Grek wrote:Grek, are you able to play ANY version of D&D, without knowing your stats?
No. D&D is not D&D if you're not using the rules for whatever edition you're using. And in order to use the rules, you need to know what dice to be rolling and how much to add to them. Even basic operations like moving, attacking, opening locks and answering "does an 11 hit?" when the DM asks require that you know what your stats are. If you don't know any of that, you aren't playing D&D, you're describing a story to the GM who then interprets your results on the fly into D&D terms. A game like that could be fun, but it isn't D&D. And even if it were close enough for you, I'd still need to know at least some of the stats:
At a bare minimum, I'd have to know what I look like, how far I can move, how far I can reach and what kind of magical non-obvious abilities I have, if any. Knowing how many HP I have, how good my attacks/spells/whatever is and what my skills are would be nice, but I could do without them if the GM will at least tell me "You are feeling healthy, you're a trained swordsman and you've studied classic elven poetry." before the game starts. It would be super annoying to have the GM roll everything, but it could be done.
But, again. That isn't D&D. That's some other thing you're playing with the GM while he runs a D&D game. And you'd probably be better off just putting up the D&D stuff at that point and playing whatever game you're playing with the GM.
I know that you're a grognard and think that stats are a bad word, but come on. The rules are there to describe the world, and if you're not allowed to know the rules, you're not allowed to know about the world.
no, the stats aren't there to describe the world, and you're an idiot. the stats quantify things that are incomprehensible as anything but a measure.
you highlight a major problem with players evolved from 3rd edition. i ahve said it i have no idea how many times, but people are worrying too much about the rules and not trusting the DM to paly.
So again I offer the challenge. get pencil, paper and dice, and just play the game with the DM running it. if you cannot do that, then you dont understand D&D. you aren't playing the game, but the rules.
one important thing, and can be proven with the fights caused by not having use of the stats in some sort of skill challenge system, is that the game contains only what YOU bring to it. so take away the stats and you have no rollplaying and the argument roleplaying vs rollplaying, but people bitch and moan about MTP, DM fiat, and shit, because they really dont trust the DM, so must not be enjoying the game. and if you dont enjoy the game WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU PLAYING IT?
D&D has been lost in editions anyway, as to what it is. though each edition still tells what it is through TSR, and keeps telling people that the rules are only guidelines. yet they do NOT listen. they get stuck on the paradox of something like "we have rules, but we dont have to use them", or worse "how do we know if the DM is being fair?"
you have forgotten why you are playing int he first place when you ask either of those questions, or you are palying for the wrong reasons and against the purpose of D&D. remember as stated in EVERY edition, except maybe Fantasy Encounter Battle Simulation Game (aka 4th edition):
THE GOAL: to have fun.
if you are having fun trying to screw with the numebrs, then so be it, but you arent playing the game, you are playing with it.
so ignore the numbers, including stats, and try to play it and see what the game is about.
t6he funny thing you didnt mention in what you need, and the thing this thread is about, is your stats/ability scores. you didnt say you needed to pick them, or have control over them.
at least you understand that much and have taken a step in the right direction to understand and learn more. there is NO Brady Games guide to help you get to the end of D&D. re-read the intros and explanations of what D&D is from the books from the 80s and 70s to see what the game is about, not the Rev Wyatt and his bullshit and ignorance of "its about killing things and taking their stuff, not traipsing through faerie rings and talking to the little people". learn the game better than he has.
Stats are really a leftover from miniature wargmes as i previously noted. they really played little part in the original D&D except told you a few things that they interacted with, and gave you the chance to do anything you wanted to with what was an ability check with common sense driving which stat to use.
class and level determined most everything you did, stats can be removed, and i wouldnt mind playing a version of D&D that had classes only, no "races" and no stats, and it really wouldnt change much about being able to have fun, but give a hell of a lot less to have to deal with and peoiple to argue over without them. like screwing with lsits of feats or skills or powers or whatever nonsense over-complications WotC has added, when they should have been trimming it down.
3rd based of 2nd+PO was the wrong way to go, they should have taken RC and the basic sets and made them the best they could be, and that is NOT what 4th edition is with its over-complications.
so as i said, you want something for stats, 3 is about as small as you could go, or you can remove them completely, and the upper limit to the stats like STR/DEX/CON/INT/WIS/CHA/COM is limitless depending on the level of complexity you want to add to the game, and how much you want to slow play down.
