Shadowrun 4e newbie questions

Mord · Post by **Mord** » Thu May 05, 2016 3:15 pm

Stahlseele wrote:I have by now aquired the SR5 Books in english and started reading them . .
I kind of want to scrape out my brain through my eye-sockets by now x.x

Here, this might help:

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Thu May 05, 2016 5:33 pm

That's my kind of melon baller.

-Username17

pragma · Post by **pragma** » Thu May 05, 2016 5:49 pm

This character generator worked pretty well at the release of SR5 and didn't require an install. Don't know how it has aged.

http://heyomae.github.io/

And yes, SR5 is deeply miserable. I don't play Shadowrun any more as a result of it.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Thu May 05, 2016 7:15 pm

@pragma
dear gods that thing is fugly as hell o.O

i am using chummer5, which works reasonably well . .
the not working properly part no doubt comes from the crummy SR5 system <.<

kzt · Post by **kzt** » Thu May 05, 2016 8:47 pm

phlapjackage wrote:Most of the problems with Movement seem like they could've been solved by the KISS rule - have the power actually increase speed, with all accompanying consequences. There's already a (barely functional?) mini-game for vehicles and speed, so the Movement power would just piggyback off of those rules.

In one of my ancient SR2 books it described it working like this. An example it gave was using movement on someone so they couldn't make a turn and crashed.

I think the problem that the change was trying to solve is that v^2=KE, so being able to make thing go a lot faster means they hit much, much harder. And, like most of the SR nerfs, it had effects that were unintended.

Aryxbez · Post by **Aryxbez** » Thu May 05, 2016 10:04 pm

Stahlseele wrote:I have by now aquired the SR5 Books in english and started reading them . .
I kind of want to scrape out my brain through my eye-sockets by now x.x

I am sorry for your loss, but as our gain, tells us the woes of SR 5th edition in the Shadowun Situation Thread!

FrankTrollman wrote:It's best compared to SR4A's attempt to nerf direct damage spells by making you pay drain for damage from net hits - a nerf whose only effect is to invalidate all combat spells EXCEPT the overcasted stun bolts people actually complained about

Whoa, its a rule I haven't noticed, or remembered because the combat spells are so shoddy. So would removing this penalty, Remove the Dodge roll, make stuff like Stun bolt soak on 2 stats (Like Body/Str +Will), whereas Combat spells one stat (like Will only) make Combat spells actual viable choices for a Shadowrunner? Otherwise what would you suggest to make those spells more viable, as I've heard the suggestion of making spells easier to soak, but then make Combat spells (lightning bolt, fireball etc) the absolute hardest to soak/Dodge would go a long way to make em dangerous again.

JesterZero · Post by **JesterZero** » Sun May 08, 2016 2:49 am

Aryxbez wrote:Whoa, its a rule I haven't noticed, or remembered because the combat spells are so shoddy.

Technically it's an optional rule, although as optional rules go, it's complete and utter garbage.

Aryxbez wrote:So would removing this penalty, Remove the Dodge roll, make stuff like Stun bolt soak on 2 stats (Like Body/Str +Will), whereas Combat spells one stat (like Will only) make Combat spells actual viable choices for a Shadowrunner?

I'm not sure I understand what you're talking about with the whole "soak on 2 stats" thing. If you're talking about soaking Drain, the mage already gets to use two stats. If you're talking about soaking the Damage, then having the target use two stats to resist makes Combat spells less viable, not more viable. One of the major advantages of direct combat spells is that the mage gets a two vs. one advantage on the attack roll: they roll MAG + Spellcasting and the targets only gets to roll BOD (if P) or WIL (if M).

Lokathor · Post by **Lokathor** » Sun May 08, 2016 7:17 am

Re-reading the Ends of the Matrix as I convert it to markdown. There's a part that talks about the limit on how long a Technomancer can Ghost is the same as the limit on how long a Mage can Astral Project.

I wasn't aware of such a limit at all. What's the limit? Like 1 hour per Magic/Resonance or something?

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Sun May 08, 2016 10:08 am

Yes, for the mage it is 1 hour per magic point.
So for the technomancer it would be 1 hour per resonance.

virgil · Post by **virgil** » Sat Jul 09, 2016 6:02 pm

Are the rules for Advanced Lifestyle in the Runner's Companion book of any value?

SlyJohnny · Post by **SlyJohnny** » Sat Jul 09, 2016 10:03 pm

They're cute and occasionally provide a few mechanical bonuses (like the mage can have a house that happens to have an Aspected Domain for his tradition), but they mostly just allow you to flesh out exactly what kind of place your home is.

Also they're compatible with the basic rules: a Middle lifestyle by default has Middle stats all across the board, so if people want to tinker around with it they can, but if they're not interested than they don't have to.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Sat Jul 09, 2016 11:21 pm

The Advanced Lifestyle rules are the least objectionable thing I remember about Runner's Companion but that's not saying much because that book was a dumpster fire.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Sat Jul 09, 2016 11:58 pm

Yeah, the advanced LIFESTYLE stuff was not too bad in my char gen.
Might be worth porting somewhere else, where it has nothing to do with SR5 maybe . .

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:56 am

The Advanced Lifestyle rules are extremely gameable and produce absolutely ridiculous results when min/maxxed. Domestic Servants in your post-apocalyptic art vault for ¥800 a month and shit like that. Probably the biggest single issue is that it way over-estimates the value of locks. Home security is something that is less useful to Runners than to normal people (since they are going to have ninjas go to their house whether they live in an expensive gated community or not), but in any case the presentation of security concerns was written by someone who is an idiot and thinks it has something to do with how good the locks are on the house, rather than how generally high or low crime the area around your home is (the actually important thing).

But regardless, while there's plenty of bone headed stupidity to go around in that chapter, and numerous hilarious degenerate results, and several "dump stats" for players to get really ridiculous pads on the cheap... it's overall just a bit of fun. Yes, getting "Feng Shui" bonuses to hacking from home is "broken," but so what? Shadowrun is a game about finding exploits and heaping together asymmetric bonuses. The home design section of the Runner's Companion is deeply flawed, but it's not game destroyingly so. And it's much better than anything else in the book.

I give it 4/10. Probably a modest net positive to include in the game. And very likely a net positive to include in the game if you get a table wide gentleman's agreement to not do anything stupid or tacky.

-Username17

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:59 am

If you don't roleplay Shadowrun slice of life comedy, then lifestyle rules are easy to minmax by dumping amenities and tv subscription and buying impenetrable fortress. OTOH, home security has literally never came up for me so the value of such optimization is questionable.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:31 pm

Well, i had tried to make a street shark, so i got me a low to mid lifestyle being in an old small indoor swimming pool building basically . . with a garage big enough for my pickup truck. and that worked well enough for it to be good for the character without anything stupid or silly.

Lokathor · Post by **Lokathor** » Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:25 am

Should the Astral Perception adept power really be a whole power point?

Shouldn't it be like a quarter of a power point? I mean you still ALSO have to buy up Assensing. And you're not even projecting, you're just being dual-natured and seeing astral imprints and stuff.

Speaking of which, should Astral Projection be an adept power for 1pp?

phlapjackage · Post by **phlapjackage** » Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:17 am

Yeah, I would definitely lower the cost of Astral Perception. Maybe even to the point of "free at first Initiation" or something. So many adept powers are overpriced...

Astral projection, I think it was kind of used as a "this is what full mages get that other magic-types don't." So I could see an argument for not allowing it, or making it really really expensive (or a metamagic with prereqs?) Having said that, I think it would be interesting to allow adepts (physical or mystic) to get it, maybe 2 pp.

sendaz · Post by **sendaz** » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:33 am

Once upon a time back in State of the Art 2064 they did offer Adepts a Limited Astral Projection as a Metamagic

State of the Art pg 62 wrote:Limited Astral Projection
Only magician’s way adepts who already know the Astral
Perception power may learn this metamagic technique.
Limited Astral Projection allows a magician’s way adept to
astrally project in the same manner as full magicians (p. 172,
SR3). Since the adept’s magical abilities are firmly rooted in his
physical body, however, the adept’s physical body loses
Essence at the rate of 1 point every minute rather than every
hour (see While You Were Out … , p. 173, SR3). Adept powers
function normally while the adept is projecting.

So it gave a way for some astral activity without overshadowing the full mage version.

Lokathor · Post by **Lokathor** » Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:05 am

So can you take the same negative quality more than once?

Like, can you load up on lots of small allergies to get your BP fix?

OgreBattle · Post by **OgreBattle** » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:19 am

Is there a list of all possible conditions you can inflict?

Is there a list of all the martial arts maneuvers you can be granted from different styles?

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:08 am

@Lokathor
Yes, as per the rules you can.
If your GM allows it, that is another question entirely.

@OgreBattle
What kind of conditions are you talking about?
Don't think such lists have ever been compiled.
For the martial arts maneuvers at least you may be able to use the chummer character generator i guess.

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:21 am

OgreBattle wrote:Is there a list of all possible conditions you can inflict?

Is there a list of all the martial arts maneuvers you can be granted from different styles?

All the martial art maneuvers are in the same book as the martial arts, which is... Arsenal? I think?

Longes · Post by **Longes** » Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:56 pm

A question for all of you experienced SR GMs and players. What's your opinion on using Jackpoint in PC description or game running? Personally, I find to be somewhat masturbatory, like writing yourself into a Harry Potter fanfic as a Snape's relative - a form of hanging out with the kool kids.

hyzmarca · Post by **hyzmarca** » Sat Nov 12, 2016 12:08 am

OgreBattle wrote:Is there a list of all possible conditions you can inflict?

Is there a list of all the martial arts maneuvers you can be granted from different styles?

Yeah. But don't be surprised if you taking Damian Knight's semen as an allergy results in armies of Damian knight clones trying to bukake you all the time.