So now its official...abusive magic item pricing is nixed.

[User3]

Link to WOTC.

[Zherog]

Is this the Ring of True Strike for 400,000? WotC's site is blocked from my office (stupid fucking firewall).

[Boulie_98]

Moral of the story: 'We're sorry about including that pricing table for custom magic item creation, pretend it's not actually there' says WotC.

[Sma]

Yes.

[Username17]

Yeah, it's the tirade about how a Ring of True Strike could cost 400,000 gp. Unfortuantely, all the hand waving involved in coming up with that description makes it no longer function like the True Strike spell at all - and is not reproduceable for any other thing you wanted to do.

Heck, consider this gem:

No spell is analogous to what this item does (though the animate objects spell comes close). However, plenty of other figurines of wondrous power are in the Dungeon Master's Guide. A limestone crab is about as tough as a griffon (see the Far Corners of the World feature for monstrous crab stats), so pricing equals the bronze griffon figurine of 10,000 gp.

Thanks, asshole. If I wanted something as simple as "Do whatever the fvck you feel like" - I wouldn't even bother looking up rules on line. This tirade is less than useless.

We already knew that you couldn't make a Ring of Truestrike for 2000 gp, because True Strike ends itself automatically the first time you attack. But they didn't actually address why you couldn't make a command word activated Ring of True Strike for 1800 gp - or for that matter a command word activated ring of divine quickened true strike for 1800 gp...

-Username17

[Neeek]

It seems to me that claiming that no spell is analogous to a limestone crab is flawed. It's a less flexible, longer duration summon monster spell, for most uses as far as I'm concerned.

[The_Hanged_Man]

Scary: Zherog knows what happens at WotC even when he can't see the site! He has magic powers!

* * *

I think that's a little too hard on them. Althought they may just be saying to price things at what seems right, they're at least giving some examples of what things should be. That's worth something. Maybe not much, but something.

I don't get why those figurines are so expensive anyway. They're all a pile of crap. That Crab gives you all the benefits of Tensers Floating Disc, Phantom Steed, and Summon Monster III. Twice per week. Meh.

[Username17]

Really? The Bronze Griffin is my pick for "best medium magic item for low level play". If I'm walking in there as a 4th level character, I would way rather have a Bronze Griffin and a +1 Bow than a +3 Bow. And that combo costs less than a +3 Bow.

Like any animal companions, we lose interest in them over time - but at low levels adding a Griffin to the table is a must. It's a really really huge improvement to your forces both in and out of combat.

If more magic items were like the Bronze Griffin and less of them were like the Monk's Belt, I'd be happier all around.

-Username17

[Zherog]

1106181775[/unixtime]]Scary: Zherog knows what happens at WotC even when he can't see the site! He has magic powers!

While I'll agree that I can be quite scary, as far as I know I do not have telepathic powers. I read about it on WotC's message boards - which, oddly, are not blocked by the firewall at work.

[RandomCasualty]

1106175791[/unixtime]]Moral of the story: 'We're sorry about including that pricing table for custom magic item creation, pretend it's not actually there' says WotC.

Yup, it's a good move too actually.

I mean seriously, no price guidelines can cover everything anyway. They should have just told people to look up equivalent items and go from there instead of bothering to include pricing guidelines for always on spells and crap like that.

Always on items don't tend to be about paying for a spell slot. Most of the time, the spell slot is irrelevant. They're about buying extra actions. Your buying an extra action(s) so you dont' actually have to cast the spell. And that's an entirely different pricing scheme.

And there's no way to get a system to price every ability, the game is far too complex for that, meaning eyeballing it really is the best system.

Of course, Skip even used his own pricing formula wrong as he should have priced that +20 true strike bonus as an epic bonus, but other than that, I agree with him in concept.

Seriously you're better having no rule than a bad rule, and the instant your pen touches the paper making a general magic item pricing rule, your'e making a bad rule.

[MrWaeseL]

No I wouldn't pay 400,000 for a ring of true striking! Dickhead

[The_Hanged_Man]

1106182338[/unixtime]]Really? The Bronze Griffin is my pick for "best medium magic item for low level play". If I'm walking in there as a 4th level character, I would way rather have a Bronze Griffin and a +1 Bow than a +3 Bow. And that combo costs less than a +3 Bow.

Like any animal companions, we lose interest in them over time - but at low levels adding a Griffin to the table is a must. It's a really really huge improvement to your forces both in and out of combat.

If more magic items were like the Bronze Griffin and less of them were like the Monk's Belt, I'd be happier all around.

-Username17

It's the lost interest thing. You could just take a bundle of Summon Animal scrolls, a bundle of Animal Growth (can't remember the 3.5 name) scrolls, and have just about all the fun of Griffin for 1/2 the cost. And you'd probably have a bunch of useful scrolls left over when you were bored w/ those SUmmon Animal scolls. I'm not overly impressed w/ the "permanent" magic items that are only kewl for about 5 uses.

[Username17]

It's more than that, though. Bronze Griffins last a damned long time. Long enough to transport people around at Griffin speeds (which are not slow), long enough to come into the battle in the air. A fairer comparison might be to getting 8 or 9 scrolls of Lesser Planar Binding - and against that it compares pretty well. And it doesn't require that you be any particular class to use.

The Bronze Griffin is the item to have when you are yourself 7th level or less. No other item comes close for the price, and most games fold shortly thereafter anyway.

Does it go completely obsolete? Hellz yeah. But by the time it does I can cast Lesser Planar Binding anyway, and the game is broken if I want it to be.

-Username17

[The_Hanged_Man]

No, I agree it's kewl in lots of ways. But it's priced as a permanent item, and it's not. It's very different from a weapon that can always be folded into the next biggest weapon.

That's why I don't like it very much, it's priced as the Ginseng, the only knife you'll ever need. But it's more like a pack of disposable plastic silverwear. It's only value is that sometimes you really need the Armenian Thumb-Fork, and this pack is the only one it comes in. But unless you need that Thumb-Fork, it's a big waste of money.

What I'm saying is that most of the value I think you're getting out of it is much more cheap from some other source. The only thing that makes it worthwhile is versatility - which is an odd thing to get from a permanent item. Usually, you get versatility from a bunch of small, disposable things.

[User3]

Well, good times for the artificer then.

[User3]

It's always a mistake to try to create the most powerful item possible for the lowest possible price or vice versa.