Den Next Design Challenge

Aryxbez · Post by **Aryxbez** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:12 pm

Koumei wrote:I am very much looking forward to the mess that this will produce.

Same, while I may not be directly involved with this project, I will get a friend, or myself, to run this game, should it actually get finished. Especially if the people doing the Fifth section actually includes a pre-written adventure (even if filled with BS Gygaxian-lite traps and such).

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:20 pm

I am not actually going to write up the classes themselves. There are 17 classes, and the wordcount limit is 1500 words. A 4e class is 8 times that length by itself, but even a single paragraph per class would come in at nearly a thousand words by itself. So you don't get the whole chargen chapter - you get the opening to each of the chargen sections that tells you how to use it. So the description of Race, Class, and Theme are in there, as are the lists of races and classes. But the actual Race and Class descriptions are not.

If we do longer wordcounts, I could do actual class writeups, but at 1500 words, it isn't possible.

-Username17

sabs · Post by **sabs** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:30 pm

Race and Class Descriptions are for a 2nd book

Players HB2 Next

I admit, I am curious what a 35 word count race or class would look like.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:05 pm

YLM: Jesus christ, dial it back. Look, if I inferred something you didn't intend, a reasonable person says "Um, that's not what I meant" and the other person says "Oh? Ok, explain it to me again, I'm confused." When you say "You're a fucking douchebag idiot moron I never fucking said that" I respond with "Here's what you said."

But for fuck sake "Active AC is fucking dumb" is not "OMG I DONTS KNPOW MATH!!!!!!!!!!!!" it's... active AC is fucking dumb.

I have more points regarding that, but whatever, not important

I'm not stupid, don't assume I'm stupid. Jesus.

I'm not fucking assuming you're stupid, I'm reading your own damned words. Clearly you need to think things out better before saying them.

So, whatever, I'll let you and kaelik rage-penis-joust, just send me your shit when you're done so I can write the adventure.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:27 pm

sabs wrote:Race and Class Descriptions are for a 2nd book
Players HB2 Next

I admit, I am curious what a 35 word count race or class would look like.

It would look like this:

Halfling

Halflings are smaller than humans and renown for their quick wits, quick tongues, and great courage.

Halfling Luck: Open Reaction: Reroll a save. Refresh: Noon.
Small
Favored Attributes: Dexterity, Charisma
Scorned Attribute: Strength

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:42 pm

Well, it works for people who know what this new-fangled roleplaying is, but probably not great for newbies.

Red_Rob · Post by **Red_Rob** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:57 pm

Seems legit to me. As long as all the terms are explained elsewhere in the rules, that is perfectly serviceable. The main problem is the lack of description, but that could all be in your "Lands of the Shire" section.

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:01 pm

Prak_Anima wrote:YLM: Jesus christ, dial it back. Look, if I inferred something you didn't intend, a reasonable person says "Um, that's not what I meant" and the other person says "Oh? Ok, explain it to me again, I'm confused." When you say "You're a fucking douchebag idiot moron I never fucking said that" I respond with "Here's what you said."

OK, I'm not even going to bother responding to "OMG MEAN TO ME" comments outside of this. You've been here long enough, and the things I said weren't even half as bad as what people here say, so you're honestly just wasting space.

But for fuck sake "Active AC is fucking dumb" is not "OMG I DONTS KNPOW MATH!!!!!!!!!!!!" it's... active AC is fucking dumb.

Aaaand that's not what I was saying at all. Read my post where I basically "because they're easy to translate, saves can be used as passive defenses". I'm not saying "wow you don't know math", I'm saying "oh look how easy it was to not make this an active defense anymore problem solved". I ended both of those calling you stupid, but only in the second one is it obvious why, because even if I wanted active defense and someone else didn't, I could include a 2-line section saying "change active defenses to passive defenses, congrats job done".

I'm not fucking assuming you're stupid, I'm reading your own damned words. Clearly you need to think things out better before saying them.

Like I said, those were statements designed to be short. To be lengthy, and vague, like all buzzword-filled statements and draft game promises are. It was not to describe the entirety of my idea. The fact that you took a statement that was written with the restriction of being vague and then complained that it was vague says that you need to think things out better before saying them.

Also, don't I just send you an outline and you write up the path?

Josh_Kablack · Post by **Josh_Kablack** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:38 pm

Okay so far I have

Foreward and table of contents
Chargen
Running Next
NEXT Rule Module #12: Mass Combat via Skill Challenges
suggestions as to things to swipe for Cover Art and a Game World Map
A growing urge to add a couple of the participants to my ignore list, therefore resulting in even worse communications

I still need:

Setting,
Combat,
Adversaries
any other optional rules modules people want to throw in.

As to word counts, the suggested ranges were made in the vein of "these have to be short so that we can get this parody done in before folks lose interest" not in any sort of "this section should take this many words" decision if someone wants to go way over, feel free, but I'm pretty sure that whatever isn't submitted inside a week of my first post isn't ever getting submitted.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:50 pm

...You Lost Me wrote:
Prak_Anima wrote:YLM: Jesus christ, dial it back. Look, if I inferred something you didn't intend, a reasonable person says "Um, that's not what I meant" and the other person says "Oh? Ok, explain it to me again, I'm confused." When you say "You're a fucking douchebag idiot moron I never fucking said that" I respond with "Here's what you said."
OK, I'm not even going to bother responding to "OMG MEAN TO ME" comments outside of this. You've been here long enough, and the things I said weren't even half as bad as what people here say, so you're honestly just wasting space.

I'm not offended in the slightest, you understand, I just, for some reason, try to bring the Den's signal to noise ratio up and get people to calm down a bit.

But for fuck sake "Active AC is fucking dumb" is not "OMG I DONTS KNPOW MATH!!!!!!!!!!!!" it's... active AC is fucking dumb.
Aaaand that's not what I was saying at all. Read my post where I basically "because they're easy to translate, saves can be used as passive defenses". I'm not saying "wow you don't know math", I'm saying "oh look how easy it was to not make this an active defense anymore problem solved". I ended both of those calling you stupid, but only in the second one is it obvious why, because even if I wanted active defense and someone else didn't, I could include a 2-line section saying "change active defenses to passive defenses, congrats job done".

I'm not fucking assuming you're stupid, I'm reading your own damned words. Clearly you need to think things out better before saying them.
Like I said, those were statements designed to be short. To be lengthy, and vague, like all buzzword-filled statements and draft game promises are. It was not to describe the entirety of my idea. The fact that you took a statement that was written with the restriction of being vague and then complained that it was vague says that you need to think things out better before saying them.

Fair.

Also, don't I just send you an outline and you write up the path?

I guess so, but I need really solid outline, man, because otherwise I'm approaching this as if I were writing a 3.x adventure and currently just putting stuff like "[special shit] mines" until I get some outlines.

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:09 am

All right, well I've been fighting machines at work all day, so expect a turn around time midnight PST. Sorry for the wait.

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:38 am

In D&D Next, enemies come in seven classes: Demons, Undead, Bad People, Beasts, Things With Tentacles, Things Made Out Of Stuff, and Dragons.

Demons
Demons are evil supernatural beings from hell. They always have fangs, claws, horns, and bat wings, but are otherwise a varied bunch. Demons can be encountered at any level, ranging from the lowly imp through the sexy Succubus to the fearsome Balor.

Undead
Not all beings rest easily in the grave. Undead are corpses re-animated by negative energy. They feed on the life energy of the living, and are harmed by life energy. This makes undead very grumpy. Undead range from the lowly Zombie through the sexy Vampire to the fearsome Lich. Ghosts are also undead.

Bad People
Bad People are just like normal people, but bad. Bad People are easy to tell apart from good people, because they have different skin and hair colors, they wear strange clothes, and they speak strange and frightening languages. Bad People range from the lowly Cultist through the sexy Dark Elf to the fearsome Red Dwarf.

Beasts
Beasts are like good domestic animals, but scary and wild. While they are not truly Evil, their natural instincts always lead them to attack people, which makes it alright (even necessary) to kill them. Beasts range from the lowly squirrel through the sexyscary wolf to the fearsome bear.

Things With Tentacles
Tentacles make things seem alien and disturbing. In the land of D&D next, all sorts of things have tentacles. Most Things With Tentacles want to eat human brains. Things With Tentacles range from the lowly Octopus through the sexy Kelpie to the fearsome Mind Flayer.

Things Made Out Of Stuff
In the world of D&DNEXT, sometimes things are made out of odd stuff. There are people made of iron, cats made of wood, snakes made of water, demons made of steam, and something made out of air. There are even people made out of people called "Frankenstein Golems". Pretty much anything made out of something weird probably wants to kill you, so you're best off killing it first and taking its (most likely burned or soaked) stuff. Things Made Out Of Stuff range from the lowly Hommunculus through the sexy goo girlWater Nymph the fearsome Really Old Fire Elemental.

Dragons
Dragons are scaled beasts with bat wings and bad breath. For some reason they like to horde gold. Dragons range from the lowly Baby White Dragon through the sexy Young Adult Silver Dragon to the fearsome Really Old Red Dragon.

Duke Flauros · Post by **Duke Flauros** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:08 am

CatharzGodfoot wrote:In D&D Next, enemies come in six classes: Demons, Undead, Bad People, Beasts, Things With Tentacles, and Dragons.

Don't give Mearls any ideas.

Quantumboost · Post by **Quantumboost** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:15 am

CatharzGodfoot wrote:through the sexyscary wolf

Wrong game company.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:38 am

CatharzGodfoot wrote:Bad People
Bad People are just like normal people, but bad. Bad People are easy to tell apart from good people, because they have different skin and hair colors, they wear strange clothes, and they speak strange and frightening languages. Bad People range from the lowly Cultist through the sexy Dark Elf to the fearsome Red Dwarf.

No Bad Carthaz. Trying to steal my section is one thing, but don't condone racism/xenophobia when you do it.

Duke Flauros · Post by **Duke Flauros** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:00 am

Quantumboost wrote:
CatharzGodfoot wrote:through the sexyscary wolf
Wrong game company.

Weel, cuzzin Billy-Bob, back in mah days a a little bahoy on a Tennessee farm, we didn't see many of them there girls, so we y'all had to do with forest critters.

Kaelik wrote:
CatharzGodfoot wrote:Bad People
Bad People are just like normal people, but bad. Bad People are easy to tell apart from good people, because they have different skin and hair colors, they wear strange clothes, and they speak strange and frightening languages. Bad People range from the lowly Cultist through the sexy Dark Elf to the fearsome Red Dwarf.
No Bad Carthaz. Trying to steal my section is one thing, but don't condone racism/xenophobia when you do it.

... you do realize that the whole thing was a joke, right?

...You Lost Me · Post by **...You Lost Me** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:53 am

I don't think racism/xenophobia is a good thing to blatantly encourage anyways...

MGuy · Post by **MGuy** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:55 am

So do I just post up the blurb here or just forward it to Josh? i'll have it done before the end of Wednesday (after some serious business for the day is done) but I'm a bit confused as to whether I'm posting it in thread or just forwarding it.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:00 am

I think you PM it to Josh

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:03 am

Forward it to Josh. When all the sections are in, he'll put them all together and post the "completed" Next writeup. And then we can read it and laugh.

sabs · Post by **sabs** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:31 pm

Wait, it's a game of hobos stabbing people in the face, and you're upset because some of the evil people are short redskinned bastards? REALLY? You're complaining about racism and xenophobia in D&D? Racial hatred has been in d&d since red box. Hell, in 1st edition there's a racial hatred matrix.

I think you're taking your PC a little too far.

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:17 am

Kaelik wrote:
CatharzGodfoot wrote:Bad People
Bad People are just like normal people, but bad. Bad People are easy to tell apart from good people, because they have different skin and hair colors, they wear strange clothes, and they speak strange and frightening languages. Bad People range from the lowly Cultist through the sexy Dark Elf to the fearsome Red Dwarf.
No Bad Carthaz. Trying to steal my section is one thing, but don't condone racism/xenophobia when you do it.

Hey, I just saw Josh write that "adversaries" still needed doing. Didn't have any idea that you had already called it.

The six class setup is D&D monsters distilled down to it's barest essentials (aside from random critters made out of odd stuff like fire elementals and iron golems, which probably need another category). There is a ton of xenophobia, and hiding it behind prettier 'Bad People' metaphors and euphemisms isn't helping anyone. At least this way, player can see what it is in the most simple terms, and say 'that's just wrong'.

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:46 am

Not to mention any sections done by two people will be put up side-by-side as "Alternative rules"

Grek · Post by **Grek** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:38 am

If that's so, I'll write up an Alternative Setting for the game. KDIs include:

Does away with boring and overused classical european tropes.
Focuses on being easy for new players to understand and established players to switch over to.
No racist overtones, no complex cosmologies, nothing but the Setting You Need.
Gives the DM the Freedom to Design whatever geography they way. No limits, man!
Based on The Jungle Book. Where everyone's a talking animal.

Duke Flauros · Post by **Duke Flauros** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:17 am

Grek wrote:If that's so, I'll write up an Alternative Setting for the game. KDIs include:

Does away with boring and overused classical european tropes.

Focuses on being easy for new players to understand and established players to switch over to.

No racist overtones, no complex cosmologies, nothing but the Setting You Need.

Gives the DM the Freedom to Design whatever geography they way. No limits, man!

Based on The Jungle Book. Where everyone's a talking animal.

Be careful there Grek. You might actually wind up creating something halfway decent.