PHB 2 Errata is up! (???????)

[Jacob_Orlove]

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/PHB2_E ... [br][br]So um, yeah. Way to go, Wizards. Anyone care to speculate on what this means, vis-a-vis anything?

Noteworthy bits:
Arcane Thesis applies its reduction once per metamagic, and cannot reduce the spell below its original level.
Elven Spell Lore only lets you choose new energy types.

[CalibronXXX]

So they clarified that Arcane Thesis is powerful but not utterly retarded and nerfed elven spell lore. Also nerfed melee weapon mastery and blood spiked charger; not that anyone cares.

[bitnine]

So... They released errata for PHB II and they didn't nerf the hell out of abrupt jaunt or even change it at all? Seriously, what the fuck?

[CalibronXXX]

Immediate action short range teleport is powerful, a lot more powerful than the other options, but is it really that bad?

[bitnine]

Immediate action short range teleport is powerful, a lot more powerful than the other options, but is it really that bad?

In the grant scheme of things? Maybe not. Is just... foiling attacks/full attacks 4-5 times a day out the door at first level for pretty much no cost seems so flagrant. Between that and grease, good times as a conjurer.

[RandomCasualty]

Wow, they left out the problem with adaptable flanker where you could flank with yourself too.

1192577073[/unixtime]]Immediate action short range teleport is powerful, a lot more powerful than the other options, but is it really that bad?

Um yeah, yeah it is.

Someone charges you, abrupt jaunt.

Someone fireballs you, abrupt jaunt out of area.

Seriously, it's like a free special ability to ignore X attacks per day as an immediate action.

[K]

There's a Sorcerer spell out of Races of Dragon that lets you do that too, except it blocks LoE.

Basically, immediate actions suck.

[CalibronXXX]

1192581003[/unixtime]]Wow, they left out the problem with adaptable flanker where you could flank with yourself too.

1192577073[/unixtime]]Immediate action short range teleport is powerful, a lot more powerful than the other options, but is it really that bad?

Um yeah, yeah it is.

Someone charges you, abrupt jaunt.

Someone fireballs you, abrupt jaunt out of area.

Seriously, it's like a free special ability to ignore X attacks per day as an immediate action.

I understood the implications when I made my statement.

[Koumei]

1192583416[/unixtime]]There's a Sorcerer spell out of Races of Dragon that lets you do that too, except it blocks LoE.

Basically, immediate actions suck.

True, but I think the Sorcerer can do with all the help it gets, so may as well get annoying, easily-abused tricks. In general though, immediate actions suck.

And so they took a feat which sounded cool in theory but sucked (Blood Spiked Charger), and nerfed it, while leaving some of the actual problems alone.

I'm not sure fixing Arcane Thesis and Elven Spell Lore was such a bad idea though. At least you can still choose desiccation damage and other rare types, even if you can't MM the hell out of Scorching Ray to do over 100d6 Con damage.

[CalibronXXX]

Actually you can't do dessication damage anymore. Only "Energy" damage, which I'm pretty sure is restricted to the types of damage you can get out of energy substitution.

[Username17]

1192598950[/unixtime]]Actually you can't do dessication damage anymore. Only "Energy" damage, which I'm pretty sure is restricted to the types of damage you can get out of energy substitution.

Oh sure you can. You can just no longer do Physical/Admantine damage (if you care). You can still choose any bullshit energy type you want. I'm fond of "Darkness" damage because nothing has any resistance to it, but if you wanted to use "Force" energy or even Positive Energy, I would understand.

-Username17

[Koumei]

Does positive energy damage heal living creatures? I notice that the wording of the Cure spells doesn't mention positive energy damage - if it did, you could totally sneak attack people with cure spells, curing them for 1d8+5+10d6, which is a really good rate for a 750 GP wand. Or a what, 100 GP trap.

[Cielingcat]

No, it doesn't.

[Crissa]

Cure spells cure. Positive energy hurts.

If you sneak attack someone with a wand of cure, they might end up hurt, they might not. Mostly, though, the DM will be confused.

Can you sneak attack with a touch spell?

-Crissa

[Cielingcat]

Yes, you can. However... huh, it doesn't actually need to do damage. All it needs to be is an attack that meets the SA criteria (denied Dex, usually). However, since it's extra damage, you wouldn't want to try it while healing.

[Koumei]

I believe it's the same damage type as the original source. So this makes a lot of sense when knifing them in the back (the sneak attack is piercing or slashing damage) and blackjacking them (bludgeoning).

Cool, blackjacking actually is a real word.

This also means that acid-rogues are really good at killing trolls, as all that extra sneak attack damage is acid damage, and if you can't catch a troll flat-footed, you have no business being a rogue.

So if you sneak attack someone by throwing a pie at them, it deals "pie" damage (ie nothing, as no damage was dealt). Presumably this means curing, which unfortunately isn't a damage type (yes I know that should be really obvious), makes the sneak attack "not damage" damage.

[Username17]

As written, the only people who can get super cured by sneak attack are Dread Necromancers. Sneak Attack only triggers when you inflict damage, and inflict spells inflict damage when targetted against the living, and Tomb Tainted Soul turns such damage into healing.

Since the cure spells are written without reference to the fact that they are inflicting positive damage that heals non-undead creatures but are instead merely listed as straight healing, they aren't modified by sneak attack.

But a wand of Inflict Minor Wounds can be sneak attacked into the back of a Dread Necromancer for 1 + XD6 healing. Because it actually is written as damage that is converted into healing rather than skipping the intermediary steps.

-Username17

[SunTzuWarmaster]

pft, better to sneak attack with a Wand of Acid Splash/Scorching Ray/Ray of Enfeeblement with a UMD check of over 9000 (credit to Frank). Hell, take TWF and Double Wand Wielder and go to town.

Sorry Frank:
Energy Substitution (metamagic feat): Choose one type of energy: acid, cold, electricity, fire, or sonic. You can modify a spell with an energy designator to use the chosen type of energy instead. A substituted spell works normally in all respects except the type of damage dealt. A substituted spell uses a spell slot of the spell's normal level, modified by any other metamagic feats. Special: You can gain this feat multiple times; each time it applies to a different type of energy.
(taken from wizards.com)

And yes, Abrupt Jaunt is amazingly broken at low levels and still quite good at high levels. It is flat out the easiest way for a wizard to avoid melee (even easier than invisibility). A level 1 elven conjurer can be charged by a CR1 monster, teleport out of the way, then shoot it with a bow. End encounter.
rule abuse: teleport straight up (the rules say you don't fall 'til your turn). On your turn, your Ring of Feather Falling will kick in.
general abuse: if there is ever anything to hide behind, walk towards enemy, cast spell, teleport to hiding behind something (opponent now doesn't know your square and has no line of effect).

[Fwib]

Do the rules really explicitly say that you only fall on your turn?

[Koumei]

1192621141[/unixtime]]
Sorry Frank:
Energy Substitution (metamagic feat):

Aside from the fact that you can't choose Sonic any more (unless they reverted that in recent times - 3.5 removed Sonic from the list last I checked), Frank wasn't referring to Energy Sub, but to Elven Spell Lore. Or Arcane Thesis. Whichever one it is. It doesn't matter which, because in the past people were taking both and applying them to Scorching Ray and dealing somewhere in the vicinity of a hojillion kabillion damage of any kind.

Some limited it to Force damage, or Darkness, or alignment-based, others claimed Vile was a type (as far as I can tell, it's a modifier for existing damage. See the example of a Violated spell), and yet more said "Fine. I choose Constitution Damage. You die. Now."

[tzor]

1192627738[/unixtime]]Do the rules really explicitly say that you only fall on your turn?

I really don't see anything directly related to it in the SRD. Multiple round falling is only covered for flying creature conditions as far as I can see.

[SunTzuWarmaster]

it comes from:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/jump.htm

<from jump checks>
Action
None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump.
</from jump checks>

IIRC, errata clarified that you only get to move during your turn, and if you are stuck hanging in the air between turns you hang. Thus, if you get an immediate action to move upwards you are left hanging in the air until your next turn. Supposedly this was also to cover midair combat where an opponent attempts to rip you off a flying mount (allowing your teammates to catch you before you die from capped falling damage).

Sorry about my confusion with Elven Spell Lore (you can sub any kind of damage you wish, I take it?), I thought you were talking about Substituion (I didn't have my books, so I actually ripped that from wizards.com, where their rules were out of date).

[tzor]

Yes but that is not the same as when a fall begins. Time and place in initative are effectively not related in 3E in any manner whatsoever. If a jump exceeds a single round then the remainder of the jump is adjucitated on your next initative turn. It's not like you jumped your first part of your moment in 0.00000000000 seconds then suddenly froze in place for an entire 6 seconds and suddently went back to warp speed to complete your movement in 0.00000000000 seconds.

I'm pretty sure that if an event happens no matter on whose initative that results in inoking the law of gravity you fall at that moment in the initative. If someone bullrushes you off the cliff you fall, your initative or not. If someone dispells the bridge from underneath you you fall, your initative or not.

SRD also states that if you are flying at less than min speed and you don't land at the "end of the movement" you fall. http://www.d20srd.org/srd/movement.htm.

If a flying creature fails to maintain its minimum forward speed, it must land at the end of its movement. If it is too high above the ground to land, it falls straight down, descending 150 feet in the first round of falling. If this distance brings it to the ground, it takes falling damage. If the fall doesn’t bring the creature to the ground, it must spend its next turn recovering from the stall. It must succeed on a DC 20 Reflex save to recover. Otherwise it falls another 300 feet. If it hits the ground, it takes falling damage. Otherwise, it has another chance to recover on its next turn.

Note also that gravity apparently trumps normal movement rates. So even if you are out of movement, unless you have carryover momentum, you have plenty of room to fall.

[Voss]

Actually, that errata of Elven Spell Lore specifies energy types, which by the clarification in the Rules Compendium, are only

Abilities and effects that employ one of the five energy
types deal energy damage, which can be acid, cold, electricity,
fire, or sonic.

It goes on to say that

Negative energy and positive energy are damage types, but they are not considered energy types the way that acid,
cold, electricity, fire, and sonic are.

[Fwib]

Yike! how come we keep getting these HTML-code-thing bugs?