Pathfinder Is Still Bad

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:18 pm

Probably couldn't hurt, so long as none of that stuff is copyrighted.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:28 pm

I'd need to use different art, but the material itself doesn't use any specifically copyrighted terms. Actually, I'd need to rename Hellspawn, and generally do some obfuscation, but that's a minor thing.

I'd also need to figure out what an appropriate price would be. I'm looking, so far, at 5 classes and 3 items, as well as reproducing the sphere system from tome, since several classes get their spell likes that way. I can toss in eight monsters to go with the Lantern class, and I could probably write up a handful more classes, including some base classes to round things out.

edit: what would people like to see in such a pdf? I've already got

Poison Ivy
Hulk
Lantern Corps
Ghost Rider
Spawn
Capt. America's shield
Iron Man's suit
Mjolnir

I want to stat up the various lantern entities, and am toying with the idea of creating Hydra and AIM with perhaps dedicated prestige classes, and am kind of thinking about something based on Deadpool. Other than that, though, I'm open to requests.

A Man In Black · Post by **A Man In Black** » Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:41 pm

Pseudo Stupidity wrote:Edit: Unless 3.5 monks have it even shittier than PF monks, which I find hard to believe.

3.5 VOP works differently (albeit also poorly).

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:55 am

So I looked at a changes summary from D&D 3.5 to Pathfinder. Do I really even need to worry about much conversion other than making sure function calls (as [insert spell/class], [feat] as a bonus feat) are still accurate? It seems like by in large a D&D class doesn't need much work to convert to PF.

A Man In Black · Post by **A Man In Black** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:38 am

Prak_Anima wrote:So I looked at a changes summary from D&D 3.5 to Pathfinder. Do I really even need to worry about much conversion other than making sure function calls (as [insert spell/class], [feat] as a bonus feat) are still accurate? It seems like by in large a D&D class doesn't need much work to convert to PF.

As long as the class doesn't interact too much with the heavily changed systems, like combat maneuvers or polymorph.

hogarth · Post by **hogarth** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:25 am

Pseudo Stupidity wrote:VoP monk and separatist Cleric are two of the most fucked up things I've seen in print. They are worse than wastes of space because the game would be better had they never been written.

The Pathfinder Vow of Poverty monk gave me some amusement when I thought about how you might be able to make a viable PC who only has one expensive item. And that's more amusement than 40%+ of all published Pathfinder feats and archetypes give me, sadly.

NineInchNall · Post by **NineInchNall** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:54 am

And then make that one item an item familiar ('cause remember, backwards compatible).

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:01 am

Also make it an item of legacy, just to pour more money into its value and really take the piss.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:51 am

Hell, take Ancestral Weapon or whatever the fuck it was from Book of Erectile Dysfunction.

OgreBattle · Post by **OgreBattle** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:53 am

"How do you know Boromir isn't a level 17 fighter fighting level 15 orcs??"

From the Paizo board, as a response to "LotR is a level 5 adventure"

GâtFromKI · Post by **GâtFromKI** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:11 am

He's actually right, and it shows how lame the fighter is: there is no way to differentiate a level 1 Fighter fighting a FP 1 monster from a level 20 fighter fighting a FP 20 monster.

LotR is a level 5 adventure because of the magic implied. But you can add 15 fighter level to every character, it doesn't change the story in any visible way.

Lago PARANOIA · Post by **Lago PARANOIA** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:31 am

Seerow wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
Prince of Knives wrote:Never been to Gaming Den
You're missing out! Some of the clearest thinking on 3.5 I've ever seen, hidden among a pack of people obsessed with the word "cock," and who threaten to dismember each other's mothers as a casual greeting.
From the Pathfinder forums. Thought it was funny enough to crosspost.

After doing some elementary data mining, it seems that while 'cock' might be the swear of choice on TGD, 'bullshit bonus' might be the most commonly used alliteration.

magnuskn · Post by **magnuskn** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:40 am

GâtFromKI wrote:He's actually right, and it shows how lame the fighter is: there is no way to differentiate a level 1 Fighter fighting a FP 1 monster from a level 20 fighter fighting a FP 20 monster.

LotR is a level 5 adventure because of the magic implied. But you can add 15 fighter level to every character, it doesn't change the story in any visible way.

Well, it'd explain how old man Gandalf is beating the shit out of all those orcs with his staff/sword combination.

Pseudo Stupidity · Post by **Pseudo Stupidity** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:58 pm

magnuskn wrote:
GâtFromKI wrote:He's actually right, and it shows how lame the fighter is: there is no way to differentiate a level 1 Fighter fighting a FP 1 monster from a level 20 fighter fighting a FP 20 monster.

LotR is a level 5 adventure because of the magic implied. But you can add 15 fighter level to every character, it doesn't change the story in any visible way.
Well, it'd explain how old man Gandalf is beating the shit out of all those orcs with his staff/sword combination.

Gandalf is almost an epic level character, fighter15/wizard5. Finally, the people who say Gandalf is level 20 are right!

sake · Post by **sake** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:13 pm

Gandalf was an aasimar cleric whose DM made him follow some arbitrary 'can only use spells against these creature types' rules in order to be allowed to play a cleric in a low magic campaign.

ishy · Post by **ishy** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 3:21 pm

GâtFromKI wrote:He's actually right, and it shows how lame the fighter is: there is no way to differentiate a level 1 Fighter fighting a FP 1 monster from a level 20 fighter fighting a FP 20 monster.

LotR is a level 5 adventure because of the magic implied. But you can add 15 fighter level to every character, it doesn't change the story in any visible way.

Fighter gameplay: http://boromir.toolness.org/

RadiantPhoenix · Post by **RadiantPhoenix** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:12 pm

sake wrote:Gandalf was an aasimar cleric whose DM made him follow some arbitrary 'can only use spells against these creature types' rules in order to be allowed to play a cleric in a low magic campaign.

IIRC, it's actually more like, "use magic as little as possible; make other people to do the work"

talozin · Post by **talozin** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:21 pm

RadiantPhoenix wrote: IIRC, it's actually more like, "use magic as little as possible; make other people to do the work"

In the Tolkien universe, that's actually pretty much how it works. Because using magic carries with it the risk of going against God's plan, and that is a massive no-no in Tolkien's cosmology. Saruman, Sauron, and Morgoth all turned "evil" because they used their magic powers in ways that God did not approve.

So Gandalf would almost be like a Call of Cthulhu character. Every time he uses magic he runs the risk that he'll run out of SAN points and turn to the worship of the Dark Gods.

RadiantPhoenix · Post by **RadiantPhoenix** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:08 pm

Actually, I'm pretty sure that, as a Maia, Gandalf is incapable of doing things that aren't in accord with destiny.

He's restrained from just plain pwning shit by two things:

His body weakens him.
He was told not to by his bosses in Valinor.

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:30 pm

He was told not to by his bosses in Valinor.

That's the main reason. Valar used their powers earlier, during war with Morgoth, and almost broke the world.

deaddmwalking · Post by **deaddmwalking** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:44 pm

RadiantPhoenix wrote:Actually, I'm pretty sure that, as a Maia, Gandalf is incapable of doing things that aren't in accord with destiny.

He's restrained from just plain pwning shit by two things:
His body weakens him.

He was told not to by his bosses in Valinor.

Isn't Saruman in the same position as Gandalf? It doesn't look like it stopped him.

RadiantPhoenix · Post by **RadiantPhoenix** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:09 pm

deaddmwalking wrote:Isn't Saruman in the same position as Gandalf? It doesn't look like it stopped him.

You'll note that Saruman got stabbed in the back by an ordinary dude with an ordinary blade and stuck as a powerless wraith (shade? something) until the world ends, while non-Istari Maiar don't have that happen to them.

EDIT: But, yeah, his job being specifically defined to include not going out and doing that is a pretty big factor.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:15 pm

It's largely self-imposed, I'd imagine. Saruman had thrown in with Sauron and I'm pretty sure that disqualifies you from the Undying Lands retirement plan you get for being a good little wizard angel.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Feb 14, 2014 5:33 am

Prak_Anima wrote:I'd also need to figure out what an appropriate price would be.

For those of us who aren't Frank or Altered History, and thus haven't already professionally dipped our genitals in the gaming industry, I imagine writing small splat pdf things for Paizo is a pretty good starting point, but from the look of their site, such things are usually priced in the $1-2 range (before they presumably take a cut). Seeing as you're looking at making "a third-party splat that covers a very small part of the game", you'd want to make sure you can actually get enough sales to at least cover the cost of registering the ISBN.

Seerow · Post by **Seerow** » Fri Feb 14, 2014 5:38 am

Koumei wrote:
Prak_Anima wrote:I'd also need to figure out what an appropriate price would be.
For those of us who aren't Frank or Altered History, and thus haven't already professionally dipped our genitals in the gaming industry, I imagine writing small splat pdf things for Paizo is a pretty good starting point, but from the look of their site, such things are usually priced in the $1-2 range (before they presumably take a cut). Seeing as you're looking at making "a third-party splat that covers a very small part of the game", you'd want to make sure you can actually get enough sales to at least cover the cost of registering the ISBN.

Is the ISBN actually necessary for a PDF only book being sold exclusively through a website?

If it is required then yeah, a $125.00 buy in for something half a dozen people might pay you a dollar for is pretty rough.