Zak S wrote:deaddmwalking wrote:
1) There are already rules for 'aid another'.
2) This largely duplicates the effects of Inspire Competence.
3) There is a rule for 'Masterwork Tool' that indicates it would grant a +2 bonus on a check.
4) I'm not sure if this is in the SRD, but I'm certain it was in the Core Books
It's an incredibly stupid and narrow-minded assumption that everyone is playing versions of D&D game with these rules. They're not
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How incredibly narrow-minded of me to assume that anyone who
claims to be playing D&D isn't instead an out-and-out liar. Fortunately for me, this means that I'm now free to assume that you're lying whenever you speak rather than waiting until you have been
proven to be a liar. Honestly, that's nice, because
so far, anything you've said turns out to be either a lie or a blatant attempt at misdirection or goal-shifting.
Zak S wrote:
The justification for the rule is it gives the scene where a musician player plays their instrument tension about whether there's a bonus.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Here's the thing - if the 'negotiation' has serious consequences, then there is tension whether they play their instrument or not - the tension comes from the success of the negotiation. If the 'negotiation' has no serious consequences, then failure or success won't make things more tense... If the negotiation can
only succeed if the character succeeds at his 'play instrument check' (and since you've been vague as to the amount of bonus - though if I didn't assume you were always lying I would think that it was +1) it doesn't really make the play instrument roll 'tense' - it just adds two points of failure... And if the character
can't fail his roll (which, since you're apparently not playing D&D I have no idea whether that is or is not possible) then there is
no tension as a result of this... Since you've
implied (though - again, you were probably lying) that they'll
usually be successful, I don't imagine it is too tense - most likely it seems that they get a bonus that they
probably didn't need. Assuming that they COULD succeed without the bonus, and the bonus is +1, 5% of the time (assuming you're rolling a d20) the check actually matters - when they fail by 1. If they succeeded without the bonus, then the music doesn't matter; if they failed by more than 1 the bonus from the music doesn't matter. Over the course of
many such 'negotiations', it might make a difference, but not enough to create tension.
So, if you want to talk about the rule based solely on your justification I quoted, I think your rule fails. I think your players are smart enough that they don't feel any extra tension.
Zak S wrote:
If you can't tell what your friends do and don't like, you are bad at GMing. And bad at being a grown-up. The behavior of their PC on paper will be the same, but they--the human there--will not act the same.
I have a lot of respect for actors/actresses in the adult entertainment industry. Despite a reputation for 'bad acting', I firmly believe that the majority can make themselves look like they're enjoying
anything.
Moreover, if someone is enjoying something, I probably won't be able to tell the reason. Whether they're enjoying 'talking about music in character' or they're enjoying 'getting a bonus to make them more likely to succeed' - the fact remains that they're having fun. I like to consider BEHAVIOR, not ATTITUDE (management training 101 stuff, here). If someone looks like they're having fun, acts like they're having fun (even if they're doing it for the 'wrong reasons'), I'm going to believe that they're having fun. Unless they're you - because I'm going to assume that you're lying from now on unless proven otherwise.
Zak S wrote:
Which seems to make sense until you realize nobody's ever been thrown out.
You know, I wouldn't normally go in this direction, but I feel like you've brought up something that deserves a closer look.
Are you saying that nobody has ever left your game? Has every player you've ever had continue to play with you? That's great - surely a positive proof that everyone has enjoyed your games. Or have you lost players? Why do you think that is? I'm sure some have moved or gone away, but if the game was 'perfectly tailored' to their enjoyment, surely they all would have stayed if it were possible, right? Some of them left even though they didn't move? Despite the fact that the games were perfectly suited to your table to ensure everyone had the maximum amount of fun? How is that possible?
Cyberzombie wrote:
If you tell them that your game plays like a musical, people will give you weird looks. I mean come on man, that shit is just ridiculous and stupid. I don't know what kind of players you try to attract to your games, but I tend to go for the people that like Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, comic books and video game RPGs. I don't see ripping off the style of a Disney musical as doing anything but turning off potential players in mass numbers.
It's funny, but I remember a lot of singing in the books. The elves were singing when the Dwarves entered the valley (Tra-la), Tom Bombadil sang (The River King's Daughter), the Dwarves Sang (Far over the Misty Mountains), the Ents sang (ooom-maa something about trees being stronger than stone). There was a LOT of singing in those books.
There's also a lot of singing among people from earlier times - probably due to the fact that recorded music wasn't available. Sailors were well known singers (shanties), soldiers were well known singers (marching songs) - we think it looks silly
NOW, but for most of recorded history, singing more or less all the time on the job wasn't just
normal, it was
expected.
souran wrote:
Actually, by your own freaking logic a world were people both CAN get a bonus from playing a musical insrument prior to a social encounter and KNOW that this is the result is a world WITHOUT MUSIC.
Wow. This is all kinds of stupid and it deserves being called out.
Music and psychology are
well known phenomena. Have you ever wondered why shopping malls play Christmas Carols for 3 months of the year? Did you know that there are
known effects that increase the amount people spend when you play carols? Did you know that designing a 'soundscape' for your business or restaurant is a real job that people have. Why would you spend money to create a special 'sound' for your establishment if it didn't have a profound effect on people's psychology?
I think you'd really enjoy doing some research on all the ways we're manipulated in our daily lives by audio and visual cues - and even when we KNOW what's happening, we're pretty cool about it.
Though I have to admit, I'm tempted to start screaming at the cashiers at the next store I walk into 'YOU"RE TRYING TO CONTROL MY MIND WITH YOUR MUSIC!'