DDO

[Psychic Robot]

How do you plan on hitting things without it?

The same way wizards have always hit things? Buffs?

I'm not sure that's you're going to be able to raise your attack bonus enough to compensate for the BAB advantage other classes will have on you.

[ubernoob]

How do you plan on hitting things without it?

The same way wizards have always hit things? Buffs?

I'm not sure that's you're going to be able to raise your attack bonus enough to compensate for the BAB advantage other classes will have on you.

*Looks*

Yeah, DDO did take out the majority of buffs from 3.5.
Displacement, Greater Heroism, and that's pretty much it for good sorc/wiz buffs in DDO.

[hogarth]

Bards might make the most entertaining arcane caster/killers. If you can get your DCs high enough to matter with your enchantments while keeping a maxed damage/attack Inspire Courage and some combat feats, you get some of the best buffs (displacement, for example), fun crowd control, and decent attacks as well.

I'm playing a (solo) bard currently. It's working out well enough, although I suspect I'm falling further and further behind the damage curve with each level that passes.

[Roy]

I guess the question I have now is, why would I even want to play such a narrowly focused game?

It doesn't seem like there are that many good classical D&D options nor does it emulate tabletop Dungeons and Dragons very well. I mean, honestly, you can't have a decent ranged weapon?

Mindless hack and slash fun, same as any other video game. Also, narrow that it is it is still less narrow than D&D. Consider, D&D has about 5 viable classes out of 55. DDO has about 5 viable classes out of 11. Further, the difference between viable and not is smaller on DDO than in D&D.

I gave you the Den version of things because I knew that's what everyone here would want anyways, and it's not as if someone can invoke Stormwind about a video game to attempt to defend say... Monks (who still suck, just not as much and in different ways).

I mean, could you even have a viable ranged weapon in D&D? No, within 30 feet is not range, you can still get full attacked.

Anyways, the low level mobs are easy as fuck. So if you want your sorc to melee em go right ahead. But that will stop working around level 6 when you stop fighting kobolds and start fighting ogres, trolls, minotaurs, giants, and other actually dangerous things.

By the way, it's not hitting things that is a problem. Not many things impose an attack penalty, and later BAB granted attacks give an attack bonus. The problem is damage. Especially when you can do more damage with cheaper gear by casting spells.

Bards hold out a lot better because of their songs combined with the same buffs. In some areas Bards are actually considered better arcanists than the real arcanists. I am not fucking kidding. Though that isn't because of their melee abilities, it's because they get the same buffs and can also give 5 or 11 other people +8 to hit and +9 to damage or something like that.

Yeah, high level sorcerers and wizards are kind of sad due to the fucked up item and spell system.

[hogarth]

Anyways, the low level mobs are easy as fuck. So if you want your sorc to melee em go right ahead. But that will stop working around level 6 when you stop fighting kobolds and start fighting ogres, trolls, minotaurs, giants, and other actually dangerous things.

Yeah, it was definitely a wake-up call going from single-handedly killing dozens of kobolds/sahuagin at a time to getting pulverised by a couple of trolls. I hate those trolls.

[Judging__Eagle]

I guess the question I have now is, why would I even want to play such a narrowly focused game?

It doesn't seem like there are that many good classical D&D options nor does it emulate tabletop Dungeons and Dragons very well. I mean, honestly, you can't have a decent ranged weapon?

Actually, it's not quite that focused.

There are more 'games' in an MMO than people let on. There's the PvP game, the PvE game, the Raiding Game, the Money Making game, the Social game, and the RP game. Those are some of the main types of things that people can do in a game. Some players will focus more on one option, than on an other, and that's how the game keeps its players. Lots of optionally, interconnected, games.

[ubernoob]

Anyways, the low level mobs are easy as fuck. So if you want your sorc to melee em go right ahead. But that will stop working around level 6 when you stop fighting kobolds and start fighting ogres, trolls, minotaurs, giants, and other actually dangerous things.

Yeah, it was definitely a wake-up call going from single-handedly killing dozens of kobolds/sahuagin at a time to getting pulverised by a couple of trolls. I hate those trolls.

+1

And I thought clerics were good at melee.

[Roy]

Not in DDO. Like I said from the start, the things that make CoDzilla awesome aren't there for the most part, and the things that make the intended melees suck aren't there for the most part. You can do it as a fuck around measure, and as a I have over 9,000 (thousand) plat, so I'm going to make a normally gimp character ok thing but for the most part you're going to be wanting to actually cast spells.

[Roy]

So what's up with this? Did I scare you off with the Den style review, or are people still playing it?

[hogarth]

So what's up with this? Did I scare you off with the Den style review, or are people still playing it?

I'm still playing it a bit from time to time (bard 4/rogue 1).

It's a bit aggravating how slowly you build up Favor if you're playing the free version.

[Judging__Eagle]

I'm still playing; getting my Wizard close to 5 now, Ubernoob rerolled a caster cleric that's 7 or 8 or higher now.

Right now, I'm honestly playing the wizard to find the spells that fit my playstyle. I'll want to reroll as a sorcerer later on, since they're much more effective spell casters. I'm not sure if I will be able to roll a sorcerer though, making a melee dps character seems interesting.

A Rogue 2/Ranger 6-11/Fighter 2 or something seems like a decent build. I'm not going to worry about details for now though.

I've got a pair of Efficiency I clubs; so I'm able to add +40% more damage to my Burning Hands (and with talents that increase my crits, and add 10 or 20% bonus damage on top of that), changing a piddling 15 or so into damage in the mid 20's.

I'm actually still wearing the starter wizard robes, since it adds +1 caster level to 1st level spells; maxing my spells, since most of them cap out at 5 caster levels (but not Magic Missile, which I hardly ever use, the range is good, but the damage isn't worth it, I'm honestly better off using my Eternal Finger of Fire wand for long range super accurate attacks.

I'm also using Master's Touch, and a Bow during most fights since I'm a miser when it comes to my spell points. There needs to be something that demands me to use spell points before I'll do so. Like a bunch of monsters in a group, I'll drop a Burning Hands and the AoE Snow Storm spell for that.

[Lago PARANOIA]

So what's up with this? Did I scare you off with the Den style review, or are people still playing it?

The game seems more aggravating than it's worth. I mean, honestly, once you've established anything but TWFing as worthless and then require such a huge stat and feat investment to make TWFing worthwhile that you can't really do anything else then what's the point?

I could just be playing Baldur's Gate 2.

[Roy]

A Rogue 2/Ranger 6-11/Fighter 2 or something seems like a decent build. I'm not going to worry about details for now though.

Why Rogue 2? You get Evasion from Ranger levels. Also, melee are expensive. To get the good gear on, you could seriously spend millions of gold before hitting level 10. Yes, millions. Granted, the not so good gear is many times cheaper, but you'll also be a lot less effective.

I've got a pair of Efficiency I clubs; so I'm able to add +40% more damage to my Burning Hands (and with talents that increase my crits, and add 10 or 20% bonus damage on top of that), changing a piddling 15 or so into damage in the mid 20's.

They don't stack. Only one is actually helping you. Replace the other one with a Fire Lore item or something.

I'm actually still wearing the starter wizard robes, since it adds +1 caster level to 1st level spells; maxing my spells, since most of them cap out at 5 caster levels (but not Magic Missile, which I hardly ever use, the range is good, but the damage isn't worth it, I'm honestly better off using my Eternal Finger of Fire wand for long range super accurate attacks.

Magic Missile is mainly for boss killing at low levels since they tend to have high saves (making Niac's unreliable) and are generally dangerous to get close to (making Shocking Grasp a bad idea).

And I'm surprised Lago doesn't like it. It even has that scaling he loves wanking off to where weaker characters get easier dungeons as long as you play on normal.

[hogarth]

The game seems more aggravating than it's worth. I mean, honestly, once you've established anything but TWFing as worthless and then require such a huge stat and feat investment to make TWFing worthwhile that you can't really do anything else then what's the point?

That's Roy-style hyperbole, I suspect.

I could just be playing Baldur's Gate 2.

DDO is more like "Diablo". If you're not interested in a new Diablo-like game, then it's probably not for you.

[Roy]

The game seems more aggravating than it's worth. I mean, honestly, once you've established anything but TWFing as worthless and then require such a huge stat and feat investment to make TWFing worthwhile that you can't really do anything else then what's the point?

That's Roy-style hyperbole, I suspect.

I could just be playing Baldur's Gate 2.

DDO is more like "Diablo". If you're not interested in a new Diablo-like game, then it's probably not for you.

Not unless a large number of people, most of which have been playing far longer than me have decided to emulate me no. Nice try, but ultimately THF fails due to low attack speed and SAB fails due to low attack speed + AC not mattering.

Also, it doesn't have that much in common with Diablo.

[Utterfail]

I've been playing. I started about when this thread got started, and have overall been enjoying myself. I've got a 3 Rog/2 Ftr/2 Rgr right now. It's hardly optimal, but it's fun enough for now. And I'm about to unlock the drow anyway. After that I'll probably reroll.

Add "Utterfail" to your friends lists if you want.

[hogarth]

Not unless a large number of people, most of which have been playing far longer than me have decided to emulate me no. Nice try, but ultimately THF fails due to low attack speed and SAB fails due to low attack speed + AC not mattering.

I just mean that when you say "fail", I translate that as "is significantly less good" instead of "you won't even make it past level 1".

Also, it doesn't have that much in common with Diablo.

Er...? Maybe the game changes a lot later, but clicking the mouse over and over again on hordes of enemies spells "Diablo" to me much more than it says "Baldur's Gate 2".

[Roy]

I don't think it has much in common with BG2 either. Just that Diablo is all about soloing and spamming one skill throughout, whereas DDO is more like an FPS in that you need to get more involved to play well.

And it would actually be better if when I said 'fail' I meant 'couldn't make it past level 1' and not 'significantly less good'. See, if you couldn't make it past level 1 you'd realize it wasn't viable right off and not do it, instead of either needing someone to warn you, or fall into a Trap. It is precisely because anything works at level 1, but no one fucking cares that many of the problems come up, since you won't necessarily know if your build is viable, and you're likely to adopt bad habits from bitchsmacking kobolds that translate poorly into dealing with actual threats.

[Judging__Eagle]

A Rogue 2/Ranger 6-11/Fighter 2 or something seems like a decent build. I'm not going to worry about details for now though.

Why Rogue 2? You get Evasion from Ranger levels. Also, melee are expensive. To get the good gear on, you could seriously spend millions of gold before hitting level 10. Yes, millions. Granted, the not so good gear is many times cheaper, but you'll also be a lot less effective.

I've got a pair of Efficiency I clubs; so I'm able to add +40% more damage to my Burning Hands (and with talents that increase my crits, and add 10 or 20% bonus damage on top of that), changing a piddling 15 or so into damage in the mid 20's.

They don't stack. Only one is actually helping you. Replace the other one with a Fire Lore item or something.

I'm actually still wearing the starter wizard robes, since it adds +1 caster level to 1st level spells; maxing my spells, since most of them cap out at 5 caster levels (but not Magic Missile, which I hardly ever use, the range is good, but the damage isn't worth it, I'm honestly better off using my Eternal Finger of Fire wand for long range super accurate attacks.

Magic Missile is mainly for boss killing at low levels since they tend to have high saves (making Niac's unreliable) and are generally dangerous to get close to (making Shocking Grasp a bad idea).

And I'm surprised Lago doesn't like it. It even has that scaling he loves wanking off to where weaker characters get easier dungeons as long as you play on normal.

Rangers get Evasion, so only 1 rogue level needed. That's good to know.

I'm making multiple sets of weapon binds; efficiency item in one hand, and a lore or spell penetration in the other.

I'm bidding on a superior combustion 3 item now; that +50% damage to my fireballs is going to be noticable; and I'm getting it for 100-ish gold. I kid you not. Scanning the auction house is a really good idea.

[CatharzGodfoot]

Yeah, I'm still playing. Rogue 1/Ranger 4 on Khyber. +3 weapons can be really cheap if you look around the auction house a bit, so I haven't been having problems with gear.

[ubernoob]

Yeah, I'm level 8 now. I decided to see just how the TWF melee cleric works. I can solo normal dungeons incredibly easily, solo hard dungeons without too much trouble (I generally have to heal from a wand to conserve mana), and need a group for elite dungeons. It's very clicking intense between keeping divine favor/power up, watching all my min/level buffs, my summon monster 4 cooldown, and giving myself spot cures in combat. Pretty much any time I die it's because either I lost the action economy (Example: Getting blinded 4 times in fifteen seconds and not being able to both cure blindness and heal what the *other* enemy was dishing on me) or just plain lack of alertness (ooops, died to a double crit).

But yeah, it's a decent timekiller. I've had a couple people get butthurt and leave groups when I wasn't playing bandaid cleric (seriously, they got pissed that I tried to use soundburst when there were three enemies right close together), but for the most part I warn people in advance that I'm not a babysitter cleric and they just kind of accept it and if somebody dies whoever we just try to get back to a shrine to rez as possible.

PS: I hate Mummy Rot. Most annoying status effect in the game.
PSS: Elves really aren't that bad. I can see where human would be slightly better for me, but most of the benefits for human would require that much clicking alertness and I honestly don't care about the marginal edge. Toughness is sweet though.

[hogarth]

PS: I hate Mummy Rot. Most annoying status effect in the game.

Does an item of disease immunity protect against Mummy Rot?

[Roy]

PS: I hate Mummy Rot. Most annoying status effect in the game.

Does an item of disease immunity protect against Mummy Rot?

99% sure it does. Absolutely required for mummy areas. Trouble is you don't always know where those are. But you can get DI on a level 1 item, so it's not hard to get at all if you pay attention.

As for 'soloing norm dungeons easily' that doesn't mean shit. Like I told Lago earlier, they love wanking off to that auto scaling just like him. Take a weak build alone into a mission and laugh as mobs do less than 10 damage a hit at level 10. Ends up being a shock when you join a group and they start doing literally 10 times as much.

But really, I shouldn't have to be explaining to a Denner what 'the stuff that actually matters' is about, so I'm going to assume you already knew that.

[ubernoob]

PS: I hate Mummy Rot. Most annoying status effect in the game.

Does an item of disease immunity protect against Mummy Rot?

99% sure it does. Absolutely required for mummy areas. Trouble is you don't always know where those are. But you can get DI on a level 1 item, so it's not hard to get at all if you pay attention.

As for 'soloing norm dungeons easily' that doesn't mean shit. Like I told Lago earlier, they love wanking off to that auto scaling just like him. Take a weak build alone into a mission and laugh as mobs do less than 10 damage a hit at level 10. Ends up being a shock when you join a group and they start doing literally 10 times as much.

But really, I shouldn't have to be explaining to a Denner what 'the stuff that actually matters' is about, so I'm going to assume you already knew that.

Of course the dungeons are harder on the harder modes. Don't be stupid.

[Judging__Eagle]

Found something pretty handy on the AH; a Superiour Potency V light mace at 24k gp. I'm not sure if I can make 24k gp in 3 days though. I'm only lvl 5 now.

Is there some way to actually farm cash faster? muckbanes are... somewhat undervalued, if the people on the trade channels are to be believed.