The Den Design Challenge!!!
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Mearls is getting paid because he made friends with Monte Cook on the Malhavoc boards, wrote Iron Heroes at a time when enough people were looking for a low-magic d20 fantasy game, kept working with the right people, helped out by taking the hard jobs at Wizards like fronting for skill challenges over and over again, and then talked the suits into relaunching the game twice rather than scrapping it.Mike Mearls is getting paid for his ideas on 5e DnD
Almost none of that has anything to do with his one idea. A ramp-up token pool for character powers that didn't work well and no one used for very long anyway. Which he probably stole from some game no one's ever heard of anyway.
People get paid because they keep the suits happy, turn up to work on time, pick the winning side in any office disputes, and pump out the required word count in a timely fashion. Everyone's got ideas, they don't get you anything, especially not if you keep them a fucking secret.
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Stubbazubba
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K, if you really have a problem with people designing game mechanics right in front of other people for free on the internet because someone might not get credit for said mechanics in some hypothetical future where the above mechanics are used in a complete system, maybe you're on the wrong forum. How many contributors to After Sundown are not credited anywhere?
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Matters of Critical Insignificance
Matters of Critical Insignificance
A "striking, shooting and grappling" rule?
That's a bit hefty for a first challenge, but let's try.
Design goals:
I want a system that is:
1. More about telling a story than playing a strategy/tactics game.
2. Quick to resolve, so that descriptions don't get bogged down by dice rolls
3. Still interesting enough that combat don't fall into the
until (combat is over) {
"I hit/shoot/grapple him"
}
4. Going for a somehow realistic approach
Boundaries
I'm focusing on the striking, shooting and grappling part. The exact character stats and base rule mechanics aren't covered. The initiative system is also out of scope. Likewise, the impact of specific races/classes/powers/spells/etc. is not taken into account.
System
Striking/Grappling:
Combat is often an exchange of blows until one of the combattants manages to strike his opponent correctly. Rather than solve an exchange with a single roll, we'd rather go into details (goal 3), but according to goal 2 we can't just have tons of rolls. So we'll use a system that forces the players to describe the situation, and that resolves the combat through that description. In order not to fall into Magical Tea Party, we need rules to have an impact there. To do so, we'll use a words based system, with combat and situation related words written on cards or on whiteboards.
Step one: setting up.
The combat situation is set: the area, the participants and their weapons. The GM will set down area based words on the table. For example "narrow", "slippery", "dangerous cliff". Each opponent has a set of words based on their talents and equipement ("fast", "shield", "sneaky"...) but can also ask for words that gives him advantage other the opponent in the situation: for example a character with a spear can ask for "reach" when fighting against someone with a dagger. If somone decides to fight defensively, he can get the "defensive" word. Character specific words are placed in front of the player, other words are placed in the middle of the table. Once everyone is ready, we move to the second step.
Step two: drawing words.
The characters roll their combat pool according to the system's rules, and gather more or less combat action words according to the result. Characters with a specific combat style could be allowed to prepare their own stack of action cards, with actions matching this style. Action words are things like "downard strike", "thrust", "deviate", "block", "grip"...
Step three: resolution.
The character who wins initiative can use an action word (or let his opponent do it) to act, but he has to explain how he does. The targeted character can use an action card to react, explaining how he does. Any of them can use the words on the table to boost their action or hinders the opponent's. For example, the attacking character can use "thrust", and count on the "reach" of his spear to hit his opponent while keeping his distance (so that he can keep his reach bonus for the next action). The opponent can counter with "evade" and add the "narrow" word of the scene, to explain that he avoids the blow and that the spear hits the wall, giving him an opening. If the spear-wielding character has nothing to counter this, (such as a "quick recovery" card or talent) his opponent can use his "downward strike" action card, with the "opening" bonus he just got, that will make it harder for the spear-wielding character to defend (for example, he can't use a "parry" card).
Let's say, that he's got a "grip" card and that he wants to use it to get a grip on his opponent's hand before the dagger hits him. His opponent will answer that he can't because the strike is too fast. If one of them has the "fast" word, or something similar, that character wins. If he hasn't, the character rolls their corresponding skills/attributes to decide what happens. To avoid too much rolls like this, a reward system can be used: when a player accepts something bad he could have requested a dice roll to avoid, he gets bonus XP or some other reward.
When one character is hit, the damage system is used. Whenever the combat stops for long enough for a character to catch his breath, he can roll for new action cards. As the situation evolves, the situation's words can change.
I'll leave the shooting aside for now.
That's a bit hefty for a first challenge, but let's try.
Design goals:
I want a system that is:
1. More about telling a story than playing a strategy/tactics game.
2. Quick to resolve, so that descriptions don't get bogged down by dice rolls
3. Still interesting enough that combat don't fall into the
until (combat is over) {
"I hit/shoot/grapple him"
}
4. Going for a somehow realistic approach
Boundaries
I'm focusing on the striking, shooting and grappling part. The exact character stats and base rule mechanics aren't covered. The initiative system is also out of scope. Likewise, the impact of specific races/classes/powers/spells/etc. is not taken into account.
System
Striking/Grappling:
Combat is often an exchange of blows until one of the combattants manages to strike his opponent correctly. Rather than solve an exchange with a single roll, we'd rather go into details (goal 3), but according to goal 2 we can't just have tons of rolls. So we'll use a system that forces the players to describe the situation, and that resolves the combat through that description. In order not to fall into Magical Tea Party, we need rules to have an impact there. To do so, we'll use a words based system, with combat and situation related words written on cards or on whiteboards.
Step one: setting up.
The combat situation is set: the area, the participants and their weapons. The GM will set down area based words on the table. For example "narrow", "slippery", "dangerous cliff". Each opponent has a set of words based on their talents and equipement ("fast", "shield", "sneaky"...) but can also ask for words that gives him advantage other the opponent in the situation: for example a character with a spear can ask for "reach" when fighting against someone with a dagger. If somone decides to fight defensively, he can get the "defensive" word. Character specific words are placed in front of the player, other words are placed in the middle of the table. Once everyone is ready, we move to the second step.
Step two: drawing words.
The characters roll their combat pool according to the system's rules, and gather more or less combat action words according to the result. Characters with a specific combat style could be allowed to prepare their own stack of action cards, with actions matching this style. Action words are things like "downard strike", "thrust", "deviate", "block", "grip"...
Step three: resolution.
The character who wins initiative can use an action word (or let his opponent do it) to act, but he has to explain how he does. The targeted character can use an action card to react, explaining how he does. Any of them can use the words on the table to boost their action or hinders the opponent's. For example, the attacking character can use "thrust", and count on the "reach" of his spear to hit his opponent while keeping his distance (so that he can keep his reach bonus for the next action). The opponent can counter with "evade" and add the "narrow" word of the scene, to explain that he avoids the blow and that the spear hits the wall, giving him an opening. If the spear-wielding character has nothing to counter this, (such as a "quick recovery" card or talent) his opponent can use his "downward strike" action card, with the "opening" bonus he just got, that will make it harder for the spear-wielding character to defend (for example, he can't use a "parry" card).
Let's say, that he's got a "grip" card and that he wants to use it to get a grip on his opponent's hand before the dagger hits him. His opponent will answer that he can't because the strike is too fast. If one of them has the "fast" word, or something similar, that character wins. If he hasn't, the character rolls their corresponding skills/attributes to decide what happens. To avoid too much rolls like this, a reward system can be used: when a player accepts something bad he could have requested a dice roll to avoid, he gets bonus XP or some other reward.
When one character is hit, the damage system is used. Whenever the combat stops for long enough for a character to catch his breath, he can roll for new action cards. As the situation evolves, the situation's words can change.
I'll leave the shooting aside for now.
Last edited by Blade on Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
According to Frank, no one who wanted credit was denied it.Stubbazubba wrote:K, if you really have a problem with people designing game mechanics right in front of other people for free on the internet because someone might not get credit for said mechanics in some hypothetical future where the above mechanics are used in a complete system, maybe you're on the wrong forum. How many contributors to After Sundown are not credited anywhere?
Oh, we're doing Strike, Shoot, Grapple?
Coo. Roll a d20, if it's over your opponent's AC and not over your skill, you hit. Roll damage and subtract from hit points. If hit points fall to 0 you are out of the fight (offenders choice).
On the first round, determine initiative by shoot first, strike second, grapple third, and dice for tied methods. EDIT: Then iterate, loop de loop, 321321321.
Your target gains +4 AC if you fail to copy their last action (to close or break away), and +4 if they have been attacked with a slower method than yours (attacking past an ally), and +4 if you were attacked by someone else and not your target (pair-off is awesome).
Coo. Roll a d20, if it's over your opponent's AC and not over your skill, you hit. Roll damage and subtract from hit points. If hit points fall to 0 you are out of the fight (offenders choice).
On the first round, determine initiative by shoot first, strike second, grapple third, and dice for tied methods. EDIT: Then iterate, loop de loop, 321321321.
Your target gains +4 AC if you fail to copy their last action (to close or break away), and +4 if they have been attacked with a slower method than yours (attacking past an ally), and +4 if you were attacked by someone else and not your target (pair-off is awesome).
Last edited by tussock on Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Username17
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- Yes, you can make more than $50 on game mechanics. Sending a game mechanic into KotDT gets me $35 each time, and I've definitely done that more than once.
- No, putting your mechanics out for freesies on the Gaming Den does not preclude you from subsequently selling your ideas for monies. I published the nWoD -> d6s conversion long after I discussed it here, and Shadowrun had me write the SR4 Advanced Spirit Rules pretty much solely on the basis of me having already done so on Dumpshock.
- Being an actual paid game designer as your primary job isn't particularly desirable, and having people give you a leg up towards such a career or hamper you in some manner is pretty much meaningless.
- Putting an independent work together requires the work of at least two people, and more likely five or more, so finding people you have a good working relationship with is more valuable than having ownership of any particular ideas.
- You can't copyright game mechanics anyway, so being well known is more valuable than owning ideas anyway if you want to get your ideas out.
Now as for the specifics, I don't think that "challenges" are a good way to get out real finished products. Really, it gives you piles of brainstorming materials. If you're short on brain storming materials, that can be valuable. But in most cases, you'd be better off making a topic about a specific mechanic or setting idea and getting brain storming material and destructive testing that way.
-Username17
Not... quite. There was some other shit [Experimental Might] that Mikey worked with Monte for; and the important thing is your verb tense for Iron Heroes is completely wrong. He was still _writing_ Iron Heroes when he got the job with WotC [more than likely on Monte's recommendation], decided not to finish up, but published his draft notes as an actual game _anyway_, and has pretty much kept up that cycle [unfinished idea to print, abandon, new unfinished idea..] ever since, but somehow kept his job while doing it.tussock wrote:Mearls is getting paid because he made friends with Monte Cook on the Malhavoc boards, wrote Iron Heroes at a time when enough people were looking for a low-magic d20 fantasy game, kept working with the right people,Mike Mearls is getting paid for his ideas on 5e DnD
Bottom line is Mearls is entirely Monte's fault.
The delicious irony is things are so bad with Mearls at the helm that Monte couldn't even stand it there.
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OgreBattle
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http://www.amazon.com/Challenges-Game-D ... 158450580X
There's books for this sort of thing too.
Ah shit, I just remembered that I did one at the office before. But it was based on a broad 'theme' instead of specific mechanics... the idea was "A game where mapping is critical" that can mean actual gridpaper filling, or something heavily revolving around a winding laybrinth. I wrote up something where a bunch of guys go in to take a minotaur's gold. It was kind of like a reversed Pacman.
but yeah strike/shoot/grapple I'll get on that!
There's books for this sort of thing too.
Ah shit, I just remembered that I did one at the office before. But it was based on a broad 'theme' instead of specific mechanics... the idea was "A game where mapping is critical" that can mean actual gridpaper filling, or something heavily revolving around a winding laybrinth. I wrote up something where a bunch of guys go in to take a minotaur's gold. It was kind of like a reversed Pacman.
but yeah strike/shoot/grapple I'll get on that!
Last edited by OgreBattle on Fri Aug 17, 2012 3:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
I feel like strike shoot grapple is one of the few things we definitely shouldn't do. It's about the only thing most systems ALL do. So it's been done to death already and there likely won't be any new and inventive mechanical insights into this area this month. So lets do something else.
I like "Rules for fires and Firefighting", I also like "Rules for Investigations". Those are my two suggestions, feel free to hit me with others. I feel like I should probably make the actual challenge threads in the "It's My Own Invention" forum, and I'll do that in the next day or two depending on the chatter here.
I like "Rules for fires and Firefighting", I also like "Rules for Investigations". Those are my two suggestions, feel free to hit me with others. I feel like I should probably make the actual challenge threads in the "It's My Own Invention" forum, and I'll do that in the next day or two depending on the chatter here.
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Stubbazubba
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Just a list of ideas in general:
- Chase rules. Foot chase, vehicular chase, etc.
- Hireling/Cohort rules.
- Mass Combat rules.
- Minion/Grouping rules (pack of low-level enemies attack as a single unit).
- Item Creation/Customization rules. (possibly including structures)
- I second the nomination for Investigations.
- And, of course, a social system.
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Matters of Critical Insignificance
Matters of Critical Insignificance
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OgreBattle
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Shouldn't you list a basic setting + level and perhaps magic/technology available?
I'd write completely different rules if I was making a setting for caveman or for an advanced space society setting.
And sometimes you want challenges to just disappear as you gain levels.
Like for example fire fighting rules, where at level 1 you have to do a lot of work, while at level 10 you just summon a water elemental and read a book.
I'd write completely different rules if I was making a setting for caveman or for an advanced space society setting.
And sometimes you want challenges to just disappear as you gain levels.
Like for example fire fighting rules, where at level 1 you have to do a lot of work, while at level 10 you just summon a water elemental and read a book.
Gary Gygax wrote:The player’s path to role-playing mastery begins with a thorough understanding of the rules of the game
Bigode wrote:I wouldn't normally make that blanket of a suggestion, but you seem to deserve it: scroll through the entire forum, read anything that looks interesting in term of design experience, then come back.
Not necessarily, since it's just a simple rules, or minigame being created, could be simple enough that it'd work simiarly enough when other settings are thrown in, don't want to complicate the brainstorm too much.
Though I'd be intrigued to see the different rules you'd make for a caveman or Space Society, respectively (perhaps get some anachronism in there, for spaceman and cavemen fighting together?).
Not sure what system that would be most evident, where take a character who shoots guns, into a summoner (though would be interesting).
As deanruel87 has said, the idea of strike/shoot/grapple, there's kinda a large amount of them already, to what new ideas could we truly add? Hell I'll post an old one I've seen around here in the past:
http://www.tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?p=65730#65730
If I were to think of a system I've wanted to see, one for scaling a giant monster, so that you're not always just chopping at their feet, or something to that similar gameplay effect. So yes, that would mean it draws obvious inspiration to Dragon's Dogma, God of War, Shadow of Colossus, to lesser effect even Castlevania: Lords of Shadow.
Also, system for making encounters be nice, I find it bothersome most RPG's lack one that isn't D&D, I've found so far.
I also second rules for Mass Combat minigame.
Though I'd be intrigued to see the different rules you'd make for a caveman or Space Society, respectively (perhaps get some anachronism in there, for spaceman and cavemen fighting together?).
Not sure what system that would be most evident, where take a character who shoots guns, into a summoner (though would be interesting).
As deanruel87 has said, the idea of strike/shoot/grapple, there's kinda a large amount of them already, to what new ideas could we truly add? Hell I'll post an old one I've seen around here in the past:
http://www.tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?p=65730#65730
If I were to think of a system I've wanted to see, one for scaling a giant monster, so that you're not always just chopping at their feet, or something to that similar gameplay effect. So yes, that would mean it draws obvious inspiration to Dragon's Dogma, God of War, Shadow of Colossus, to lesser effect even Castlevania: Lords of Shadow.
Also, system for making encounters be nice, I find it bothersome most RPG's lack one that isn't D&D, I've found so far.
I also second rules for Mass Combat minigame.
What I find wrong w/ 4th edition: "I want to stab dragons the size of a small keep with skin like supple adamantine and command over time and space to death with my longsword in head to head combat, but I want to be totally within realistic capabilities of a real human being!" --Caedrus mocking 4rries
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
I'm with Aryxbez, I think solid mechanics stand on their own and can be judged perfectly well without much outside information.
Additionally I think good rules let challenges continue to rise. The same fire shouldn't be a threat at levels 1 and 10 but in a good rules set you could have the 1st level character fighting a fire in a room and a 10th level character fighting enormous wildfires sweeping towards a town. That seems cool to me.
Finally I have made the first Den Design Challenge thread! I decided the theme would be an Investigation mini-game. The thread is here-
http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=53602
Mass combat mini-game seems a very reasonable idea for the next one. Maybe I'll just let whoever I think makes the best investigation game decide what the next challenge will be, and we'll just all toss the ball around like that for a while.
Anyway, happy designing!
Additionally I think good rules let challenges continue to rise. The same fire shouldn't be a threat at levels 1 and 10 but in a good rules set you could have the 1st level character fighting a fire in a room and a 10th level character fighting enormous wildfires sweeping towards a town. That seems cool to me.
Finally I have made the first Den Design Challenge thread! I decided the theme would be an Investigation mini-game. The thread is here-
http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=53602
Mass combat mini-game seems a very reasonable idea for the next one. Maybe I'll just let whoever I think makes the best investigation game decide what the next challenge will be, and we'll just all toss the ball around like that for a while.
Anyway, happy designing!
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OgreBattle
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Cool, I've posted on there. My idea is based on something I heard on here about the fastest way to fix 4e's skill challenges.
On Shoot/strike/Grapple:
For that, here is my conflict resolution system
My Reasoning
It uses 2d6 for almost all results. You roll to beat a target number (individually, so it is two 1d6 rolls to beat a target number).
Because I like six sided dice, I like that each result is 'memorable'. Playing 40k tells me "3+ is a space marine's power armor, 5+ is flak." I like numbers with meaning like that. A d20 has too many sides and encourages fiddly bonus hunting.
Conflict resolution: Roll d6 to beat a target number, almost always rolled in pairs (2d6).
Target numbers are determined by comparing your relevant skill vs the defending skill. So stuff like "aiming vs dodging+cover" or "melee vs melee"
1 hit= 1 success
2 hit= 2 success
6+hit= 3 success
No hits= miss
1+miss= fumble
Rule of Mastery: if you hit on only 6’s you cannot critical. If you miss on only 1’s you cannot fumble.
6: extremely difficult: you will hurt yourself more often than not. High chance of fumbling.
5+: Difficult: you'll whittle at it one success at a time
4+: Challenging: the 'fair' result, anything can happen.
3+: Good: Rack up those successes, a fumble is quite rare.
2+: Easy: it's only a matter of time until you succeed.
Advantage/Disadvantage: sometimes stuff happens to go in your favor, sometimes your dagger isn't the right thing to bring to a spearfight.
Advantage: reroll 1's
Disadvantage: reroll 6's
So a guy hitting on 6's with advantage gets a large boost in not fumbling, but a guy hitting on 2+ with disadvantage is hampered on getting a critical blow.
It's easy to remember and apply.
other modifiers that I haven't given enough thought:
All-out: you roll 3d6. Critical and fumble chances increase. I think going berserk could represent this.
Restricted: you only roll 1d6, maybe you were whacked hard in the head, very risky. 1's fumble, 6's don't crit. Perhaps this is the 'stun' condition?
What does Success do: it deals more damage. if you get two successes, you deal more damage plus you use a fancy maneuver on top of it, maybe. Or maybe you just do more of that damaging stuff. (I don't like that in D&D4e "hitting a guy so hard he falls down" does less damage than "hitting a guy so hard he... takes more hp damage"
What does fumbling do: it activates a terrain hazard, or the foe gets a counterattack. I see fumbles not so much as "whoops I drop my sword" but "and the drow elf takes that split second opening in your guard to thrust at you"
Shooting
the range where you go pew pew at each other.
Things that add a bonus: Your skill with shooting implement, a stat, taking an aiming action
Things that resist shooting: skill with dodging, obscuring, etc.
weapon types
sniper: when you get two successes or a critical, you deal lots more damage than usual.
automatic: one success deals more damage than usual.
action types
Aiming: you gain advantage on the shot.
Shoot from the hip: you are disadvantaged on the shot
Striking
The range where you stab each other with spears, charge and stab people with knives, and go back and forth with swords.
Things that help you hit and resist being hit: melee skill, stance, flanking, weapon type and so on.
Melee Factors:
Range, it is reach (spears), standard (swords), and grapple (daggers, grabbin' folks).
When you are at your ideal range and your foe is not, can choose to gain advantage (fight aggressively) or fight defensively (foe attacks at disadvantage)
Getting into range requires you to successfully hit the foe (even if he resists the damage. Or maybe some tumbling fancy maneuver
Fumble:
-they can choose to make an attack on you, or move into ideal range.
Grappling is thus just a factor of range.
On Shoot/strike/Grapple:
For that, here is my conflict resolution system
My Reasoning
It uses 2d6 for almost all results. You roll to beat a target number (individually, so it is two 1d6 rolls to beat a target number).
Because I like six sided dice, I like that each result is 'memorable'. Playing 40k tells me "3+ is a space marine's power armor, 5+ is flak." I like numbers with meaning like that. A d20 has too many sides and encourages fiddly bonus hunting.
Conflict resolution: Roll d6 to beat a target number, almost always rolled in pairs (2d6).
Target numbers are determined by comparing your relevant skill vs the defending skill. So stuff like "aiming vs dodging+cover" or "melee vs melee"
1 hit= 1 success
2 hit= 2 success
6+hit= 3 success
No hits= miss
1+miss= fumble
Rule of Mastery: if you hit on only 6’s you cannot critical. If you miss on only 1’s you cannot fumble.
6: extremely difficult: you will hurt yourself more often than not. High chance of fumbling.
5+: Difficult: you'll whittle at it one success at a time
4+: Challenging: the 'fair' result, anything can happen.
3+: Good: Rack up those successes, a fumble is quite rare.
2+: Easy: it's only a matter of time until you succeed.
Advantage/Disadvantage: sometimes stuff happens to go in your favor, sometimes your dagger isn't the right thing to bring to a spearfight.
Advantage: reroll 1's
Disadvantage: reroll 6's
So a guy hitting on 6's with advantage gets a large boost in not fumbling, but a guy hitting on 2+ with disadvantage is hampered on getting a critical blow.
It's easy to remember and apply.
other modifiers that I haven't given enough thought:
All-out: you roll 3d6. Critical and fumble chances increase. I think going berserk could represent this.
Restricted: you only roll 1d6, maybe you were whacked hard in the head, very risky. 1's fumble, 6's don't crit. Perhaps this is the 'stun' condition?
What does Success do: it deals more damage. if you get two successes, you deal more damage plus you use a fancy maneuver on top of it, maybe. Or maybe you just do more of that damaging stuff. (I don't like that in D&D4e "hitting a guy so hard he falls down" does less damage than "hitting a guy so hard he... takes more hp damage"
What does fumbling do: it activates a terrain hazard, or the foe gets a counterattack. I see fumbles not so much as "whoops I drop my sword" but "and the drow elf takes that split second opening in your guard to thrust at you"
Shooting
the range where you go pew pew at each other.
Things that add a bonus: Your skill with shooting implement, a stat, taking an aiming action
Things that resist shooting: skill with dodging, obscuring, etc.
weapon types
sniper: when you get two successes or a critical, you deal lots more damage than usual.
automatic: one success deals more damage than usual.
action types
Aiming: you gain advantage on the shot.
Shoot from the hip: you are disadvantaged on the shot
Striking
The range where you stab each other with spears, charge and stab people with knives, and go back and forth with swords.
Things that help you hit and resist being hit: melee skill, stance, flanking, weapon type and so on.
Melee Factors:
Range, it is reach (spears), standard (swords), and grapple (daggers, grabbin' folks).
When you are at your ideal range and your foe is not, can choose to gain advantage (fight aggressively) or fight defensively (foe attacks at disadvantage)
Getting into range requires you to successfully hit the foe (even if he resists the damage. Or maybe some tumbling fancy maneuver
Fumble:
-they can choose to make an attack on you, or move into ideal range.
Grappling is thus just a factor of range.
Last edited by OgreBattle on Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
I'm not sure if your resolution system is as clear as it could be, least to me anyway. As I'm getting, it's a 2d6 + bonuses vs. DC, system as said, much like when ye roll a D20 or D10. However, I'm not sure what is being described exactly as the following chart below:
So is it saying rolling a total of 4 or better, is the "average" result in this system? It mentions successes, so you need both a success and to hit the target DC to succeed? So if if the average DC is 4, then ye need to roll with 2d6 +x, a 4 or better including a hit? In addition, simply rolling high gets you more hits, so as mentioned, rolling with the 2d6 +x, a result of 6 or better gets 3 hits? Pardon if your subsystem seems like it should be obvious, never really played any resolution system that used d6's other than Mage Knight miniatures, plus Shadowrun, trying to ensure I understand it.Rule of Mastery: if you hit on only 6’s you cannot critical. If you miss on only 1’s you cannot fumble.
6: extremely difficult: you will hurt yourself more often than not. High chance of fumbling.
5+: Difficult: you'll whittle at it one success at a time
4+: Challenging: the 'fair' result, anything can happen.
3+: Good: Rack up those successes, a fumble is quite rare.
2+: Easy: it's only a matter of time until you succeed.
What I find wrong w/ 4th edition: "I want to stab dragons the size of a small keep with skin like supple adamantine and command over time and space to death with my longsword in head to head combat, but I want to be totally within realistic capabilities of a real human being!" --Caedrus mocking 4rries
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
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OgreBattle
- King
- Posts: 6820
- Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 9:33 am
Think of it like two individual attacks, that's how it works.
I need to roll a 3,4,5, or 6 on 1d6 to hit that ork. Two d6's each have an individual attempt to hit that ork. I roll a 1 (miss), I roll a 4 (hit). one success.
With that it is like Shadowrun with a die pool of 2. Where it becomes different is when the critical/fumble system is stuck on.
Critical hits are determined by having both rolls succeed, AND having one of them be a 6.
I roll a 3 (hit) and a 6 (hit). That grants me a third success.
If I rolled a 6 and a 2, it would be just one success.
Yes, the trouble with this is wording it as I know exactly how it works in my head so I overlook things when writing it down to other people.
My goal is to have a system where the easier it is to hit the target number, the higher the chance of a 'heavy hit' (2 successes) or a critical hit. The harder it is to hit something... you don't just whiff completely, you'll just hit it with a 'glancing hit' (1 success) and the chances of a critical fast approach zero. All in one toss of 2d6. I will have to put some illustrated diagram in clearer language.
Because whiffing feels sucky, while getting a glancing hit that draws a line of red still makes you feel like you're in the fight.
I also like warhammer 40k a lot and rolling d6's.
I need to roll a 3,4,5, or 6 on 1d6 to hit that ork. Two d6's each have an individual attempt to hit that ork. I roll a 1 (miss), I roll a 4 (hit). one success.
With that it is like Shadowrun with a die pool of 2. Where it becomes different is when the critical/fumble system is stuck on.
Critical hits are determined by having both rolls succeed, AND having one of them be a 6.
I roll a 3 (hit) and a 6 (hit). That grants me a third success.
If I rolled a 6 and a 2, it would be just one success.
Yes, the trouble with this is wording it as I know exactly how it works in my head so I overlook things when writing it down to other people.
My goal is to have a system where the easier it is to hit the target number, the higher the chance of a 'heavy hit' (2 successes) or a critical hit. The harder it is to hit something... you don't just whiff completely, you'll just hit it with a 'glancing hit' (1 success) and the chances of a critical fast approach zero. All in one toss of 2d6. I will have to put some illustrated diagram in clearer language.
Because whiffing feels sucky, while getting a glancing hit that draws a line of red still makes you feel like you're in the fight.
I also like warhammer 40k a lot and rolling d6's.
Last edited by OgreBattle on Tue Aug 21, 2012 2:27 pm, edited 6 times in total.
Alright, I think I'm starting to get it a bit better, but what bonus's do under this system? Also yeah, any further details ye could provide would be appreciated, so I wouldn't mind that diagram, if it means things would become clearer.
What I find wrong w/ 4th edition: "I want to stab dragons the size of a small keep with skin like supple adamantine and command over time and space to death with my longsword in head to head combat, but I want to be totally within realistic capabilities of a real human being!" --Caedrus mocking 4rries
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
"the thing about being Mister Cavern [DM], you don't blame players for how they play. That's like blaming the weather. Weather just is. You adapt to it. -Ancient History
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OgreBattle
- King
- Posts: 6820
- Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 9:33 am
To figure out if you succeed on a 2+/3+/4+/5+/6 it's based on comparing the relevant score vs defending score (so like stat+skill vs defense) on a chart.
Haven't worked out the chart yet.
If possible I'd want to keep modifiers to that as just 'reroll 1' and 'reroll 6'
or "add in/take away a die"
haven't made any diagrams or anything, busy with things that must be done at the moment.
Haven't worked out the chart yet.
If possible I'd want to keep modifiers to that as just 'reroll 1' and 'reroll 6'
or "add in/take away a die"
haven't made any diagrams or anything, busy with things that must be done at the moment.
Last edited by OgreBattle on Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:08 am, edited 2 times in total.