Tome Monk's Walk of a Thousand Steps
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Tome Monk's Walk of a Thousand Steps
I was wondering why the Tome Monk doesn't upgrade his Walk of a Thousand Steps ability to use Master Fighting Styles before he gets Perfect Mastery at 18th level. 12th level seems like a good place to get it.
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CatharzGodfoot
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Another question I have about monk..
He doesn't advance his fighting style until 9th level.. why is this? He gains some spell resistance and some other little stuff, but his main class feature doesn't improve till 9th, yes you gain a good bit of versatility(which is very nice), but you don't go up vertically at all.
He doesn't advance his fighting style until 9th level.. why is this? He gains some spell resistance and some other little stuff, but his main class feature doesn't improve till 9th, yes you gain a good bit of versatility(which is very nice), but you don't go up vertically at all.
The short answer to both questions is "for the sake of balance". Certain boosts in power are needed at some levels where they are not needed in other levels.
In many ways the Monk is front-loaded in that each new type of Fighting Style is a quantum leap in raw power. That power bulge over level-appropriate challenges tapers off as you approach the next kind of Fighting Style, but I assume you are synergizing with feats and stacking things on top of other things so it shouldn't be a problem.
I haven't heard of any issues from the players of the F and K Monk, so I consider it a well-balanced class.
In many ways the Monk is front-loaded in that each new type of Fighting Style is a quantum leap in raw power. That power bulge over level-appropriate challenges tapers off as you approach the next kind of Fighting Style, but I assume you are synergizing with feats and stacking things on top of other things so it shouldn't be a problem.
I haven't heard of any issues from the players of the F and K Monk, so I consider it a well-balanced class.
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PhaedrusXY
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I've found that it doesn't need a boost. I've also found that, barring the higher levels, it's one of the things that DMs will let into their games - including ones who think Pathfinder totally fixed everything or that fighters were just fine and Tome goes and overpowers things.
So it's a huge success in my books: does the job well, and doesn't scare DMs off. Compare with the Fighter or any of the deals-heaps-of-damage kinds, where people line up just to scream that they're overpowered.
So it's a huge success in my books: does the job well, and doesn't scare DMs off. Compare with the Fighter or any of the deals-heaps-of-damage kinds, where people line up just to scream that they're overpowered.
Count Arioch the 28th wrote:There is NOTHING better than lesbians. Lesbians make everything better.
What's bad is I know someone who swears the Tome Monk is overpowered because of how he could break it--involving throwing a ton of the Shuriken and the -2 con ability damage.Koumei wrote:I've found that it doesn't need a boost. I've also found that, barring the higher levels, it's one of the things that DMs will let into their games - including ones who think Pathfinder totally fixed everything or that fighters were just fine and Tome goes and overpowers things.
So it's a huge success in my books: does the job well, and doesn't scare DMs off. Compare with the Fighter or any of the deals-heaps-of-damage kinds, where people line up just to scream that they're overpowered.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.
--The horror of Mario
Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
--The horror of Mario
Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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CatharzGodfoot
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The real issue is Nash Equilibrium. Ideally, you're always going to get about as much benefit from taking another level in your current class as from multiclassing. With the monk that's clearly not the case, but at least you always get something. And with one-level lookahead, it actually does keep approximate equilibrium with multiclassing.Leress wrote:Hell no.Dr_Noface wrote:But isn't symmetry more important than game balance?
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Mount Flamethrower on rear
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-Anatole France
Mount Flamethrower on rear
Drive in reverse
Win Game.
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Dominicius
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Maxus wrote:What's bad is I know someone who swears the Tome Monk is overpowered because of how he could break it--involving throwing a ton of the Shuriken and the -2 con ability damage.Koumei wrote:I've found that it doesn't need a boost. I've also found that, barring the higher levels, it's one of the things that DMs will let into their games - including ones who think Pathfinder totally fixed everything or that fighters were just fine and Tome goes and overpowers things.
So it's a huge success in my books: does the job well, and doesn't scare DMs off. Compare with the Fighter or any of the deals-heaps-of-damage kinds, where people line up just to scream that they're overpowered.
Time for me to go internet on that with a "LOL." Tell that guy that Con poison is cheap as free and literally anyone can put it on Shuriken and do the same thing.
[The Great Fence Builder Speaks]
By request, the discussion on the Shiva and/or Kali monk was moved to IMOI. the thread is cleverly titled "The Shiva Monk".
I would link to it, but to be 100% honest I'm a little intoxicated. Just got back from a Superbowl Party.
[/TGFBS]
By request, the discussion on the Shiva and/or Kali monk was moved to IMOI. the thread is cleverly titled "The Shiva Monk".
I would link to it, but to be 100% honest I'm a little intoxicated. Just got back from a Superbowl Party.
[/TGFBS]
Last edited by fbmf on Mon Feb 08, 2010 4:16 am, edited 2 times in total.
Someone beat me to it. I was going to ask for that...fbmf wrote:[The Great Fence Builder Speaks]
By request, the discussion on the Shiva and/or Kali monk was moved to IMOI. the thread is cleverly titled "The Shiva Monk".
I would link to it, but to be 100% honest I'm a little intoxicated. Just got back from a Superbowl Party.
[/TGFBS]
Stay safe, Fence-builder
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.
--The horror of Mario
Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
--The horror of Mario
Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
Yeah, the worst complaints I've heard about the Monk are:
"At high levels, every hit has a Save or Die on it - actual death, Gate, disintegrate... EVERY HIT. That's MORE than a Wizard is doing."
I didn't even bother saying "Wail of the Banshee", though I suppose they have a point for the boss-fights where you tell one enemy to make 4+ saves vs Death. Except at that level, who honestly gives a fuck?
And the same person to say the above also allowed the Monk in a game anyway, because "The game isn't going to reach that level anyway, I don't like the way everything falls apart at those levels and I can't see the game itself extending that far with normal level gain anyway."
Monk 3/Jester 3, completely fantastic. Didn't manage to successfully solo a Succubus, however.
At any rate, this leads me to believe I should use the Tome Monk as a benchmark when making stuff, because it's in the sweet spot of "Level appropriate, interesting, fun, but doesn't send DMs into bitchfits".
"At high levels, every hit has a Save or Die on it - actual death, Gate, disintegrate... EVERY HIT. That's MORE than a Wizard is doing."
I didn't even bother saying "Wail of the Banshee", though I suppose they have a point for the boss-fights where you tell one enemy to make 4+ saves vs Death. Except at that level, who honestly gives a fuck?
And the same person to say the above also allowed the Monk in a game anyway, because "The game isn't going to reach that level anyway, I don't like the way everything falls apart at those levels and I can't see the game itself extending that far with normal level gain anyway."
Monk 3/Jester 3, completely fantastic. Didn't manage to successfully solo a Succubus, however.
At any rate, this leads me to believe I should use the Tome Monk as a benchmark when making stuff, because it's in the sweet spot of "Level appropriate, interesting, fun, but doesn't send DMs into bitchfits".
Count Arioch the 28th wrote:There is NOTHING better than lesbians. Lesbians make everything better.