Ulisses Spiele tries to launch Das Schwarze Auge in the US
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Ulisses Spiele tries to launch Das Schwarze Auge in the US
(again)
The quickstart rules
http://ulisses-us.com/thedarkeye/
The facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/thedarkeyegame
I don't know what to say about this....
The quickstart rules
http://ulisses-us.com/thedarkeye/
The facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/thedarkeyegame
I don't know what to say about this....
Any indication whether this is a just a translation, or a new edition? I didn't see either, but I only skimmed.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
With D&D 5e, it might even have an chance to succeed...zugschef wrote:From my experience DSA (designers and gamers) has always been full of grognards. And it has to be, otherwise everybody would realize that DSA is like DnD when it comes to "wizards are better than you".
Red_Rob wrote: I mean, I'm pretty sure the Mayans had a prophecy about what would happen if Frank and PL ever agreed on something. PL will argue with Frank that the sky is blue or grass is green, so when they both separately piss on your idea that is definitely something to think about.
I think that DSA 5 (I've participated in the open Beta playtest) is way to complicated for what it does. The adventure design has always been as railroady as White Wolf at her worst. The game has not much to offer to the discerning American gamer. And it also has not much to offer to the un-discerning American gamer.zugschef wrote:From my experience DSA (designers and gamers) has always been full of grognards. And it has to be, otherwise everybody would realize that DSA is like DnD when it comes to "wizards are better than you".
But...
I think the balance between wizards and folks without magic is better than in DnD. Simply because magic in DSA is weaker across the board.
Ah, interesting.
So, looking at the Quickstart... 8 attribute system... skills are... interesting. The "d20, roll under, three times" bit is, well, amazingly stupid, but the "spend skill rating to decrease a roll, points are spent for length of test" bit is intriguing. Not workable, in that exact manner, but intriguing. I also like how the remaining skill rating determines success quality. The overall resolution method is cool enough that I wish "roll three times for every skill" wasn't incredibly tedious. Also, Fate Points really should not be abbreviated FaPs.
So, looking at the Quickstart... 8 attribute system... skills are... interesting. The "d20, roll under, three times" bit is, well, amazingly stupid, but the "spend skill rating to decrease a roll, points are spent for length of test" bit is intriguing. Not workable, in that exact manner, but intriguing. I also like how the remaining skill rating determines success quality. The overall resolution method is cool enough that I wish "roll three times for every skill" wasn't incredibly tedious. Also, Fate Points really should not be abbreviated FaPs.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
- RadiantPhoenix
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You know, when I first heard the name, "The Black Eye", I pictured this:
But then I heard more about it, and now I picture this:
But then I heard more about it, and now I picture this:
Last edited by RadiantPhoenix on Mon Aug 03, 2015 12:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
You can't know Das Schwarze Auge until you played it with germans.
But anyway, it's like someone thought 3.5 was too simple, but didn't make casters quite powerful enough. So they went out to fix this. And at least in those two goals, succeeded.
But anyway, it's like someone thought 3.5 was too simple, but didn't make casters quite powerful enough. So they went out to fix this. And at least in those two goals, succeeded.
Last edited by malak on Mon Aug 03, 2015 12:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I have played DSA of and on since 1984. Usually of, 'cause OMG. So I know it has massive issues.malak wrote:You can't know Das Schwarze Auge until you played it with germans.
But anyway, it's like someone thought 3.5 was too simple, but didn't make casters quite powerful enough. So they went out to fix this. And at least in those two goals, succeeded.
But you are the second guy on this short thread to claim that casters are very powerful. Comparable to, or even more powerful than D&D casters.
Clearly I have missed something big, because I've never noticed that.
So. What makes them so powerful?
Well in DSA 4 you could create at char gen an wizard who could summon an Djinn (or one who creates an Magic lamp/ring/whatever, which would summon an Djinn).Daniel wrote:I have played DSA of and on since 1984. Usually of, 'cause OMG. So I know it has massive issues.malak wrote:You can't know Das Schwarze Auge until you played it with germans.
But anyway, it's like someone thought 3.5 was too simple, but didn't make casters quite powerful enough. So they went out to fix this. And at least in those two goals, succeeded.
But you are the second guy on this short thread to claim that casters are very powerful. Comparable to, or even more powerful than D&D casters.
Clearly I have missed something big, because I've never noticed that.
So. What makes them so powerful?
If it's an Earth Djinn you could (in 4.0 was fixed in 4.1) turn an gold coin into an diamant, sell it for gold and repeat (this would work better with an once per day item summon).
P.S.: Dwarfs are the best wizards.
Last edited by Korwin on Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Red_Rob wrote: I mean, I'm pretty sure the Mayans had a prophecy about what would happen if Frank and PL ever agreed on something. PL will argue with Frank that the sky is blue or grass is green, so when they both separately piss on your idea that is definitely something to think about.
Korwin
That is a problematic loophole, but isn't exactly Pun-Pun level rules abuse.
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pun-Pun_(3 ... ter_Build)
Or even, my well build druid is a better fighter, than even the most optimized fighter build without spellcasting, or psi imaginable, that you see in D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder.
That is a problematic loophole, but isn't exactly Pun-Pun level rules abuse.
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pun-Pun_(3 ... ter_Build)
Or even, my well build druid is a better fighter, than even the most optimized fighter build without spellcasting, or psi imaginable, that you see in D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder.
- Stahlseele
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But why would you even need to fight anymore, if you can just WISH-ECONOMY for it?
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
- Stahlseele
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Yes, but Wish-Economy is way beyond Money as far as i understood that argument.
Wish-Economy is things starting at and going above something like true Immortality for egg sample.
And if you can wish yourself truly immortal, you can probably wish for whatever problem you are trying to solve to be a SEP . . .
Wish-Economy is things starting at and going above something like true Immortality for egg sample.
And if you can wish yourself truly immortal, you can probably wish for whatever problem you are trying to solve to be a SEP . . .
Last edited by Stahlseele on Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Welcome, to IronHell.
Shrapnel wrote:TFwiki wrote:Soon is the name of the region in the time-domain (familiar to all marketing departments, and to the moderators and staff of Fun Publications) which sees release of all BotCon news, club exclusives, and other fan desirables. Soon is when then will become now.
Peculiar properties of spacetime ensure that the perception of the magnitude of Soon is fluid and dependent, not on an individual's time-reference, but on spatial and cultural location. A marketer generally perceives Soon as a finite, known, yet unspeakable time-interval; to a fan, the interval appears greater, and may in fact approach the infinite, becoming Never. Once the interval has passed, however, a certain time-lensing effect seems to occur, and the time-interval becomes vanishingly small. We therefore see the strange result that the same fragment of spacetime may be observed, in quick succession, as Soon, Never, and All Too Quickly.
I think that DSA is simply to low magic to make that sort of stuff work. In D&D lots of gold=almost any magic item=quasi-unlimited power if you picked up the right stuff.
In DSA you'll just crash the diamond part of the gem market. If you are the only person abusing that loophole in the setting, you will have made a lot of money before that happens.
So you'll be a minor baron with brand new castle (to be finished 5 years from now) fit for a duke.
That's peanuts compared to what similar tricks can buy you in D&D.
In DSA you'll just crash the diamond part of the gem market. If you are the only person abusing that loophole in the setting, you will have made a lot of money before that happens.
So you'll be a minor baron with brand new castle (to be finished 5 years from now) fit for a duke.
That's peanuts compared to what similar tricks can buy you in D&D.
- Occluded Sun
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I don't think DSA does anything so exceptionally well that adopting it is worth the effort. There are a whole lot of existing systems, originally in English, that are designed to do or can be adapted to do everything it does.
Basically the game exists at all because of linguistic and cultural barriers, however permeable they are.
Basically the game exists at all because of linguistic and cultural barriers, however permeable they are.
"Most men are of no more use in their lives but as machines for turning food into excrement." - Leonardo di ser Piero da Vinci
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Not really. DSA is a game with a substantial fanbase, and an almost consistent shit-ton of effort went into maintaining, expanding and developing the game world over the three decades of existence. (There's a bi-monthly in-game newspaper pushing the world forward, for Firbolgs sake). The rules were designed to fit that worldbuilding like a glove (with more or less success).Occluded Sun wrote:I don't think DSA does anything so exceptionally well that adopting it is worth the effort. There are a whole lot of existing systems, originally in English, that are designed to do or can be adapted to do everything it does.
Basically the game exists at all because of linguistic and cultural barriers, however permeable they are.
The fans that keep the game afloat are usually longtime players and they have invested a lot of effort into learning most or all aspects of world and rules. The sunk cost effect is strong with them.
- Occluded Sun
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Why was it first created, back in 1984? My impression - and I am certainly open to correction from those who know better - is that it was inspired by D&D and initially outcompeted it because DSE was a German product. Something like the RPG equivalent of Bollywood movies. I don't doubt that it's developed a characteristic style, and it may well be excellent at what it attempts to do - I lack the experience necessary to reach any judgment on the matter.
But it faces so much competition in the English-speaking world that it would have to be truly extraordinary to get much attention. The sunk cost effect would work against it, here.
But it faces so much competition in the English-speaking world that it would have to be truly extraordinary to get much attention. The sunk cost effect would work against it, here.
"Most men are of no more use in their lives but as machines for turning food into excrement." - Leonardo di ser Piero da Vinci
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I'm inclined to agree.Occluded Sun wrote:But it faces so much competition in the English-speaking world that it would have to be truly extraordinary to get much attention. The sunk cost effect would work against it, here.
Weirdly enough it might have better chances to expand south, towards the (more progressive parts of the) middle east, because it has a rather appreciative view of medieval muslim society in its cultural bloom..with some gender-flipping, though.
Oddly enough my wife mentioned the pending American release of this the other week. Then asked if I knew anything about it... to which I replied "I think The Den reviewed it... and it wasn't good".
Last edited by codeGlaze on Mon Aug 03, 2015 10:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Phlebotinum : fleh-bot-ih-nuhm • A glossary of RPG/Dennizen terminology • Favorite replies: [1]
nockermensch wrote:Advantage will lead to dicepools in D&D. Remember, you read this here first!
I agree with your first point.Occluded Sun wrote:I don't think DSA does anything so exceptionally well that adopting it is worth the effort. There are a whole lot of existing systems, originally in English, that are designed to do or can be adapted to do everything it does.
Basically the game exists at all because of linguistic and cultural barriers, however permeable they are.
But you are wrong on the 2nd thing.
DSA exists because TSR tried to jerk around Schmidt Spiele in the early 80's thinking it was the German version of Flying Buffalo. Schmidt however was a serious mass market game company bigger than Avalon Hill at it's height.
So Schmidt had a chat with their 3 regular freelance translators and asked them to develop a rpg instead of buying the D&D translation these guys had been working on.
If everyone on the German side had been slightly smarter we may have lived in a world where in the non-english speaking rpg market DSA replaced D&D as the dominant rpg.
I looked, can't find any review of it here on the Den.codeGlaze wrote:Oddly enough my wife mentioned the pending American release of this the other week. Then asked if I knew anything about it... to which I replied "I think The Den reviewed it... and it wasn't good".
Having recently read the DSA 5e Beta test document, I think you can kill hardliners on this board by forcing them to review this. It is aneurysm inducing to any serious rpg gearhead who gets offended by inelegant design.
Last edited by Daniel on Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Frank reviewed it: http://www.tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?p=152234Daniel wrote:I looked, can't find any review of it here on the Den.codeGlaze wrote:Oddly enough my wife mentioned the pending American release of this the other week. Then asked if I knew anything about it... to which I replied "I think The Den reviewed it... and it wasn't good".
I've reviewed FATAL. We'll review anything here.Having recently read the DSA 5e Beta test document, I think you can kill hardliners on this board by forcing them to review this. It is aneurysm inducing to any serious rpg gearhead who gets offended by inelegant design.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
No what Frank reviewed is a Czech game that may have been influenced lightly by DSA.
The scary thing about DSA is, that you can always confidently (over a timespan of 30 years!) state about the designers, that they should have known better.
They were never isolated from the American rpg scene. They always worked for an at least respectably sized company in the rpg industry. There was always plenty of feedback from the fan community. There were always some serious professionals in related field (artists, computer game designers, traditional game designers) available for feedback.
And still...
The game has been doing pretty well for 3 decades, but except for the very early days, that is not on the strength of the rules set
The scary thing about DSA is, that you can always confidently (over a timespan of 30 years!) state about the designers, that they should have known better.
They were never isolated from the American rpg scene. They always worked for an at least respectably sized company in the rpg industry. There was always plenty of feedback from the fan community. There were always some serious professionals in related field (artists, computer game designers, traditional game designers) available for feedback.
And still...
The game has been doing pretty well for 3 decades, but except for the very early days, that is not on the strength of the rules set
Last edited by Daniel on Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.