Specialist Mages, who really plays one?

Judging__Eagle · Post by **Judging__Eagle** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:09 am

I'll be honest, I'll probably never play such a character; but while reading past of the Tome .pdf, I got this idea.

What if a specialist can learn any spell that's in their specilialization? And possibly auto-learning all the PHB wizard spells in their specialization (Maybe all the cleric/druid ones, or 2 cleric or Druid spells that are in their specialization per level)

So, for a Conjurer, any conjuration spells is availible, even Druid and Cleric, or Domain spells.

Of course, this paves the way for a wizard to get a Holy Sword or Divine Might, but really, I'm okay with that. The image of a wizard getting into a melee with a very powerful weapon is pretty interesting.

ubernoob · Post by **ubernoob** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:15 am

Transmuters, Conjurers, and Diviners are pretty damn strong compared to generalists if you follow anything close to the 4 encounter adventuring day.

virgil · Post by **virgil** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:19 am

On top of using any of the several specialist options. There's one where you take another opposed school in exchange for yet another spell per day of your school, giving you greater spell selection than a sorcerer and equal spells per day.

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:20 am

I do.
Evoker.
Or rather, a Sorcerer with many Evocations.

It's stupid, you don't need to remind me, but they do fit well in all-warrior settings.

Knowing all of one spell group would be cool like a Warmage but there's so much arbitration among spells like the Orb series (Conjuration? Really?) I would like to see more crossover between schools for the more generic effects.
Fly is another example; one could Fly by emitting a stream of explosions (Evocation), creating a platform of rock (Conjuration), carried aloft by hideous winged corpses (Necromancy), and of course the vanilla default (Transmutation).

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:38 am

Specialists kick ass as they are.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:51 am

I have, once or twice, played specialist wizards. Usually Conjurers or Transmuters, but I once played... an Illusionist or an Enchanter. I forget which. At the end of the day, I prefer the Beguiler.

Healing could be just about any of them:
Necromancy: it resurrects dead flesh (ala Arcanum, with Good and Bad Necromancy)
Evocation: it evokes positive energy to heal you
Transmutation: it turns you into a healed version of yourself
Conjuration: monster bit your liver out? That's okay, this just summons a new one (and one mile away, farmer Joe collapses as he goes into shock, his liver mysteriously disappearing).

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:58 am

Koumei wrote:Conjuration: monster bit your liver out? That's okay, this just summons a new one (and one mile away, farmer Joe collapses as he goes into shock, his liver mysteriously disappearing).

Finally, a reasonable explanation for why healing spells are Conjuration.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 9:13 am

Koumei wrote:I have, once or twice, played specialist wizards. Usually Conjurers or Transmuters, but I once played... an Illusionist or an Enchanter. I forget which. At the end of the day, I prefer the Beguiler.

The specialist Wizard is crazy strong as things stand. But yeah, the Beguiler and Dread Necromancer have so much power and diversity, and more importantly are so much easier to play, that I wouldn't really recommend a specialist wizard to anyone. At this point, I wouldn't recommend any wizard to anyone. Not because they aren't stupidly overpowered when played properly, but because you can get as much power as you probably ought to have just by writing Beguiler on your character sheet without doing any work at all.

-Username17

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:00 am

Yeah. There's nothing wrong with a specialist Enchanter or Illusionist, and it should still win the game, so to speak, but a Beguiler is easier to play, has the extra versatility, has actual class features that you may or may not care about and really, everything you need is there in the package. No diving through books to find the best spells, no particular weird loops are necessary.

I'll assume the same applies to the Dread Necro, what with having armies of undead at their beck and call based on their regular spell list, even if it is an 8-level class.

Count Arioch the 28th · Sat Jan 10, 2009 8:54 pm

I played a divination specialist one time. I technically took out more foes than anyone else, but the paladin and the rogue took the credit because they did the actual killing, I just set them up for the slaughter.

The Lunatic Fringe · Post by **The Lunatic Fringe** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 9:15 pm

Is this 3rd or 4th edition that you guys are talking about?

Also, what makes Dread Necromancer better than wizard?

ubernoob · Post by **ubernoob** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:03 pm

Narcissus wrote:Is this 3rd or 4th edition that you guys are talking about?

Also, what makes Dread Necromancer better than wizard?

It can control more HD of undead than anyone else.

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:59 pm

Narcissus wrote:Is this 3rd or 4th edition that you guys are talking about?

Also, what makes Dread Necromancer better than wizard?

Third edition is still alive and well around here.

The Lunatic Fringe · Post by **The Lunatic Fringe** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:13 pm

Ah, good. I haven't even bought 4th.

Tshern · Post by **Tshern** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:41 pm

Narcissus wrote:Ah, good. I haven't even bought 4th.

What does that mean? Nor have I and I got the books around a week before they were published on my comp.

Gelare · Post by **Gelare** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:35 am

I play specialist wizards pretty often, I've never really had any complaints. You just specialize in an awesome school and dump the crappy ones, poof, free spells.

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:57 am

Narcissus wrote: Also, what makes Dread Necromancer better than wizard?

As ubernoob said. The Dread Necro isn't more powerful than a wizard, but it gets some neat tricks (unlimited AoE healing/damaging) and requires very little time investment on the part of the player: you don't even have to select spells known, let alone spells per day.

ckafrica · Post by **ckafrica** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:13 am

Well do we need to work up other specialist classes like the beguiler and necromancer for the rest? I know frank did the summoner already.

Gelare · Post by **Gelare** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:14 am

ckafrica wrote:Well do we need to work up other specialist classes like the beguiler and necromancer for the rest? I know frank did the summoner already.

And the Fire Mage.

JonSetanta · Post by **JonSetanta** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:18 am

ckafrica wrote:Well do we need to work up other specialist classes like the beguiler and necromancer for the rest? I know frank did the summoner already.

... hint to ...

Count_Arioch_the_28th wrote:I played a divination specialist one time. I technically took out more foes than anyone else, but the paladin and the rogue took the credit because they did the actual killing, I just set them up for the slaughter.

Diviner specialist. If it's even moderately combat-ready (Insight bonus to defenses!) count me in, I'd play it.

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:29 am

Gelare wrote:
ckafrica wrote:Well do we need to work up other specialist classes like the beguiler and necromancer for the rest? I know frank did the summoner already.
And the Fire Mage.

Rather than being a specialized spellcaster, a fire mage is a highly focused character with a bunch of at-will spell-like abilities. I don't think they can really be put in the same category. The elementalist, on the other hand, is a great example.