, techies or medias to solve their problems. (Man, that sounds like a great adventure hook though, what if you made a game where the corporate was an NPC who hired you to do crimes?) Jury Rig is also worth calling out as allowing wild power trips if you’re imaginative or technically inclined: it allows you to “temporarily repair or alter anything” (emphasis mine), which means that by RAW Techies are essentially malicious trickster gods with the ability to create bombs anywhere and anytime.

The chapter ends with various avenues of improvement for characters. It starts off on this tangent by asking the somewhat reasonable question of how characters improve skills, then talks apropos of nothing, about how they improve and use reputation.

The skill improvement system is dumb. You can convert downtime to skill improvement, which is fine, but would be improved by other competing downtime activities. This downtime conversion requires a teacher if you’re trying to raise a skill above two, which is basically fine, but gives the GM unfair ability to jerk you around on how long it takes and teacher availability. Or, finally, you can raise a skill by using it during a session and then having the GM decide to award you with an improvement point, which leads to frustrating bookkeeping and insane gyrations where characters try to use skills until they get better. If you think players should oversee their own character’s development, metagame awards like karma or experience seem strictly better.

Finally, we get to the strangest inclusion in a skills chapter I’ve ever seen: reputation. Reputation is awarded by the GM whenever they feel like it, and it is used for two effects: determining if randos have heard of a character and showdowns. The book implies that a character’s reputation has a reason associated with it that affects how NPCs react to you, so having a rep as a gunslinger is different than having a rep as a coward. However, there’s no specific rules about awarding a character multiple reps, one for each reason, which would improve the system. SR4 did this better because it had separate attributes for Street Cred, Notoriety and Public Awareness. Eclipse Phase did it worse by having dozens of separate faction reputations to track. I think SR4’s system + tags that let you indicate where the rep applied would be the next logical system to try.

The quality of the rep-associated rules varies. Randos ID you and react accordingly if they roll under your rep on a d10, which is OK even if it’s a reversal of the normal die mechanics. On the other hand, showdowns are pretty clever: if you get into a standoff before a fight, you roll an opposed check of cool+reputation, and the loser to suffers a -3 penalty when taking action against the winner. This is a great intimidation mechanic because it doesn’t compel PCs to take any particular action, but instead forces players to make tough choices if they get intimidated. It even incentivizes players to be rowdy criminal assholes who intimidate everyone they meet: genre appropriate!

Join us next time for Getting Fitted for the Future.
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Post by pragma »

Libertad wrote:Is it wrong to say that I'm more interested in Cyberpunk 20XX on account of how terribly awful Shadowrun 6th Edition turned out to be?

I'm a bit curious as to how much role protection there is for the archetypes, at least in terms of ability to branch out "able to do the job, but not as well" vs "not being able to do the job at all." Like can a Netrunner repair their broken hacking hardware in the event there's no Techie on hand? Will a party without a Medtech be like an AD&D party without a Cleric?
Timely questions! Role protection is a function of (a) how important is the Special Ability to an Archetype's job and (b) how closely do the archetype attributes match up and (c) how closely do the Archetype skill lists overlap. For your techie/netrunner example, the netrunner will probably do fine: he doesn't need Jury Rig to repair his deck (and in fact would prefer it not be jury rigged), he probably comes with a high INT, and his career skill list includes making cyberdecks. The medtechie example is a little tougher because characters could have cause to need major surgery, but medical care (both above and below board) is pretty common in the CP2020 world, there's a whole chapter on services you can buy, so I think Medtechies would mostly act like cost reducers. None of my players ever committed to one, so that's a bit of guess work.

The most important role is probably shooting guns, and that's not terribly protected. Solos get a huge boost in initiative, so maybe don't let them get the drop on you, but anyone with a decent REF can join a gunfight competently. The roles that are protected by Special Abilities as I describe above are my skill taxonomy above are Netrunners (very strongly), Medias and Rockerboys (somewhat weakly, having to break news and incite riots feels pretty plot specific).

I've also been keeping a weather eye on Cyberpunk Red since SR6 is a flop. I'm not hopeful: it looks like more of the same with much better production value. Same basic dice/skill/stat system (which I don't love). The skill list is slightly reduced and rebalanced (not enoough IMO), but there's one more stat. There are possibly some welcome simplifications to wounds, net running and combat, but you have to track armor degradation. The most interesting combat adjustment I heard on a live stream is that melee weapons are incentivized because they target lower armor values and have the same rate of fire as pistols. They may still make terrible action economy depending on how movement gets handled by RAW, which I'm not entirely sure was being used religiously on the stream.
Last edited by pragma on Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by pragma »

Getting Fitted for the Future

Which is an entirely different process than getting Cyberpunk. This is the gear chapter.

13-year-old Pragma made a series of solos (and no other characters), and I have a distinct recollection of having figured out a default set of equipment for them. You could cobble together all the guns and cyber you wanted, and have just enough left over for a sleeping bag and a cell phone to get work. I remembered this behavior with increasing incredulity as I got exposed to Shadowrun’s lifestyle rules, which made the two outrageous assumptions that (1) all the PCs would live somewhere and (2) that no one wanted to track individual tubes of toothpaste for their characters. Why on earth didn’t I buy my solo an apartment? Isn’t that a super reasonable thing for every adult to have?

It turns out, no! Young Pragma was probably influenced by the opening essay of this chapter, which suggests that every PC, from an actual drifter who lives on a motorcycle to a high-powered corporate executive, all live out of duffel bags because telecommuting is easy and everyone makes enough enemies that they have to keep moving. This would be really cool sci-fi if the book had committed hard to this aspect of society: it’s believable that all work could become remote when virtual environments are indistinguishable from real ones, and people making that many mortal enemies is certainly suggestive of a society in decline. You could even imagine great retirement hooks that the youth of today would call prescient futurism, like owning a house or having a stable job. However, not three pages later when talking about encumbrance the rules say “In most cases encumbrance isn’t a big problem for a Cyberpunk character --- he’s going to keep the majority of his gear in his apartment or his car.” This tonal inconsistency and lack of organization is in keeping with my rediscovery of this book.

This is followed by the table I alluded to earlier that specifies your monthly income as a function of your Special Ability rating. The rules specify that you’ve been working for 1d3 months and have a 50% chance of just having been fired. I prefer to read that as, you have a 50% change of having a stable, apparently well-paying job, why the hell are you going on an 80’s sci-fi adventure!? Different Archetypes are paid wildly different amounts and they have non-linear growth rates that don’t match one another. I’m reasonably sure the table was filled in by someone who was just trying to keep the relative pay of the various job descriptions at each Special Ability level sane without any consideration for larger patterns in the game’s design.

There’s a brief section on encumbrance where, as I pointed out above, you really feel the editorial pain of blending flavor and mechanical text. Shadowrun’s innovation of separating the two had a profound impact on universe consistency because you don’t get weird zingers that undermine your chapter’s flavor text tucked away in the rules legalese. (Aside: My favorite encumbrance entry is the 4 kilos section, which consists of electric keyboards, amplifiers and heavy assault rifles.)

The balance of the chapter alternates between descriptions of the attributes of gear, tables summarizing gear prices and attributes, and gear descriptions. It seems essential in the cyberpunk RPG genre to fetishize gear, and CP2020 delivers with 4/3 pages of firearms and 1/3 of a page of melee weapons (before we get to cyberweapons), a bunch of armor, and five pages of communications, lifestyle and surveillance equipment. There’s less total gun art than Shadowrun, which is probably for the best. I’ve never really understood why the fanbase is so insistent that every gun have a picture. My best guesses are (1) it has something to do with the first Street Samurai book being really good or (2) ex-military people liking to simulate urban combat in their RPGs.

I have often felt that you could strip this part down to a 1/4 page table that contained sneaky pistol, big pistol, SMG, assault rifle, shotgun, long gun and machine gun would cover every basic slugthrower you could possibly need. Add +/-1 to a few attributes if a player wants to individualize, and have full, unique rules entries for weird weapons, heavier weapons and explosives. On the other hand, my first Shadowrun character leaned super hard into the fact that he used the heavy pistol with conealability 6 instead of 7, so it may be worth throwing in a bunch of brands as role-playing prompts.

It’s weird that the authors committed so hard to making tables of weapons attributes and then never made rules for them. Each gun has a concealability ( Pocket, Jacket, Long coat or Not), an availability (Excellent, Common, Rare, or Poor) and a reliability rating (VR – very reliable, ST – standard, UR – unreliable). None of the codes are ever mentioned again in the rules. Concealability in SR3 revolutionized what I expected out of gear rules, because it specified anything about how the numbers in the tables connected to the rest of the rules (perception checks in this case).

Damage codes for the weapons are given in numbers of dice plus small static modifiers. The authors fetishized extremely large pistols, which could crank out 4d6+1 of damage and 5d6+X in various Chromebooks. (Compared to HP pools of ~15 and DR values of ~10, each shot counted in this game.) However, burst and auto fire were comically lethal, so 13-year-old pragma decided that submachineguns, which had J concealability and could still do full auto, were the kings of weapons.

Fun notes include the ability to purchase out of date (i.e. from the 1980s) weapons that had crappy attributes, linear frames if you want to re-enact Aliens, a 3 Eurobuck price point for a well drink, and the ability to feed yourself with dog food (Kibble may be an in-universe brand, but I like my way better).
Last edited by pragma on Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:57 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by pragma »

Putting the Cyber into the Punk

A brief essay about Cyberware and Fashion reveals that “most occupations of the 2000’s have at least some type of combat aspect.” Weird editing and not consistent with my experience. There’s also some good worldbuilding, explaining that cyberware is considered both glamorous and essential for career advancement.

This is followed by a discussion of a crucial setting conceit: cyberpsychosis. Putting in cyberware, regardless of whether it’s attached to your nervous system, causes you to accumulate a random amount of Humanity Cost. Every 10 points of Humanity Cost you accrue reduces your empathy stat by one, which makes you worse in social situations. Once empathy reaches zero you are “driven by a maddening hatred of other humans and living things.” Shadowtalk on the page drives the point home with perspective from a cyberpsycho.

The place of cyberpsychos in the world is clarified in the next few paragraphs about psychosquads, police units dedicated to preventing psychotic breaks who are often heavily cybered themselves and hound citizens for “voluntary” cybernetic registration, humanity costs, and the effects of therapy for bringing cyberpsychos back from the brink. Impressively, the authors introduce two conflicting therapy and humanity mechanics within 8 paragraphs (less than a page) of one another.

I like the conceit of cyberpsychosis better than I like essence loss. It felt more visceral and plausible to me than “your magical life force flees from implanted metal,” and cyberpsychos made more affordable villains than Shadowrun’s Cyberzombies. Moreover, Ghost in the Shell did a great job of linking dissociative disorders with cybernetic modification. However, I would worry about writing cyberpsychosis into a new game for fear that it reflects a somewhat dated view of mental health and enforces various stigmas. And, of course, my feelings about plausibility are dead wrong: I don’t expect people with prosthetic arms to be less human than they were before the arm was installed. Some careful setting writing could probably paper over my concerns.

Humanity costs also prevent the game from becoming full-bore transhuman, which is a shame given the weird cyberware coming down the pipe. The rest of the chapter is given over to cyberware descriptions and rules (after a brief description of just how easy it is to get surgery in the world of CP2020). The tables are much more civilized than the weapon tables, containing only one meaningless code (describing cyberware type), but otherwise given over to useful information: the price, the Humanity Cost and, wonder of wonders, a brief description of what it is/does.

There are lots of cyberware entries with lots of special rules associated, so I’m sure to miss your favorite in this overview:
  • Colored hair and tattoos have humanity costs: kids these days are obviously trending towards psychosis
  • Chipware is mostly useless because it can only get you skill values of +3 that can’t be used with a luck stat and reflex-based skills can’t be changed faster than three days.
  • Enhanced senses are available, though super-senses are appreciably weaker than in Shadowrun.
  • Anything that boosts initiative is just as valuable as you think it is in a gunfight.
  • A typo that makes the “trade your first turn to go first later” cyberware more useless than going second in a gunfight already was. (Pretty sure they meant +3d6 instead of +3 based on the flavor text.)
  • The Mr. Studd sex implant and the contraceptive implant. Both of which have humanity costs to the chagrin of trans activists and birth control users everywhere (and especially on Twitter). I’m pretty sure these have been much maligned.
  • References to other sourcebooks (this must be a second printing), which deeply baffled teenage pragma: what is Solo of Fortune, where can I find it, and have I failed to understand this book by missing that detail?
  • Bioware requires nanotechnology, which uses “nanoids” to “perform surgical tasks at the cellular level.”
  • While neural processor installation uses the science of “nanotech.”
  • You can install an autonomous, robotic cybersnake to make melee attacks on your behalf which can be mounted in “any orifice 1” or larger”
  • Lots of surveillance and communication equipment that you’d rather have outside your body, but which doesn’t have out-of-body rules or prices
  • Cyberlimb rules that don’t suck: mostly because you don’t have to futz around with enhancing cyberlimbs to keep up with your high base attributes like Shadowrun, and instead just get to crush stuff, do lots of damage with punches and kicks, and jump 6m in the air if you feel like it.
  • Also, limbs can eat damage instead of your body, and don’t require surgery to replace, which offers some nice mix & match options if you can afford it.
Shadowtalk throughout the section pops, it’s great worldbuilding. One striking deviation from the trends is a laughable technical diagram for how a smartgun works. I think my mind was blown as a kid, but it’s basically pseudo-science and chicken scratch. In fact, it even seems to contradict itself about the fire condition of the gun: is it controlled by cyberoptics or your reflexes. No one knows or cares!
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I threw in the last image to indicate that the authors indulged in a bit of pandering in writing this: they really seemed to want to shore up their nerd cred. There was also a reference to Kirk in the skills section (he has a leadership of +11, wow!), and a reference to “sexy robot drawings” tucked away in the section on cybernetic armor plating.

The humanity costs even for cheap cosmetic modifications prevent the game from doing full-on transhumanism, which is a shame if you can have snakes shooting out of your orifices. I’d be interested to see a game where being less human came with no associated costs other than a social stigma. Eclipse Phase did this the best, but that game had a lot of other stuff going on.

The chapter wraps up with a (remarkably detailed 1.5 page with crunch text) offer to get starting cash from shady organizations in exchange for having a bomb in your brain.
Last edited by pragma on Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by pragma »

Friday Night Firefight

This combat chapter opens by assuring the reader that “Most of the data herein has been compiled from ballistics reports, police data, FBI statistics and other not-clean fun sources.”, and proceeds to include self-righteous sidebars about misconceptions around armor, cover, shock and knockback from bullets. Despite that, I think the authors produced a system that has a basically fun core, but with way too many fiddly bits dangling off. Given that combat is one of the two things that has rules in this game (netrunning being the other), that’s very specifically not half bad!

The chapter, refreshingly, gets down to business after ~1/2 page of preaching. CP2020 rounds are 3 seconds long and initiative is decided by d10 + REF + reflex boosts (+ combat sense if you’re a solo). You get one action per turn. Movement is an action. Fiddly bits include quick draws (-3 to hit for +3 init), ambushes (+5 to hit if you win stealth + INT + 1d10 vs. awareness + INT + 1d10, and unable to act on someone ambushing you which is a notorious can of worms), accruing penalties to shoot two guns or take multiple actions (-3 per additional gun or action, total attacks limited by ROF of the gun). One quirk that we need to identify right here is that dodge and parry are actions, do you just not take a turn if dodging and parrying? Wait and see!

Damage is, oddly enough, covered before attacks. It starts from a great base of Xd6 – armor – ceiling(BT/2-1), recall that BT is body type, strength and con rolled into one stat. Armor is halved for edged weapons and half-damage armor piercing rounds. Then it wanders off into hit locations (you have separate head, body, leg and arm armor), hard vs. soft armors (can only wear one layer of hard armor, and it’s immune to armor piercing), just how much does layering armor or using cover help (it involves a table!), one point of armor degradation with each attack, and an extensive wound and shock system.

Speaking of which, every time you take damage you roll a shock save vs. unconsciousness (d10 roll under BT-floor(accumulated damage/5)) and if you have 16 or more damage you also make a death save (d10 roll under BT-floor( (accumulated damage – 15) /5) ). Fiddly bits include staging wound penalties that reduce INT, REF and COOL; double damage for head shots; limb loss and an extra death save if 8 points to a limb with one attack. You stop making death saves when you’re stabilized with 1d10 + TECH + any medical skill (which includes the non-Medtechie available first aid) vs. damage. This would have been a great place for a Medtechie to shine by getting to add both first aid and medtech to stabilization rolls or getting to try twice: missed opportunity.

Ranged attacks are d10 + REF + skill vs. a range DC with many modifiers. Fiddly bits include different types of automatic fire (which can result in different numbers of bullets hitting the target, leading to lots of damage and armor shred). I found the suppressive fire rules elegant -- roll 1d10 + REF + athletics vs. # of bullets / meters of fire zone width and eat 1d6 rounds on failure – but there are glaring editorial oversights. What happens if two types of guns overlap fire zones? The DC goes up but there are no rules for telling what kind of bullets hit the target. There are also lots of weird weapon rules including paintball guns that reference a null pointer in the rules called bruise damage, tasers that force stun saves, darts/needleguns/squirt guns that deliver drugs, bows/crossbows/spears/throwing stars that emphasize how ridiculous you are, lasers that have shooter-selectable damage, microwavers that fry cyberware, area weapons that damage everyone in a template (which include shotguns and many fiddly explosives). The section on ranged attacks also has this picture, which initially intimidated teenage me, then enticed him with cloying possibility: could I get my players to solve a shooting puzzle like this? It turns out, no! I could not. Because it took me six or seven years to realize that playing the game with a map improved the experience.
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Melee is d10 + REF + skill vs. d10 + REF + skill. Fiddly bits include borrowing actions against your next turn to defend (recall that blocking and parrying were actions earlier); different damage for punches and kicks (kicking appears strictly better); fairly fine grained sweep, grapple, choke and escape rules; special armor piercing and fumbles for monoweapons; and martial arts which give bonuses to some maneuvers at the cost of extra build points in chargen and play. Damage is generally a bit lower than guns (1-3d6 vs. 2-4d6), but compensated by a bonus of floor(BT/2)-1 and armor piercing on anything with an edge. I’ve included a table to emphasize how overwrought martial arts are.
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This is fast to resolve, easy to remember, and easy to modify if you need to wing something. The many example modifiers make it easy to improvise new ones for new situations. This is also not as super lethal as advertised if you let your characters armor up heavily: street clothes or concealable have armor values of 0-5, but skinweave, a common undetectable piece of cyberware, has an armor value of 12. You can layer a longcoat on top of that at a modest penalty to achieve a value of ~20. There are no availability or legality rules for armor to clarify what you can get away with wearing. Typical damage values range from 7-15, and that damage is delivered multiple times per turn by autofire. HP tracks are 15. So unarmored targets explode after even a single round of fire, but PCs can probably render themselves essentially immune to small arms fire.

I view this as a problem because I like to be able to threaten players with genre-appropriate bad guys like gangers even if they're going to go first and win. SR3 and SR4 had the same problem IMO: it was too easy to stack armor, especially with Cannon Companion, Arsenal or, heaven forbid, a mage who wanted to cast protective buffs.

However, if you stick to low armor or jiggle the numbers a bit (as suggested in an expansion evocatively titled Listen Up you Primitive Screwheads!) The system is fast and simple, which lets players focus on roleplaying in the moment. One roll (and particularly one die) per attack is very fast to resolve. I like being able to keep the table flowing during combat and for characters to come up with out of the box ways to use cover and the environment to their advantage, which is easier if they don’t feel like it will be 10 minutes before their next turn. Also, reflexes still seem important to a genre-appropriate degree without requiring multiple initiative passes because the combat is rocket launcher tag.

Finally, There’s a page of vehicle rules. Roll d10 + REF + skill to pull off maneuvers, failure puts you on a fumble table that can result in a skid or spin, recovering from a skid or spin is another maneuver. Ramming deals damage based on speed and weight to both ramming vehicle and target, passengers take 1/2 of the ramming damage to a vehicle. No shooting out tires unless you already bought Solo of Fortune. I still like it: simple, fast, covers enough of what you need to do with vehicles in a fight, though shooting out tires and long haul chases are both common enough that ignoring them feels like an oversight.

This chapter really drives home for me how poor the rules density is in this book. I think you could compile all of the necessary rules to one page. Heck you could even just pull all the rules callouts (which are actually quite helpful, a few are pictured below) off the page and into one place, then burn the rest of the book.
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I need to walk back something I said earlier: reliability does matter when you fumble with an automatic weapon as suggested by the above rules callout. However, here's another startling editorial oversight to replace my original indignation: there are no rules for to-hit rolls on any area weapons, I think the best RAW read is that they always hit unless special rules for the weapon call for rolls on the scatter table.
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Post by pragma »

Trauma Team

Ugh, this medical chapter is a logical extension of the combat chapter before it, and the self-righteous attitude oozes out of it in the same way. It opens by reiterating the stabilization rules from last chapter (actually the third time they’ve been stated, they also appeared with the introduction of the BT stat), then adds that a hospital or ambulance (their language is that “trauma team,” which I think is an in-universe brand) can give you one last save as 1d10 roll over 2*(minutes of being dead). (1) I think it’s a missed opportunity to not give the medtechie the same ability as the Trauma Team, and (2) these don’t play well with the missing limb rules, technically I think this suggests you can fix someone with a blown off head for 10 minutes. Authors of the same chapter obviously didn’t compare notes, so why would I expect it for different chapters?

The chapter then adds some deeply tedious healing rules: you heal 0.5-1.5 hit points per day depending on the level of care, which is administered as up to two skill checks of 1d10+TECH+skill where the applicable skills are first aid and the medtechie exclusive medical tech. Drugs and nanotechnology can speed this up at exoribitant cost, and failed rolls or starting at severe levels of injury can cause damage or require death saves. They mess up their own rules on the same page here by confusing healing rates … do nanites double your rate or add 1 healing box per day? Depends on if both first aid and medtech were applied and how you read the section. I don’t like it: long healing times interrupt group play, though you could as a GM work around it by spacing out work and making medical debt a major plot point. I don’t think anyone likes thinking about recovery times in their fantasy worlds, and I prefer games with fast healing through technology or magic.

Elective surgery requires the medical tech skill and includes installing cyberware. Difficulty rolls, the damage you take during surgery, and required facilities for different types of surgery are provided.

The rest of the chapter is flavor. Details include the availability and operating procedures of Trauma Team (confirmed here to be a specific corporation) services, the sources of replacement medical parts (body banks and cloning vats), and rules for cosmetic surgery. The cosmetic surgery rules let you increase your attractiveness for 600eb/point, which is a min/maxers dream, and it could also a really cool piece of worldbuilding if the authors had leaned into it: it explains why the COOL and EMP stats matter while ATTR doesn’t. You can give yourself a dog muzzle or a weak prehensile tail without humanity cost (unlike contraception).
Last edited by pragma on Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Ancient History »

Martial arts are one of those things where pretty much any attempt at granularity or realism tends to run up hard against the realities of simulationism in game design...and that's before you get to things like gamers rarely knowing shit about actual martial arts, Asian or otherwise.

But it is a thing where martial arts training are totally Full Of Tropes; Battle Angel Alita was built on the idea of a cyborg-specific kick-ass martial art, and it's not alone.
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Post by nockermensch »

pragma wrote:I’ve included a table to emphasize how overwrought martial arts are.
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Bonus points for misspelling"capoeira" in a rather novel way.
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Post by ETortoise »

I played in a cyberpunk game shortly after I started going to a combat sambo gym. The GM was happy to tell me that sambo let you use your martial arts skills with weapon attacks, which was OP. Since I was into a]MMA at the time, I thought it would be fun to make a nomad bare knuckle boxer (like a road warrior version of Brad Pitt in Snatch.) Long story short, the GM thought it would be fun to have me start the game in the middle of a boxing match. I won initiative and killed my opponent with a single punch to the head. It kinda sapped my interest in playing a martial artist in the game.
Ancient History wrote:Martial arts are one of those things where pretty much any attempt at granularity or realism tends to run up hard against the realities of simulationism in game design...and that's before you get to things like gamers rarely knowing shit about actual martial arts, Asian or otherwise.
Well, most rpgs don’t have enough granularity to simulate the differences between effective martial arts. Also, designers who “know” about martial arts probably know a bunch of bullshit and hooey based on whatever strip mall dojos they go to. (I’m looking at you Aikido.)
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