Let's not add any more numbers to the d20 roll.

Psychic Robot · Post by **Psychic Robot** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:11 am

3.5 suffers from huge RNG problems because you're getting roughly +500 bonuses on your attack rolls, checks, and saves. So, here's what I suggest (in theory, not in reality, as I see that this will have a large number of problems):

You roll a d20. You succeed on a task if your roll is above a certain number. The only bonuses you get are to damage, and there are a very few things that can increase your range.

For instance, take attack rolls. When a fighter makes an attack, he succeeds on a 10 or higher. When a rogue makes an attack, he succeeds on a 14 or higher. When a wizard makes an attack, he succeeds on an 18 or higher.

By doing this, you completely bypass the problems with huge to-hit bonuses, and you can configure the percent success very easily. On the other hand, you end up with problems where things get kind of stupid, unless you put in some "safeguards" to the system where CR affects your chances to hit (no level 1 commoners smacking the dragon around, and no level 20 fighters missing goblins 45% of the time).

Thoughts?

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:36 am

Two things:
1) At very least, you want level to affect the hit chance. While you could apply a modifier based on relative CR, it would be a lot simpler to add x*level to both attack and defense.

2) Even with that, it's rather bland. You can't have anything like accurate-yet-weak attacks, or slow-yet-powerful attacks, or foes with good/poor defense relative to their overall competence. You lose out on a lot of situational modifiers as well, which may cut down on tactics.

NineInchNall · Post by **NineInchNall** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:06 pm

Eww! That's like Warhammer FRP.

Worst. Game. Ever.

Elennsar · Post by **Elennsar** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:08 pm

Dark Heresy is slightly worse. Slightly...hard to get much worse without changing the system.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:32 pm

The less modifiers you have, the more modifiers that are left will actually matter and be individually discernible.

-Username17

NineInchNall · Post by **NineInchNall** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:39 pm

I was thinking more of the situationally independent success rates.

Eww, in other words.

Psychic Robot · Post by **Psychic Robot** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:13 pm

I think RIFTS has a system like this. Perhaps we could remove most of the modifiers, then, instead of all of them.

Talisman · Post by **Talisman** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 10:11 pm

Sigma's talked about cutting the number of modifers available down from approximately 436,423 to about 5-6, which I think is definitely a good idea.

What you describe, P_R, is far too arbitrary and ...bland for me, at least as written. Seriously, no mods? None?

Maybe some sort of cap on the total you can get from mods, so you can't get +4 morale, +4 enhancement, +4 insight, +4 divine, +4 whatchamajigger and +4 arbitrarium for a total of +[broken].

Ice9 · Post by **Ice9** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:29 pm

The less modifiers you have, the more modifiers that are left will actually matter and be individually discernible.

To some extent yes - but +1 on a d20 roll is always a 5% better chance to hit, no matter how rare and special or common and prevalent +1 swords are. The only thing that really makes modifiers more/less special is if there are/aren't so many types that you can easily get a near 100% chance of success.

Tequila Sunrise · Post by **Tequila Sunrise** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:58 pm

Psychic Robot wrote:I think RIFTS has a system like this. Perhaps we could remove most of the modifiers, then, instead of all of them.

The important step is to begin with a list of possible bonus types, then all you have to do is remember to use that list whenever you invent a new bonus source. If you can do that, you're golden.

TS

ckafrica · Post by **ckafrica** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 1:58 am

Fading Suns had very few modifiers. You rolled a d20 against your combined attribute+skill to hit and then added things like range or cover and that was about it.

I particularly likied how they made the critical your target number your crit rather than 20.

bosssmiley · Post by **bosssmiley** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 9:21 am

"You roll a d20. You succeed on a task if your roll is above a certain number. The only bonuses you get are to damage, and there are a very few things that can increase your range."

Sounds a little like OD&D. Was that intentional?

Psychic Robot · Post by **Psychic Robot** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:25 pm

Sounds a little like OD&D. Was that intentional?

No, it wasn't, heh. I was just thinking aloud.