TNE: Art, Marketing

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Surgo
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TNE: Art, Marketing

Post by Surgo »

After the system is made, how do we go about getting it out there?

If we get a document of the type Frank usually writes and posts, it is straightforward for me to put that into a PDF. It wouldn't be like the current F&K PDF; it would be pretty much a direct translation of the posts into a typeset, printable PDF.

Do people want to contribute art to the project? We could make it look like a printed RPG book. If you do want to contribute art, please make sure that any raster graphics are done in 300 DPI, CMYK (and the format you send me should be EPS).
Aktariel
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Post by Aktariel »

We are close enough to having anything done for this to be even a serious consideration?

My impression is that we're still in the "hammering out the system" stage, which has been going on for a good long time now.

Not even to the writing abilities to take advantage of the system, yet.
<something clever>
Surgo
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Post by Surgo »

It's really never too early to start thinking about art, because that can take...a long time.

To be honest, I'm not sure where the system is at. I haven't been following the threads.
Last edited by Surgo on Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Username17 »

I'm currently 58,000 words into The Ends of the Matrix v4.01, so we'll probably be able able to put up some hard documentation in a few days. That's my last big Shadowrun project, and I'd like to get it all finished up by early August.

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Post by Surgo »

Ooh, yeah. Anyone inspired to do some art for The Ends?
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Post by Koumei »

Well, as I mentioned before (in "pretty pictures would make people like the Tomes more." thread that started by Captain Bleach yet again going on about Frank killing families), I'd be willing to do some art, but I'm unreliable and my stuff looks too cartoonish and unprofessional.

Unless we're going by 1E standards and the like, where a kid with crayons could do a decent job. But forget 2E quality (at least, the Planescape stuff. That art is 100% win).
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Post by Cynic »

Creative commons might be the answer.
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Post by the_taken »

As I've mentioned before, you can go hunting for artists in the back yard.

www.Elfwood.com is an image board that hosts zillions of picks of fantasy and sci-fi of wildly varying quality. If you just ask, you may be able to find artists who are willing to let you use some of their images in exchange for a small amount of promotion, such as contact info.
You can probably do the same with other similar sites (I haven't looked for others, but I think Deviant Art is a little to broad...)
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Post by K »

the_taken wrote:As I've mentioned before, you can go hunting for artists in the back yard.

www.Elfwood.com is an image board that hosts zillions of picks of fantasy and sci-fi of wildly varying quality. If you just ask, you may be able to find artists who are willing to let you use some of their images in exchange for a small amount of promotion, such as contact info.
You can probably do the same with other similar sites (I haven't looked for others, but I think Deviant Art is a little to broad...)
I've been checking out Elfwood for while.

When TNE is done, I was considering going the whole Penny Arcade route and set up a website and everything to give out the bad boy for free, and if we get enough people downloading it we might even be able to get swag or advertising.
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Post by The 13 Wise Buttlords »

You know what, guys?

If Frank or K get the money, I am willing to pay up to $1500 dollars to make sure that TNE gets good graphics. I am dead fucking serious about this.

My two caveats are A) the artwork has to be as sexy as possible. That means Chainmail Bikinis, Breast Plates, and those stupid but sexy outfits that got worn in 300 out the wazoo.

B) No furries. Kemono are fine, if you must, but no furries.

As for advertising, I highly recommend getting ads on 'geeky' websites like Shortpacked! and Giant in the Playground and Penny Arcade. If you guys get a finished product, I'm willing to kick in some money for that, too.
Last edited by The 13 Wise Buttlords on Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by rapa-nui »

"the artwork has to be as sexy as possible. That means Chainmail Bikinis, Breast Plates, and those stupid but sexy outfits that got worn in 300 out the wazoo."



I hope no one else feels this way.
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Post by The 13 Wise Buttlords »

I hope no one else feels this way.
Sex sells, rapa-nui, and you know it.

Look at the ridiculous armor that chick on the front of the 4E PHB is wearing. Seriously, if you're already going to put your characters into something sexist and impractical, you might as well just go all the way.
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Post by Koumei »

The 13 Wise Buttlords wrote: A) the artwork has to be as sexy as possible. That means Chainmail Bikinis, Breast Plates, and those stupid but sexy outfits that got worn in 300 out the wazoo.
Sounds good to me!
B) No furries. Kemono are fine, if you must, but no furries.
Excellent. Though now we need Crissa to come here and tell us that we're just like the Nazis.
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Post by Cielingcat »

The 13 Wise Buttlords wrote:B) No furries. Kemono are fine, if you must, but no furries.
D&D has had quite a few furries that you're banning us from using, y'know. Hound Archons, Centaurs, Driders, etc.

However, as long as you don't mix your first requirement with your second things should be fine.
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Post by The 13 Wise Buttlords »

Fair enough.
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angelfromanotherpin
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Post by angelfromanotherpin »

Well, with all the Hindu stuff, you could probably get a lot of use out of public domain classic Indian artwork, particularly for landscapes and such.

I also recommend cruising past conceptart.org, as there's always someone there willing to produce quality for cheap, just to help get their name out.
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Post by PhoneLobster »

Elfwood is evil and stupid, run by evil and stupid people, most of the good artists left years ago and it's cluttered with absolute crap.

Deviant art all round better and is also a better resource if you are looking for productive potential to commission.

At least that was the case several years ago last time I cared enough to check in on either.

Want I should tell you stories about the draconian loony tunes Queenslander bitch on anti depressants who ostensibly managed the Elfwood community back then?
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Post by Judging__Eagle »

Art.... I can do line art and human figures and stuff, faces give me trouble still, but that's b/c i'm anal about realism and I should prolly practice more, but I don't b/c it's frustrating.

The problem is that I'm notoriously lazy (I do the line art, I almost never finish shading and colouring can go to hell since that shit all takes so much time).

From time to time I need some guidance on what something should look like or what I should keep or not keep in an drawing. I did this... 'futuristic' city assignment for my art for animation class last fall, easy enough, right? So I went and drew a complete mish-mash of building styles, unfeeling tenement rows in one corner of the foreground, a massive coliseum with skulls that dwarf buildings and bone buttresses on one side of the foreground, a statue in mid-completion (also, gigantic) just in front of the mid-ground, some pyramids in the rear ground, a .... building that looked as if it was made of something gooey and soft in the midground, an ultra-modern looking block-building with sigils all over it. Lots of great ideas for a city, but what I drew was a 'sampler'.

If I had gone for the 'bone' architecture look, or the buildings made out of protoplasm or the ultra-modern sigil-covered or the pyramids look; it would have been better. At the time I wasn't sure what to do with the assignment and I guess that 2 weeks to do the assignment with only 1 meeting with the proff in that time wasn't able to get me more than an 75% on that. Make mistakes and learn.

So, there are people here that do art, just that some of us know that we've got a while to go.
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Post by Surgo »

The trouble with going around places like Elfwood and Deviantart is that anything good that I find is ostensibly not printable art. Art that you want to print needs to be 300 DPI, CMYK or it just doesn't work. Anything you find on those sites is 72 DPI, RGB.

Though if the original authors are still around, that can be remedied. But it rules out a lot of public domain Hindu art.
Last edited by Surgo on Fri Aug 01, 2008 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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the_taken
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Post by the_taken »

K wrote:
the_taken wrote:As I've mentioned before, you can go hunting for artists in the back yard.

www.Elfwood.com is an image board that hosts zillions of picks of fantasy and sci-fi of wildly varying quality. If you just ask, you may be able to find artists who are willing to let you use some of their images in exchange for a small amount of promotion, such as contact info.
You can probably do the same with other similar sites (I haven't looked for others, but I think Deviant Art is a little to broad...)
I've been checking out Elfwood for while.

When TNE is done, I was considering going the whole Penny Arcade route and set up a website and everything to give out the bad boy for free, and if we get enough people downloading it we might even be able to get swag or advertising.
Set up a website? What kind of website? I've got some stuff lying around and some free time coming up.

No, seriously. What do you need the website to do?
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.

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Post by Draco_Argentum »

I'd vote against taking cash donations. A bunch of randoms one the internet getting real money involved is a recipe for disaster.
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Post by angelfromanotherpin »

I know some people in the indie scene use what they call a 'ransom' system, which involves collecting donations until a certain threshold is reached, and then the product is released for free download.

So, TNE could have an initial 'bare bones' release, text only, maybe some limited content (like only one of the species detailed per color?) and hold the 'deluxe' edition (with art and everything) to ransom, which would pay for all the frills.
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Post by Koumei »

Wait, people pay for roleplaying stuff not released by the biggest companies?

Actually, come to think of it, people pay for stuff by those companies too?
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Post by K »

the_taken wrote:
K wrote:
the_taken wrote:As I've mentioned before, you can go hunting for artists in the back yard.

www.Elfwood.com is an image board that hosts zillions of picks of fantasy and sci-fi of wildly varying quality. If you just ask, you may be able to find artists who are willing to let you use some of their images in exchange for a small amount of promotion, such as contact info.
You can probably do the same with other similar sites (I haven't looked for others, but I think Deviant Art is a little to broad...)
I've been checking out Elfwood for while.

When TNE is done, I was considering going the whole Penny Arcade route and set up a website and everything to give out the bad boy for free, and if we get enough people downloading it we might even be able to get swag or advertising.
Set up a website? What kind of website? I've got some stuff lying around and some free time coming up.

No, seriously. What do you need the website to do?
The idea is to build a relatively stable site that allows for downloads of the rules, places for people to comment and discuss, and other stuff. Frank and I also need to be able to post opinion pieces on related things like other games, console and PC games, movies, books, and the like.

As a business model, the "give it away for free and let advertisers pay" seems the only reasonable one, but it means that weekly content needs to be uploaded to bring people back. I expect that we could do weekly adventures highlighting certain rules in action.

I don't really know how one gets advertisers. I expect word of mouth and the like is the way to go.

There are a few "print and bind your PDF" sites out there, so I expect we'll get in bed with those guys.

Any profits will go to better art, better equipment for the site, and the like. If in the far flung future we could afford an employee, we'll do merch.

It's pretty ambitious, but it sounds like fun. The initial set-up shouldn't be much work since the hardest part is the ruleset, and Frank and I are already on that.

My expectations are pretty low, especially since Frank and I are both very busy people. At best, I'm hoping people mail us free swag.
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