Levels: How much of a difference should they make?

[Judging__Eagle]

The question is this:

"How far advanced do you have to be on your level scale when you are able to murderize the enemies that were a challenge when you started adventuring."

B/c in 3.5 it's level 8 that you can murder cr 1/2 Orcs by the hundreds.

[fliprushman]

8 is a good level if your game only goes to 10 like the older editions of DnD and 3e was built upon, though it goes to 20. Really, level appropriatness falls upon the designers of the game and what they hope to accomplish at each level. In 3e and previous editions, levels 1-5 were for commoners and kings(Royal born) while levels 6-10 were for heroes/adventurers. Anything above that really breaks down because of the power inbalance.

[NoDot]

Considering the current system of Attack and Effect Rolls, eight falls about right.

Level 0: Peasant

Level 1: \
Level 2: -- Soldier (normal)
Level 3: /

Level 4: \
Level 5: -- General (superhuman)
Level 6: /

Level 7: \
Level 8: -- Olympian
Level 9: /

Level 10: God

Every time you advance a category, you gain another color. (Peasants start with zero.) Sufficient Peasants can take down anything below Olympian level (massed, some of those too).

[TavishArtair]

An important detail is that a lot of an army doesn't consist of actual fighters. It consists instead of the people who are there to make the actual fighters get there. Now, being in a wartime situation, it is possible they will acquire combat experience, and so a hero might make a point of giving his retinue some combat training because it's an acknowledged fact (in the real world) that enough dudes can turn the tide of a battle. But he wouldn't really expect them to fight if they didn't have to, and would be liable to leave them behind when he got to the actual battlefield. Much of the army we're talking about might also be considered support for those heroes, who comprise the actual fighting force.

And no, it wouldn't be unusual for 10 others to be there for every 1 actual combatant on the field.

An army marches on its belly.

Of course, once you conquer the city, you need some gentlemen to go around and collect tribute which again, gives those "useless" soldiers something to do that isn't just Stand There And Die.

So even in the hero-versus-hero battles, you might have a significant support crew behind them. Even if all they are there to do is haul loot, look impressive, and maybe keep the peace between minor squabbles, they have their reason to exist in a sense.

[Username17]

Certainly 300 Spartans required 900 helots just to field themselves properly.

-Username17

[Psychic Robot]

I suppose it's not TOO out of line to expect the PCs to be the determining factor in large-scale battles by level seven (or so), especially given that the most hardened war-veteran is probably around level four.

[Judging__Eagle]

Do players get henchmen now or what?

I'm all for either; as long as henchmen don't clutter up "combat time."

[RandomCasualty2]

Do players get henchmen now or what?

Well, if you go with the Middle Earth style, then yes, basically if your'e going to take on an army you need an army. They don't actually fight with dice rolls but exist more as a backdrop, so that your PCs can do stuff that involves a skirmish instead of fighting an army (since it's assumed that your army is fighting stuff while you're fighting the enemy army's elites).

If you go with the superhero style then basically you don't really have armies at all. At most you've got a cohort or something, but really even then you probably don't even need or want to do that since it will slow down play.

[JonSetanta]

Level 0: Peasant

Level 1: \
Level 2: -- Soldier (normal)
Level 3: /

Level 4: \
Level 5: -- General (superhuman)
Level 6: /

Level 7: \
Level 8: -- Olympian
Level 9: /

Level 10: God

Looks familiar.