Some Base Classes I'm Not Especially Satisfied With

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:28 am

So I'm trying to break the Wizard up into a couple of different classes. And I've reached the point where I don't think I can make these any better without some actual feedback, because even though several of them look pretty terrible and one of them is actually blank (still), I haven't made any progress on making them better in weeks so clearly I'm at the stage where someone needs to tell me what I'm doing wrong. So the intended balance point of these things is Rogue.

There are a few things these classes do that are intentionally different from the norm, though. First, my games are marathons and not sprints so I do a lot to try and cut down on your ability to recover resources away from towns, and second my games assume that you become a king and his court or merchant moguls or in some other way in command of a large number of tiny men who do things and those things that they do are directly built into the game itself. The exact method for this hasn't been hammered down, but I know what the basic flow of gameplay is, so you'll occasionally see things where a class has an ability that does something like give them a free haunted castle full of helpful undead, or let them produce magic items in industrial quantities, or whatever. The relevance of these to a realm management mini-game should hopefully be obvious even though they currently have no numbers attached because that mini-game currently exists only in concept.

Also, the Artificer mentions infusions. They're a house-ruled replacement to magic items which I'm considering replacing outright now that Red Rob has his awesome Tome Items with blackjack and hookers.

Beguiler

The Beguiler is a master of illusion and enchantment. Whether it's a beautiful visage, a compelling voice, or simply force of personality, Beguilers are charismatic leaders saturated with magic. For followers, the Beguiler is the girl they love unconditionally, the glorious leader they'd die for, or both. Most of them aren't even aware their senses are being affected by magic. Beguilers are sometimes feared, as their magic is subtle while also frighteningly powerful, threatening to usurp control of the most basic building blocks of society. For most, however, a Beguiler is just another extraordinary person, and really, if you stumble into the path of someone like that, being charmed out of the way is far more pleasant than being stabbed in the neck. Beguilers often channel their magic through music and dance.

Alignment: The ability to forge an army without having to care about organization at all means that Beguilers tend towards Chaos over Law, but they can be any alignment

Hit die: d6

BAB: Poor
Fort: Poor
Ref: Poor
Will: Good

Skills: 6+INT/level
Class Skills: Bluff (CHA), Concentration (CON), Decipher Script (INT), Diplomacy (CHA), Gather Information (CHA), Intimidate (CHA), Knowledge (any) (INT), Perform (CHA), Sense Motive (WIS), Sleight of Hand (DEX), Spellcraft (INT), Use Magic Device (CHA)

Spellcasting: As Sorcerer
Casting Attribute: CHA

Starting Age: Simple
Starting gold: 4d4*10 (average 100)

Proficiencies: A Beguiler is proficient with simple weapons as well as the short sword, rapier, and scimitar, but not with any kind of armor or shields.

Abilities:

Spellcasting: Beguilers can cast spells from the Illusions and Enchantment schools only. Beguilers are spontaneous casters.

Magic Missilier (Sp): A Beguiler can cast Magic Missile at-will.

Mage (Sp): A Beguiler can cast Mage Hand at will.

Magician (Sp): A Beguiler can cast Prestidigitation at will.

Fascinating (Sp): A Beguiler with at least 3 ranks in Perform or Diplomacy can fascinate a number of creatures whose total HD does not exceed his Beguiler level. Each creature to be fascinated must be able to see the Beguiler, and the Beguiler must be able to see them. The Beguiler must make a Diplomacy or Perform check, the result of which is the DC for each affected creature's Will save against the effect. If the target's saving throw succeeds, they cannot be fascinated by the Beguiler for 24 hours. If it fails, the target is fascinated by the Beguiler until something immediately life-threatening distracts them. If they are already distracted by something immediately life-threatening, the attempt to fascinate automatically fails.

Convincing (Su): At level 2 a Beguiler can add 1/3 of their Beguiler level (rounded up) to any Bluff check so long as the target has a lower Wisdom than the Beguiler's Charisma.

Charming (Su): At level 3 a Beguiler can make a check of 1d20+CHA+half their Beguiler level against a DC of 10+the target's CL or CR. If successful, the target is automatically friendly with the Beguiler. Just like Charm Person, however, being friendly doesn't necessarily mean the target won't attack the Beguiler, just that they are reluctant to do so.

Thrall (Su): At level 4, a Beguiler gains a thrall, who acts as a cohort whose CL is equal to the Beguiler's CL minus two. This ability still applies even if leadership feats aren't allowed, and if leadership feats are allowed, the cohort granted by them is granted in addition to the thrall. The thrall cannot have a leadership score of their own, and must have a poor will save.

Inspiring (Su): At level 4, a Beguiler with at least 3 ranks in Perform or Diplomacy can inspire courage in allies (including himself), giving all allies within earshot a morale bonus to saving throws against charm and fear effects, attack rolls, and damage rolls equal to 1/4 of their Beguiler level.

Telepathy (Su): At level 5 a Beguiler can attempt to read someone's mind at-will. This attempt is treated as a spell of equal level to the highest level spell the Beguiler can cast and is resisted by Will. If the target makes their Will save, then the Beguiler cannot attempt to read their mind again for 24 hours. If the target fails, the Beguiler can read surface thoughts at will for so long as the target remains within ten feet per Beguiler level of the Beguiler. The Beguiler can try to read as many minds at once as he wants, but he must roll separately for each one. The Beguiler can optionally allow some of the minds he's broken into to read the thoughts of other minds, which means a telepathic conference call is possible so long as everyone's in range.

Enthralling (Su): At level 6, a Beguiler's leadership score is equal to CL+CHA+Beguiler level, which does mean the Beguiler levels get counted twice. Obviously this only matters if you're using your leadership score in the first place.

Mind Trick (Sp): At level 7, a Beguiler can cast Suggestion at-will on any creature whose Wisdom is lower than the Beguiler's Charisma.

Extremely Inspiring (Su): At level 9, a Beguiler who inspires an ally additionally grants them temporary hit points equal to double their Beguiler level. The bonus to saves against fear and charm effects expands to a bonus to all Will saves.

Pied Piper (Su): At level 10 a Beguiler can fascinate up 100 creatures per Beguiler level. The targeted creatures must make a Will save against 10+CHA+half Beguiler level to resist being fascinated. Creatures whose Wisdom is less than half the Beguiler's Charisma are automatically fascinated.

Beguiler Spell List:

0: Daze, Ghost Sound, Arcane Mark
1: Charm Person, Disguise Self, Magic Aura, Silent Image, Ventriloquism
2: Color Spray, Daze Monster, Hypnotism, Touch of Idiocy, Sleep, Blur, Invisibility, Magi Mouth, Minor Image, Mirror Image, Misdirection, Phantom Trap
3: Displacement, Heroism, Hold Person, Hypnotic Pattern, Illusory Script, Invisibility Sphere, Major Image, Rage, Suggestion
4: Charm Monster, Confusion, Crushing Despair, Deep Slumber, Greater Invisibility, Hallucinatory Terrain, Illusory Wall, Lesser Geas, Phantasmal Killer
5: Dominate Person, Dream, False Vision, Feeblemind, Hold Monster, Mind Fog, Mirage Arcana, Nightmare, Persistent Image, Rainbow Pattern, Seeming, Symbol of Sleep
6: Geas, Greater Heroism, Mass Suggestion, Mislead, Permanent Image, Programmed Image, Shadow Walk, Symbol of Persuasion, Veil
7: Insanity, Mass Hold Person, Mass Invisibility, Power Word Blind, Project Image, Simulacrum, Symbol of Stunning
8: Antipathy, Binding, Demand, Irresistible Dance, Maddening Scream, Power Word Stun, Symbol of Insanity, Sympathy, Mass Charm Monster, Scintillating Pattern, Screen
9: Dominate Monster, Mass Hold Monster, Power Word Kill, Shades, Weird

Elementalist

THIS SPACE FOR RENT

Necromancer

The Necromancer is a master of death, fear, and plague. Obviously unpopular with the common folk, they are capable of both summoning up powerful minions and cursing their foes will all manner of debilitating afflictions. Ultimately, Necromancers can create powerful strongholds to which they can retire...Or use as staging areas for world domination.

Alignment: Any (Playing With Fire)/any non-Good (The Crawling Darkness)

Hit die: d6

BAB: Poor
Fort: Good
Ref: Poor
Will: Good

Skills: 4+INT/level
Class Skills: Bluff (CHA), Concentration (CON), Craft (INT), Decipher Script (INT), Intimidate (CHA), Knowledge (any) (INT), Speak Language, Spellcraft (INT), Use Magic Device (CHA)

Spellcasting: As Wizard
Casting Attribute: WIS

Starting Age: Complex
Starting Gold: 4d4*10 (average 100)

Proficiencies: A Necromancer is proficient with simple weapons, but not any kind of armor or shields.

Abilities:

Spellcasting: A Necromancer can cast spells from the Necromancer spell list. He must prepare his spells in advance.

Dark Missile (Sp): A Necromancer can cast Magic Missile at-will. The damage of a Necromancer's Magic Missile is always negative energy damage.

Mage (Sp): A Necromancer can cast Mage Hand at will.

Unmaking (Sp): A Necromancer can cast Disrupt Undead at will.

Command Undead (Su): A Necromancer can command undead as a Cleric of her level. She commands undead regardless of her alignment.

Body Assemblage: At level 1, the Necromancer gains Body Assemblage as a bonus feat.

Torpor (Su): At level 2, the Necromancer can enter torpor within a Tomb (in the magical sense of being a focal point for Negative Energy, not just any building within which corpses have been interred). While in torpor, the Necromancer is completely unconscious, even if they are normally incapable of sleep. While in torpor, a Necromancer can refresh spells with only 4 hours of rest and refreshes hit points at a rate of 1 per hour per level of Necromancer. It does not matter whether or not the tomb is located on a magical nexus; all tombs are sufficiently magical for a Necromancer.

Cold As Clay (Su): At level 2, the Necromancer's body has become undead in many ways. She gains undead as a sub-type and gains DR 1/bludgeoning and magic. This DR increases by one at every even level (DR2 at level 4, DR3 at level 6, etc. etc.). The Necromancer qualifies as undead for purposes of taking [Undead] feats.

Deathly Touch: At level 3 the Necromancer gains either Enervating Touch or Paralyzing Touch as a bonus feat.

Restless: At level 4, the Necromancer gains a +2 bonus on saving throws made to resist sleep, stunning, paralysis, poison, or disease.

Master of the Dead: At level 5 and again at level 8 the Necromancer gains a bonus feat. This feat must be a Necromantic Creation feat. You must meet all pre-requisites for the feat.

Aura of Fear (Su): At level 5 the Necromancer can emit an aura of fear five feet in every direction as a free action. All creatures caught within this aura must make a Will save (10+half Necromancer level+WIS) or else be shaken and take a -2 to all attack rolls, ability checks, saving throws, and skill checks.

Tomb Raiser (Sp): At level 6 the Necromancer can cast Tomb Tile Tessillation at-will.

Plague Touch (Su): At level 7, the Necromancer becomes host to a disease selected from the list presented by Contagion. If the Necromancer successfully touches another creature, she inflicts this disease upon them as though the Contagion spell had been cast on the creature (they still get a save as normal), however the Necromancer must also make a save against the disease or else be infected themselves, however the Necromancer may roll their Will save in place of Fortitude if it is higher (this only applies to saves against their own diseases). The effects of the disease on the Necromancer wear off after 24 hours minus one hour per Necromancer level, even if they are normally permanent. This applies even if the disease is inflicted by sources other than the Necromancer's own plague touch. Every 3 levels after 7th, the Necromancer becomes host to an additional disease from the Contagion list.

Dark Citadel (Su): At level 8 the Necromancer can select a single building, fortress, or even small town with a radius of 100 feet per Necromancer level and at least thirteen corpses buried on it and immediately turn this location into a Tomb. Further, this area gains a Forsaken Graveyard, the creatures of which are loyal to the Necromancer. This Forsaken Graveyard has the standard one CR 7 creature, one CR 6 creature, two CR 5 creatures, and six CR 4 creatures, none of which remain animate if they leave the Citadel. If the Necromancer is in her Citadel when she levels up, or returns there after having leveled up, the radius affected by this ability expands by 10 feet every sunset until it is again equal to 100 feet per Necromancer level. If the Necromancer's level is ever reduced (even if she is not in her Citadel at the time), the Citadel's radius shrinks by 10 feet every sunrise until it is equal to 100 feet per Necromancer level. If the Necromancer is dead (not undead, but regularly dead) her level is considered to be 0. The Dark Citadel is automatically host to a nexus, the radius of which can be determined by the Necromancer but which cannot exceed the borders of the Dark Citadel.

Negative Energy Resistance: Beginning at 9th level, the Necromancer gains a +4 bonus on saving throws made to resist negative energy effects, including energy drain, some ability drain, and inflict spells.

Darker Citadel (Su): At level 10, the Necromancer's Dark Citadel further gains a Necromantic Intelligence loyal to the Necromancer, which is dispelled only if the Necromancer's lifeless corpse (not undead, but regularly dead) is brought onto the exact center of the nexus and a Consecrate spell is cast.

Necromancer spell list:

0: Arcane Mark, Detect Poison, Detect Magic, Detect Undead, Prestidigitation, Read Magic, Touch of Fatigue
1: Bane, Cause Fear, Chill Touch, Dark Symmetry, Deathwatch, Doom, Hide From Undead, Identify, Obscuring Mist, Ray of Enfeeblement, Sobering Skeletal Stillness, Tasha's Tomb Tainting
2: Blindness/Deafness, Command Undead, Congealing Consumption, Darkness, Death Knell, False Life, Form of Death, Ghoul Touch, Spectral Hand, Summon Swarm, Tasha's Hideous Laughter
3: Animate Dead, Crushing Despair, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Gentle Repose, Halt Undead, Puppet Dance, Ray of Exhaustion, Scare, Speak With Dead, Tasha's Tomb Transport, Vampiric Touch
4: Bestow Curse, Contagion, Death Ward, Enervation, Fear, Giant Vermin, Poison, Repel Vermin
5: Blight, Cloudkill, Curse of Crumbling Conviction, Greater Dispel Magic, Insect Plague, Magic Jar, Permanency, Slay Living, Symbol of Pain, Waves of Fatigue
6: Analyze Dweomer, Antilife Shell, Circle of Death, Create Undead, Eyebite, Symbol of Fear, Undeath to Death
7: Black Tentacles, Control Undead, Destruction, Finger of Death, Greater Arcane Sight, Symbol of Weakness, Waves of Exhaustion
8: Antimagic Field, Clone, Create Greater Undead, Horrid Wilting, Symbol of Death
9: Astral Projection, Energy Drain, Soul Bind, Wail of the Banshee

Summoner

If you've ever wanted to play a Final Fantasy-style summoner, with a heavy-hitting and temporary, probably freaky looking summon, this is the class for you.

Alignment: Any

Hit die: d6

BAB: Poor
Fort: Poor
Ref: Poor
Will: Good

Skills: 4+INT/level
Class Skills: Bluff (CHA), Concentration (CON), Craft (INT), Decipher Script (INT), Knowledge (any) (INT), Speak Language, Spellcraft (INT), Use Magic Device (CHA)

Spellcasting: As Sorcerer
Casting Attribute: INT

Starting Age: Complex
Starting Gold: 4d4*10 (average 100)

Proficiencies: A Summoner is proficient with simple weapons, but not any kind of armor or shields.

Abilities:

Blaster (Sp): The Summoner can cast Magic Missile at-will.

Mage (Sp): The Summoner can cast Mage Hand at-will.

Spellcasting: The Summoner can cast spells from the Summoner spell list. The Summoner must prepare their spells in advance.

Summoning: The Summoner learns Summon Monster spells for free as soon as she is able to cast them.

Spontaneous Summoning: The Summoner can channel stored spell energy into summon spells the Summoner did not prepare ahead of time. The Summoner can "lose" any prepared spell in order to cast any Summon spell of the same spell level or lower, so long as she knows the Summon spell.

Eidolon: The Summoner can cast a Summon Monster spell to summon up his Eidolon, a powerful creature which he has not called from some other plane, but rather created from the raw ether. Each level of the Summon Monster spell summons one, specific Eidolon. These can each by different stages of the same creature growing more powerful over time, or a whole menagerie of different creatures, but either way you can only have one for each Summon Monster spell you know. While the Eidolon is summoned, the Summoner cannot cast any spells.

The Eidolon's alignment must be within one step of the Summoner's. The Eidolon's type is always Outsider, and it can have subtypes appropriate to its alignment. By default, the Eidolon has d8 HD equal to double the level of the spell used to summon it, BAB and one good save equal to the level of the spell used to summon it, two bad saves equal to half the level of the spell used to summon it (rounded up), and a number of skill points equal to four times the level of the spell used to summon it. The Summoner can pick any ten class skills to assign to its Eidolon. The Eidolon's attributes are always 16/14/12/12/10/8.

The Eidolon automatically gets either a natural weapon or masterwork weapons of the Summmoner's choice. In the former case, this weapon can be a slam attack for 1d10 damage, two claw attacks for 1d6 damage each, or a bite attack for 1d12 damage and a -2 penalty to-hit. In the latter case, the weapons automatically vanish when the Eidolon is slain or disarmed, and the Eidolon may call the weapons back into its hands as a free action. Every round at the end of its turn, the Eidolon takes 1d4 damage as it is called back into the ether which spawned it. When it is slain, it is dissipated into the ether entirely and can be immediatley resummoned with the appropriate spell.

In addition, the Summoner can pick a number of traits equal to one plus the level of the spell used to summon the Eidolon from the following list to add to their Eidolon. Each Eidolon can have a different set of traits.

Armored: The Eidolon gains natural armor equal to the level of the spell used to summon it.

Blaster: The Eidolon may cast Magic Missile at-will as a spell-like ability of caster level equal to its HD. Each bolt deals 1d6+HD damage rather than 1d4.

Caster: The Eidolon may cast one spell of a level equal to one less than the level of the spell used to summon it. This spell can be from any school. The Eidolon's spells are refreshed after spending at least 24 hours in the ether. This trait can be chosen multiple times. Each time grants one extra spell.

Evasive: The Eidolon gains the benefit of the Evasion ability. This trait may be taken twice. The second time, the Eidolon gains Improved Evasion.

Feat: The Eidolon can take any feat. This trait can be chosen multiple times. Each time grants one extra feat.

Healthy: The Eidolon's hit die is now a d12.

Improved Save: One of the Eidolon's saves is doubled. This trait can be taken up to three times. Each time it must be applied to a different save.

Resistant: The Eidolon gains SR equal to the level of the spell used to summon it. This trait can be taken twice. The second time the trait is taken, the Eidolon's SR is doubled.

Skilled: The Eidolon gains additional skill points equal to four times the level of the spell used to summon it. This trait may be taken twice.

Warrior: The Eidolon's BAB is equal to double the level of the spell used to summon it.

Plane Walk (Sp): At 9th level, the Summoner can cast Plane Shift as a spell-like ability by first preparing a ten-minute ritual. The Summoner can only use this ritual to shift to a plane he's been to before.

Summoner spell list:

0: Acid Splash, Arcane Mark, Detect Magic, Prestidigitation, Read Magic
1: Comprehend Languages, Grease, Identify, Mage Armor, Mount, Obscuring Mist, Shield, Summon Monster I, Unseen Servant
2: Acid Arrow, Detect Thoughts, Fog Cloud, Glitterdust, Locate Object, Obscure Object, Summon Monster II, Summon Swarm, Web
3: Arcane Sight, Dispel Magic, Lesser Telepathic Bond, Nondetection, Phantom Steed, Sepia Snake Sigil, Sleet Storm, Summon Monster III, Tongues
4: Dimensional Anchor, Dimension Door, Stinking Cloud, Stoneskin, Summon Monster IV, Teleport
5: Contact Other Plane, Coudkill, Dismissal, Lesser Planar Binding, Mage's Faithful Hound, Mage's Private Sanctum, Permanency, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Summon Monster V, Telepathic Bond
6: Analyze Dweomer, Antimagic Field, Greater Dispel Magic, Greater Teleport Planar Binding, Repulsion, Summon Monster VI
7: Banishment, Black Tentacles, Greater Arcane Sight, Instant Summons, Phase Door, Plane Shift, Summon Monster VII, Sequester, Solid Fog, Teleport Object
8: Acid Fog, Dimensional Lock, Greater Planar Binding, Greater Prying Eyes, Incendiary Cloud, Maze, Mind Blank, Summon Monster VIII, Trap the Soul
9: Gate, Mage's Disjunction, Refuge, Summon Monster IX, Teleportation Circle

Artificer

The source of most of those magic items you see lying around, the Artificer is a fairly capable combatant in addition to having access to powerful support magic and the ability to craft magical items and infusions, eventually on a mass scale.

Alignment: Any

Hit die: d6

BAB: Medium
Fort: Poor
Ref: Poor
Will: Good

Skills: 4+INT/level
Class Skills: Bluff (CHA), Concentration (CON), Craft (INT), Decipher Script (INT), Knowledge (any) (INT), Speak Language, Spellcraft (INT), Use Magic Device (CHA)

Spellcasting: As Wizard
Casting Attribute: INT

Starting Age: Complex
Starting Gold: 4d4*10 (average 100)

Proficiencies: An Artificer is proficient with simple and martial weapons, but not any kind of armor or shields.

Abilities:

Spellcasting: The Artificer can cast spells from the Abjuration and Transmutation schools. The Artificer must prepare their spells in advance.

Mage (Sp): The Artificer can cast Mage Hand at-will.

Mark (Sp): The Artificer can cast Arcane Mark at-will.

Animate Object (Sp): The Artificer may sacrifice a spell to animate an object, which acts as the Artificer directs for the next ten minutes per level of Artificer, at which point it becomes inanimate again. The level of the spell sacrificed depends on the size of the object to be animated, according to the chart below. The level of the spell sacrificed must be at least as high as the chart indicates; it can also be higher.

0: Tiny
1: Small
2: Medium
3: Large
4: Huge
5: Gargantuan
7: Colossal

Armored Caster: At second level, the Artificer does not suffer from arcane spell failure while wearing light or medium armor.

Runes (Su): At second level, and every two levels thereafter until tenth level, the Artificer learns a new rune from the list below. The Artificer can have a number of active runes equal to his Artificer level. Every time the rune is used, add a notch to the rune and roll a d6. If you roll under the number of notches on the rune, the rune fades and cannot be used any longer. Track the notches on each rune separately. Inscribing the rune requires that the Artificer be within range of a nexus, and takes ten minutes. Since most of these require a swift action to activate and remain active for only one round, it isn't advisable to put all of the runed equipment on a single character. If you have learned multiple runes, it's usually best to spread them out to a couple of different party members.

Fehu: Applied to a staff, rod, cane, or wand (regardless of whether or not it is magical). When the wielder casts a spell, they can attempt to retain it as a swift action by rolling a Will save against whatever the spell's save DC is (even if it normally targets a different save or doesn't even allow a save at all). If the save is successful, the spell is retained. Otherwise, the wielder is dazed for one round. Add a notch to the rune regardless of whether the spell is successfully retained.

Uruz: Applied to a weapon. On a successful hit, the wielder of the weapon can choose to instantly turn the hit into a confirmed critical. Adds one notch every time it is used.

Jera: Applied to armor. Can be activated as a swift action to grant Fast Healing equal to the wearer's character level for one round.

Gebo: Applied to a staff, rod, cane, or wand (regardless of whether or not it is magical). The wielder can choose to raise the save DC of spells cast by 2. Add one notch for every save DC raised.

Kenaz: Applied to a weapon. On a successful hit, the wielder of the weapon can choose to have their opponent set on fire. Adds one notch every time it is used.

Algiz: Applied to armor. Can be activated as a swift action to grant DR equal to the wearer's character level for one round. Adds one notch for every turn active.

Laguz: Applied to armor. When struck, the wearer can activate it as an immediate action to convert the damage to healing instead. Add a notch for every attack that is converted to healing.

Mannaz: Applied to gloves or gauntlets. As a move action, the wearer can heal themselves or anyone they can touch for 1d8 for every two character levels they have, rounded up. Add a notch every time someone is healed.

Dagaz: Applied to armor. When affected by a spell, the wearer can take a +2 untyped bonus to the save against the spell for one save only. Add one notch every time a save is boosted.

Arcane Wielder (Su): At third level the Artificer can wield a weapon with his magic. Every third level thereafter, he can command an additional weapon with his magic. The Artificer must be proficient with the weapon in order to wield it magically. When drawn, the weapons float within five feet of the Artificer, reacting according to his will. The weapons are not autonomous; if the Artificer is killed or knocked unconscious, they immediately drop to the ground. The Artificer sets the weapons as either offensive or defensive when they are drawn, and can change them to a new configuration with a swift action. When in offensive position, the Artificer may make one attack with each weapon wielded by his magic whenever he makes a full-attack. When in the defensive position, each weapon provides a +2 protection bonus to his AC. Yes, a protection bonus and not a shield bonus. If a ray of something nasty hits a weapon floating three feet away from you, you're going to be fine, so this totally applies to your Touch AC. Ranged weapons like longbows or crossbows are too complicated to be wielded magically, however the arrows and bolts can simply be levitated into the air and then hurled as though from a ranged weapon regardless. However, the ammo from a ranged weapon cannot be used defensively; they're too thin, and attacks cleave straight through them. Likewise, thrown weapons like javelins cannot be automatically retrieved unless you are within five feet of them.

Artifice: Every 4th level, the Artificer gains a bonus item creation feat.

Alchemy Student: At 4th level, the Artificer can concoct one of mercury, iron, and copper infusions. At each level thereafter except 11th, the Artificer can concoct one additional infusion from this list, until they can no longer learn any new infusions. Concocting one of these infusions costs 3.000 GP in raw materials. These infusions have a Craft (Alchemy) DC of 25 and a base work period of 1 day. These infusions count as a Masterpiece.

Servitor (Su): At 5th level, the Artificer can craft a single servitor construct. The servitor has a Craft DC of 20 using whatever Craft the Artificer wants and 500 GP in raw materials (the servitor should look appropriate to the Craft skill used to make it), with a base work period of 1 week. This servitor has stats of a level 1 Astral Construct. Though it has no skills, this servitor can make Craft checks as though it were its master. Likewise, it can use its master's craft feats, however the servitor cannot craft Masterpieces. Unless it is masterwork, the servitor must always take 10 on its Craft checks. If there is opportunity for employment nearby, the Servitor can make up to 15 GP per day as a craftsman, or up to 150 GP if it is masterwork.

Autonomous Workshop: At 7th level, the Artificer can craft a number of servitors equal to his Artificer level. Like all his non-Masterpiece works, the Artificer's servitor can craft the new servitors for him. The materials cost of crafting a servitor is reduced to 250 GP.

Alchemy Expert: At 8th level, the list of infusions the Artificer can learn to concoct expands to include lead, tin, and silver infusions. Concocting one of these infusions costs 5.000 GP in raw materials. These infusions have a Craft (Alchemy) DC of 30 and a base work period of 1 day. These infusions count as a Masterpiece, however infusions from the Alchemy Student ability can now be crafted at will.

Assembly Line (Su): At 9th level, the Artificer can craft a number of servitors equal to ten times his Artificer level. The materials cost of crafting a servitor is reduced to 100 GP.

Alchemy Master: At 10th level, the Artificer can concoct one of gold, orichalcum, adamantine, or mithral infusions. Concocting one of these infusions costs 7.500 GP in raw materials. These infusions have a Craft (Alchemy) DC of 35 and a base work period of 1 week. These infusions count as a Masterpiece, however infusions from the Alchemy Expert list can now be crafted at will.

Artificer spell list:

0: Mending, Message, Open/Close, Prestidigitaion
1: Animate Rope, Enlarge Person, Erase, Expeditious Retreat, Feather Fall, Identify, Jump, Mage Armor, Magic Weapon, Reduce Person, True Strike, Unseen Servant
2: Alter Self, Arcane Lock, Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, Cat's Grace, Darkvision, Eagle's Splendor, Fox's Cunning, Knock, Levitate, Owl's Wisdom, Pyrotechnics, Spider Climb, Whispering Wind
3: Arcane Sight, Dispel Magic, Blink, Flame Arrow, Fly, Gaseous Form, Greater Magic Weapon, Haste, Keen Edge, Secret Page, Shrink Item, Slow, Water Breathing
4: Mass Enlarge Person, Mass Reduce Person, Minor Creation, Secure Shelter, Stone Shape
5: Animal Growth, Break Enchantment, Fabricate, Major Creation, Overland Flight, Passwall, Permanency, Telekinesis, Tranmuste Mud to Rock, Wall of Stone
6: Analyze Dweomer, Antimagic Field, Control Water, Disintegrate, Hardening, Greater Dispel Magic, Mass Bear's Endurance, Mass Bull's Strength, Mass Cat's Grace, Mass Eagle's Splendor, Mass Fox's Cunning, Mass Owl's Wisdom, Move Earth, Stone to Flesh, Transformation, Wall of Iron
7: Control Weather, Ethereal Jaunt, Greater Arcane Sight, Mage's Magnificent Mansion, Reverse Gravity, Statue
8: Iron Body, Mind Blank, Temporal Stasis
9: Etherealness, Mage's Disjunction, Time Stop

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 7:20 am

If your goal is to get people to do marathon adventures with no resting, and you want characters to play nice with the Rogue, why are you keeping Spells per Day as a mechanic? Spells per Day directly and explicitly incentivizes people to go rest, something you claim you don't want people to do. Spell slots also pretty much require the existence of Save or Lose mechanics, which are pretty much assured to leave the Rogue in the dust at higher levels. Fuck man, you got Charm Monster front and center, so I don't know how you expected this to go down.

If you want to bring down the casters to the level of the Rogue, and you want to bring the casters' encounter endurance up to the level of the Rogue, why are you basing the class chassis around the Sorcerer instead of the Rogue?

-Username17

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 7:35 am

also, please use tables, man. The code set up is below

Code: Select all

&#91;table&#93;
&#91;row &#40;or mrow to bold&#41;&#93; &#40;stuff&#41; &#91;col &#40;or mcol to bold&#41;&#93; &#40;stuff&#41;
&#123;repeat as needed&#125;
&#91;/table&#93;

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 8:35 am

FrankTrollman wrote:If your goal is to get people to do marathon adventures with no resting, and you want characters to play nice with the Rogue, why are you keeping Spells per Day as a mechanic?

If memory serves, it was because it seemed a lot easier at start to pillage as much of my content as possible from existing sources, doubly so if those sources would be familiar to my players. I had some house rules that made it more difficult to refresh spells on a whim (and freebies like Rope Trick were simply banned), but the more I think about it, the more it seems like a better idea to just chuck the Spell Compendium into an incinerator.

Red_Rob · Post by **Red_Rob** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:40 am

I don't think Frank was saying chuck out spells per se, just to rethink your resource schedule. For example, you could give Wizards drastically less spell slots but allow them to recover them with a 5 minute ritual, or have some portion of their spells "combat ready" whilst the others are available but take more time to cast.

Now, you say you want your games to be "marathons, not sprints" however you also say you "cut down on your ability to recover resources outside towns". This sounds like you are saying you want the workday to mean what the designers of 3e wanted it to mean - that the players have a limited amount of resources that they are expected to expend over the adventure, and that they are forced to ration these over multiple encounters. Unfortunately these are competing goals, most clearly seen in the design of the 3e Wizard. It was expected that the Wizard would have to ration their spells over several encounters, usually only using maybe one of their highest level spells in each. This meant that by design the Wizard's spells had to be better than anything the other classes could do on a per-use comparison, however if players find a way to rest after every encounter they just get to nova and outshine every other class option. I don't think this happens in actual games as much as theorycraft would have you believe, but it does happen and the results are clear.

Ultimately in an open ended game like an RPG i don't know if you can effectively prevent players from finding ways to recover resources that you didn't anticipate, which means the design of the 3e casters may not be salvageable, unfortunately. The problem is that 3e is pretty much founded on the idea that the classes will have some form of non-renewable resource that will be depleted over time, until the party is forced to retreat and rest. It's right there in the CR guidelines "amount of resources depleted".

Possibly having Wizards get their spells back at the same time every day like Clerics might help, although it only curbs the worst abuses. Removing "free rest" spells like Rope Trick would obviously help, but pitching up tents is always an option. Basically if you keep spells per day you are going to have to accept that you are incentivising your players to find ways to break the system, and when they do they will be more effective as a result.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:27 pm

For the Elemental Siphon I mostly made up my own mechanics without directly stealing spells.

For the Force Potentate, I 90% stole mechanics from existing spells.

You know what both those things have in common? Neither one has spells per day. You can base everything off existing game resources without using the existing resource management system.

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:27 pm

I think spells per encounter works better anyway, as it means you can actually try to get info and prepare for things. The problem with daily preparation is that usually either:
A) You don't really know what you'll be facing, so you just prepare the same stuff every day, with a few "no brainer" options like Water Breathing when the goal is underwater.
B) You have enough info/scrying on the enemies that you could probably just skip 90% of the adventure anyway.

There's a middle ground there, but it's difficult to hit. With per-encounter preparation, you can feasibly have someone scout ahead, or try to capture a foe for questioning, and have that matter.

Now regarding "long term" resources, as in stuff that you only get back between adventures, it's pretty tricky to do. The problem is this:
* If it's that much of a pain to get back, you'd expect it to be pretty potent.
* If it's that potent, then there's be a big difference between everybody having theirs at the crucial moment and nobody having it.
* Enough difference that you likely would fail if everybody blew theirs at a pointless time.
* Which means that when they do just that, they'll want to go back home and rest before trying to take on the rest of the adventure.
* If they can, then you just have a stupider version of the 5-minute workday.
* If they can't, then I guess they just fail and die horribly.
* And if everyone is super-paranoid about rationing their super-moves, those moves may never even get used.

You can go the 4E route, where your ultimate secret reserve move is ... like 1d6 more than your normal crap, and moves people a couple more squares. But nobody likes that, so don't do it.

You can also run things "Roguelike-style", where TPK is not an uncommon event, and hopefully everybody's new character will be more judicious with their resources. But that's not a style that will suit every campaign.

Or you can implement "bonus goals" to every/most adventure, where if you saved your awesome stuff for the right moment, you can save all the sacrifices, grab the throne of dark power for your sitting room, and generally be awesome. If you splurged early but otherwise didn't fuck up too bad, you can at least stop the ritual without too many people dying and escape before the tower falls apart on you. That's some extra work though, and you have to figure out how it's justified.

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:49 am

Is there any particular reason you can't just use HP as your longterm mechanic? It's the one thing that bad guys very consistently attack. Granted, that breaks down at higher levels, but so does everything else. Of course, there's also the issue of doing the 5-minute workday thing but for HP. That said, the way I structure my campaigns makes 5-minute workdays a bad idea by default, since time limits are pretty much built in to the system I've developed for populating a setting with quests.

Foxwarrior · Post by **Foxwarrior** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:34 pm

Well, if your healing is done using (daily) Healing Surges that can only be spent during 5-minute rests, you have a way to bring the workday up to 20 minutes.

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:58 pm

If you've only got three days until the end of the world, players will go from scheming to find a way to rest for 8 hours after 5 minutes of adventuring to scheming to find a way to cram 36 hours of adventuring into a single 24-hour day with no rest.

Foxwarrior · Post by **Foxwarrior** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:05 pm

That's true. If you've got a system for reliably creating such situations, I would like to study it.

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:33 pm

Chamomile wrote:If you've only got three days until the end of the world, players will go from scheming to find a way to rest for 8 hours after 5 minutes of adventuring to scheming to find a way to cram 36 hours of adventuring into a single 24-hour day with no rest.

That's just the "You can't recharge resources" case though. Let's say you only get one chance to save the world, so you need to ratio your powers carefully. Then people roll badly, misjudge an encounter as more important than it is, and blow their wad early. I guess the world is destroyed?

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:40 am

Ice9 wrote:That's just the "You can't recharge resources" case though. Let's say you only get one chance to save the world, so you need to ratio your powers carefully. Then people roll badly, misjudge an encounter as more important than it is, and blow their wad early. I guess the world is destroyed?

It is true of any game with any kind of failure state that you may eventually reach that failure state. You do need to give your players some breathing room so that if they screw up once, they have enough time to retreat, rest up, and try again before the world ends. You could also have the failure state be not "the world ends" but rather "the situation gets worse," and then you put them on a new timer for the situation getting even worse than that. Thus, they can't technically lose but things can go on getting worse and worse indefinitely, which means they'll have to fight their way up through more and more stages of badness before they can actually make the world better than it was when they started.

That's true. If you've got a system for reliably creating such situations, I would like to study it.

Sure, let's talk about some stuff I've made that I actually like. I think it was K who mentioned that what D&D games really need is a good adventuring subsystem and then you can build the rest around that. I dunno if that's true, but I happen to have an adventuring system, so it'd be cool if it was.

First off, geography and travel (bear with me, we'll talk about quests and time limits and such later, this is important groundwork). Your campaign world is divided up into a number of regions. Each of these regions is defined as being approximately 140 miles from the middle of one to the middle of the other, thus corresponding to about a week of travel on foot or half that on horse. Every week you travel, you make a Fort save against weariness based on how dangerous the region is, and if you fail you take some HP damage. Natural healing can only happen while in town because of magic (I have some rules for an excrutiatingly slow healing process outside of magically supported towns for simulation problems, but they're slow enough that PCs will basically never be in a position where it's more expedient to camp outside the dungeon door than retreat all the way to town, where they can insta-heal overnight).

So when a region is more dangerous it's harder to travel through (and also it does stuff like stop caravans from getting through if it's especially dangerous, which limits your empire-building from level 6 on). A region is more or less dangerous based on how many quests there are in it. A Peaceful region has zero available quests and a Fort save DC 5, often abbreviated to "you pass, just move on." For every additional quest, the Fort save is increased by 5, and the territory becomes Restless, Border, Dangerous, or Hostile. I personally have no more than four quests to a region but there's no reason you couldn't make a region McFuckindarkbad if you wanted to. My players are still low-level, granted, but are nevertheless already pretty terrified of DC 25 Hostile regions as it is. I also have a random encounter system tied to this, but since it's really easy to run away from practically anything on horseback, there's hardly any point, so I won't waste space talking about that until I find or make some decent chase rules. Regardless, your followers cannot safely pass through a region if it is Border or worse, which means you want everything within the borders of your kingdom, trade empire, church, or whatever to be Restless or Peaceful.

So obviously the incentive to solve quests is, besides the treasure offered, the fact that it makes it easier to get from place to place and lets you expand your empire. Those last two are only helped if you keep the total number of available quests in a certain region low enough. And this is where time limits come in, because there are all kinds of things you can do with those.

Spawner Quests regularly generate new quests every few weeks (or based on a die roll, or whatever), which is bad. If a bordering territory is at least three steps less hostile than the region the spawner quest is actually in, the spawner quest will push an old quest out to that region when it makes a new one. So if a spawner quest is in a dangerous or hostile region and that border region is next to a peaceful region, and then the spawner quest spawns a new quest, that new quest will push an old quest out into the peaceful region, thus making it restless. Since there's now only one step between the region housing the spawner quest and its neighbor, the next quest spawned won't push anything out, and that region will become hostile (if it isn't already). I cap regions at hostile, and if a region is full a quest will be shunted out as far as it needs to go. Thus a single spawner quest could hypothetically overwhelm an entire continent if the PCs are really lazy (or spend nine months on the level 1 Kobold dungeon using the 5-minute workday).

Of course, this incentivizes hitting the forboding dark towers first and then mopping up the quests to hunt down the ettin raiders that the tower has been producing, which is kind of backwards. So a lot of spawner quests are also fortified quests, which are harder to beat the more of their spawned quests are out and about. Obviously you have to make sure it's possible for the PCs to focus fire on the spawned quests and put them down faster than the spawner can replace them, otherwise they'll get locked in a failure loop. And that's also why the quests spawned by a spawner quest should never be fortified by quests that are also spawned. You get an exponential thing and sooner or later the players can't hope to keep up (although you could use that as an emergent game over screen if you wanted).

And there's also burning eyes quests, named for the Stranger With Burning Eyes, these quests jump into the body of another quest when they die, usually a quest they can spawn (typically with the stipulation that this resets the timer on their quest spawning). Sometimes this is automatic, but sometimes it involves an NPC who runs away as soon as you're bogged down fighting his perimeter guards. You can hypothetically intercept him and end things early, but he's built to be hard to catch, thus funneling the players into weeding out one hideout after another until they finally have the silppery bastard cornered. Typically when there's no quests left for him to run away to, I decline to have him run away and hide all by himself and give the players the final battle they have well and truly earned. You can also use this concept to represent a disorganized horde overrunning a region that won't go away until you kill every single one, but represent it in such a way that won't trigger exponential quest spawning game overs.

And finally there are hibernating quests, where the monsters basically just stay in their dungeon until a certain amount of time has passed or a certain action is performed, and then they wake up and start contributing to regional menace. Usually these are things that you can solve before they wake up, and that's usually advisable because they are usually also fortified spawner quests that spawn fairly quickly.

You can probably find other nifty things to do with the basic concept of "waiting around means more quests spawn."

Foxwarrior · Post by **Foxwarrior** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:32 am

This sounds like an awful lot of quests. Is each one meant to take less than an hour to beat? When the players are high enough level, do they simply make a region Peaceful by landing on it if it's not too dangerous? What defines the EL of the enemies fought? To what extent is the DM supposed to make up details for a quest on the spot? A spawner might make three similar quests on the same space (cauldron-born ettin raiders are making trouble); are players supposed to take on each quest individually, or do multiple quests in a space combine somehow?

You can also consider Limited Ontological Inertia spawned quests: When you slay the Necromancer, his undead deanimate; when you conquer Camelot, most of its armies disband, and only a few become bandits instead.

Overall, this looks like a pretty nifty idea, and it makes me seriously wonder whether I should have something like it.

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:03 am

Foxwarrior wrote:This sounds like an awful lot of quests. Is each one meant to take less than an hour to beat? When the players are high enough level, do they simply make a region Peaceful by landing on it if it's not too dangerous?

Spawned quests are sometimes quickies that you can do for a bit of extra gold or XP, since I hand out XP on a per-quest basis (I am irrationally attached to the notion of gaining XP rather than just handing out levels, and I find that my players are usually either like-minded or don't care). Also, the local governments will clean up spawned quests in their own due time, which basically works as a reverse-spawner quest: Once the spawner quest is defeated, the government/your allies/whatever instead starts despawning the leftovers on more or less the same timer. If you want bonus XP/loot, you can help hunt them down. I find my players are often willing to take a brief detour to take care of a fairly trivial spawned quest so long as it won't cost them in-game time, and often don't especially care that they spent 2-3 realtime hours on a quest that is virtually guaranteed to have come back by the time they're taking on the spawner, just because that quest is on the way to where they're going.

Also, yeah, if you're crazy like me and make a campaign with like 16 regions then you have created a gigantic campaign that will take something like 70-80 sessions to complete in its entirety. Don't do this unless you're playing weekly and your group is stable. If you can only manage one game a month, you'll probably want to go with a four or five region setting. In fact, by tweaking the travel times and spawn speeds, you could have a region be of variable size, from Sigil where travel time is measured in hours to a global campaign where it's measured in months.

What defines the EL of the enemies fought? To what extent is the DM supposed to make up details for a quest on the spot?

I am really bad at working on a deadline, so all of my campaigns are set up such that I have to do as little preparatory work for each session as possible. And this system has been a huge success in that regard. I have the monster stat blocks, rough maps (we play without a grid; adding a grid would make this much harder), and basic motivations of major players involved prepared in advance and I can go from there. Thus, the EL of the enemies fought is determined in advance and the only things I have to make up on the spot are usually minor characters, a complication caused by previous party actions, or other things that are impossible to plan for (but also come with the territory).

Also, this is a hot-button issue that I normally wouldn't bring up, but it's integral to my design here: I believe RPGs can have a degree of objective difficulty, and even though it's ridiculous and stupid to compare performance on adventure modules run by separate GMs or to boast about playing D&D on nightmare mode or whatever, it seems self-evident to me that it is possible to run an adventure where if the party does one thing they will probably succeed and if they do another they will probably fail. So my campaign is built with the assumption that it is reasonable to expect my players to plan on escape routes, scout ahead carefully, roll some gather information, or something similar and make sure they have a decent idea of what they're dealing with before they charge in swords swinging. And my party has in fact been able to pick up that a certain region (which they have nicknamed Mordor) is probably out of their league and they should hold off on it for a few levels.

A spawner might make three similar quests on the same space (cauldron-born ettin raiders are making trouble); are players supposed to take on each quest individually, or do multiple quests in a space combine somehow?

Each quest is supposed to be done separately, but you can get someone else to clean them up for you in the aftermath as described above. Sometimes it might be more expedient to just storm a fortified quest rather than cut through all the spawned ones, and in any case I am good enough at making interesting new characters and locations up that I can probably make three different "kill ettin raider" quests reasonably interesting. Even then, if a spawner is expected to be spawning a lot of quests, I typically give it a roster of three or four to burn through. Usually these are similar (ettin raiders, dryder raiders), but distinct enough that players should feel like they're making progress in an epic battle against the Temple of Tiamat rather than grinding through quest pre-requisites so they can finally reach the climax.

If I were talking to a newer GM, someone who ends up in the GM's chair because they drew the short straw, or anyone else who is not as obsessed as me (which is probably most people) I'd recommend having each spawned quest of the same type be treated in actual, tactical play as a single quest that gets bulked up a bit with each additional iteration of the quest spawned.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:31 am

This quest system sounds pretty interesting. Have you considered starting a thread for your campaign setting?

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:10 am

Avoraciopoctules wrote:This quest system sounds pretty interesting. Have you considered starting a thread for your campaign setting?

I don't see why anyone would want to read it. It's a passable but not amazing setting, and the neat quest system is something I've already posted.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:23 am

A more specific example of this system in play might be helpful for someone thinking about implementing it.

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:01 am

Chamomile wrote:Quest system ...

That sounds pretty cool actually.

I'm working on an "asynchronous" campaign where each player is doing the kingdom/expansion thing, so I may use that, if I can stop procrastinating and get the other components made.

Red_Rob · Post by **Red_Rob** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:44 pm

I like this quest system - it adds a loose framework to formalise something that you should be keeping track of anyway, but could easily get forgotten during play. I like the idea of an area getting more dangerous the more adventure seeds there are present - rather than abstract it to a Fort check I might have the random encounter table for an area have entries for "Quest 1 random encounter" up to "Quest 4 random encounter". Each quest location would list what encounter it contributes, but if there are less incomplete adventures in the area then those results give no random encouter, making journeys safer and less eventful.

The spawner / timer thing is cool, basically ensuring the world feels like things are happening if the players don't deal with threats. That was something I've been wondering how to implement as I'll be running a sandboxy game next, so these are great ideas.

Chamomile wrote:Also, the Artificer mentions infusions. They're a house-ruled replacement to magic items which I'm considering replacing outright now that Red Rob has his awesome Tome Items with blackjack and hookers.

Glad you liked them, I have random item tables designed to spit out Tome items that I could post if they would be any use.

The Gaming Den

Some Base Classes I'm Not Especially Satisfied With

Some Base Classes I'm Not Especially Satisfied With

Re: Some Base Classes I'm Not Especially Satisfied With