Help me actually understand Winds of Fate.

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Post by Username17 »

MGuy wrote:Here's that IF again. "If" people can evaluate their choices then everything is ok. I can't say that I can effectively evaluate my choices because you seem to be running on the logic that IF I say I do I probably can't.

However that "If" isn't what I asked about. What I asked you was how was cutting off people's ability to choose effectively different from them choosing to do the same their own?
No.

The number of choices you optimally give people is the same whether you use WoF or not. The correct choice is to give people about 6 cards to select from each round. That does not change if you change the cards between turns.

That's all WoF is. It's changing the cards you're selecting from on a turn by turn basis. This makes the choices somewhat fresher and makes it take longer for them to go stale. The actual hand size that you're selecting from stays the same regardless, because it is based on different constraints.

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Post by Ice9 »

On further reflection, I think it matters a lot what the choices you're picking from are - how niche / general, flexible, and complicated they are.
(Also, it will vary from player to player, but I don't know that there's a perfect fix for that - not all slow-deciding players self-identify as such)

If your choices are something like:
1) Major Image
2) Telekinesis
3) Summon Monster
4) Fabricate (non-slow version)
5) Polymorph
6) Control Weather (non-slow version)

Then six options is plenty. It might even be overkill.


But if it's six choices like:
1) Command Undead
2) Sunburst
3) Neutralize Poison
4) Banishment
5) Animal Friendship
6) Reciprocal Gyre

Then six is not enough. It doesn't matter how much the limited number of choices allows you to consider each option - no amount of consideration will make Command Undead useful when there aren't undead around.
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Post by Ice9 »

Incidentally, another reason why cards would be better than a matrix. With cards, you can draw at the end of your round (thus giving you the time between turns to mull over your choices) without revealing the result to all the other players.

As someone who actually likes the GM to be competitive (not adversarial) in tactical combat, this would be a big improvement. Actually matching wits is a lot different than pretending you don't know what they rolled.
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Post by MGuy »

Well here is the problem. Cards sound reasonable. However people will want some amount of meta decking. Scratch that, they will demand and repeatedly suggest that it exists. In MAGIC, yu-gi-oh, etc there are metadecking cards. If there were metadecking abilities or circumstances in WoF I think we could all breathe a bit easier about it snatching options away.
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Post by Ice9 »

I don't think that's a problem. Magic has tons of meta-deck abilities, but the vast majority of decks don't incorporate enough to negate all variation. And card-based selection abilities can be a lot more granular than matrix-based ones (or at least do so more easily).
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Post by MGuy »

True but there is still quite a bit of meta-decking abilities. Almost every deck I've actually seen someone play has some kind of deck searching or drawing mechanic in it.
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Post by Judging__Eagle »

I've not been watching for the last few pages, but I've been thinking about a way to blend WoF and the "hOMG TAKTICS" that people are so obviously nerdraging about.

1. Give every character X different types of powers every time they gain in power (numbers ranging from 4 to 8).

2. Players "prepare" their powers in advance, picking some sort of combo of powers that seems fitting to them. Ideally powers will fit into slots like: Basic, Special, Ultimate, Movement/Flee, Item etc.. Creatures can potentially gain more types of ability slots over increase in power; and items that have special effect can possibly qualify as "unlisted" abilities

3. Upon using a power, a creature rolls the WoF table for that slot. The next time they want to use that "time" of action, they have a different thing they can achieve at that moment. One could easily have one ability per level resulting in up to 20 options per slot, where a player rolls a d20 to see what they have got now.

This could be like Green Arrow "finding" an Ice Arrow one round (cold damage, slows target), then a Radio Scrambler the next (makes electronics suffer a penalty, plus a slow); and one "slot" being devoted to "crowd control" powers. This would be using some sort of "slot" system where Green Arrow could have: Damage; Non-Lethal; Tool; Crowd Control as options, and once fired, he rolls to see what's easily available next.

Thus you have some predictably in what your options in future rounds may be; but your just made action won't be repeated any time soon (barring luck, or tiny options within a pool).

One could also have the system allow for reshuffling of options; either "some time" (say a full round in D&D time) to shuffle all options; or a "full round" to make one option be the one you want. The first would be "Green Arrow rifles through the quiver, looking for some other options". The second would be "Green Arrow spends their round looking for an other [whatever] arrow!"

Having both is possibly viable, since both scenarios are plausible. As is allowing a player to have "predictable" actions, at the cost of "half as many actions" is something I'm perfectly fine with and notice holds true to even simulated combat. Being able to take a step back and reasses to figure out the "right tool for the job" is a massive investment of time and thought; which is very noticeable in a fight. Most people, most of the time, default to their normal routine, or flail wildly with whatever they pull out of their pocket next.

Personally, I see lots of good in both "Just As Planned, Mwha!" and "Oh shit! Do something nao!" as approaches to how to treat combat; some randomness, some planning; but there are upsides and downsides to both. Which is where the strategic and tactical elements kick in. Does a player burn half their rounds to use a specific power, or just go with the flow and do something, anything.
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Post by PhoneLobster »

What you just described is a hand of cards that you retain, have significant control over (more control than the 'arguments' in favor of WoF can permit without admitting they were stupid arguments) and which replaces expended cards with a new draw... only from X different draw decks just to make life awkward.

That's a great deal of complexity. Have we gained anything from it? Or are we at this point clutching at any and every straw no matter how needlessly complex and costly to desperately MAKE WoF work?

There is a point with a mechanic where you should just give up. 6+ separate 20+ card draw decks to grant some minimal choice to players in controlling their own character's actions while still pretending you are using WoF even though you are basically undermining it's principle premises with that particular implementation... that's a point at which WoF has failed.

If that's what it takes. just give it up already.
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Post by wotmaniac »

FrankTrollman wrote:I am inherently distrustful of self-efficacy, because it has a negative correlation with actual competence.

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on an individual level, this would be fine. however, a given gaming group is going to have a varied mix of competency levels -- actual comparisons can and will be made; sharing of knowledge will happen; learning will happen; .... Dunning-Kruger, at least within the context of a given group, will diminish.
making your point irrelevant.
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Post by Username17 »

wotmaniac wrote:
FrankTrollman wrote:I am inherently distrustful of self-efficacy, because it has a negative correlation with actual competence.

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on an individual level, this would be fine. however, a given gaming group is going to have a varied mix of competency levels -- actual comparisons can and will be made; sharing of knowledge will happen; learning will happen; .... Dunning-Kruger, at least within the context of a given group, will diminish.
making your point irrelevant.
It doesn't though. 42% of egineers in one company thought they were producing the top 5% of the work in the company. Seriously. Old people think that they are good drivers. The bottom 25% of students think that they are above the 60th percentile mark.

People do not magically become better at self assessment when they hang out with the same group of people for extended periods. It simply does not happen. And since there will never be a objective standard for being good at RPG tactical minigames, everyone is going to go on thinking they are personally awesome and nothing anyone can ever do or say will ever snap them out of this delusion.

That's reality. The statement "you should get better at this game" is not only exclusionary and elitist, it's statistically likely to be ironic. Since the people most likely to make such an argument are in reality the people who aren't actually very good.

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Post by wotmaniac »

Oh, Frank -- there you go again ..... you seem to really have a knack for over-reduction.
You keep trotting out and hanging your hat on these various studies and theories, but fail to take in to account confounding variables. :tsk:

In your little candy bar study, people are deciding between options that are all, presumably, aimed at the exact same goal -- snack satisfaction (oh, and do not try to break down "snack satisfaction" in to finer granularity -- that would just be silly and fallacious). Trying to draw definitive conclusions from that would be premature (and if I remember correctly, I think the study itself may have even made a nod to that). Never mind that decisive vs. indecisive is as much about personality as anything else. So, what -- you're now trying to either eliminate or engineer personality with your rule set? Just take the human factor out completely?
Oh, and don't let me forget about the issue of the nature of various goal-oriented behavior. In your little candy bar study, the "goal" is very nebulous. In a RPG setting, goals (at least as we're talking about here) are much more discrete and defined -- which necessarily at least give you a better framework for decision making.

Now you want to trot out Dunning-Kruger? Please.
Yes, it is empirical fact that people often have an over-developed sense of their own competence -- that's just a simple matter of their ego getting in the way .... and probably can be linked, at least in part, to this asinine practice of giving trophies to last-place finishers (it's been happening for decades, and it makes me want to vomit).
The confounding factors here are all related to the specific social dynamics that are (at least, in my experience) inherent in this type of gaming (that being the emphasis on team work and mutually-interdependent goals). It's because of that dynamic that, over time, one's actual competence will naturally increase (well, if anyone really cares about such a thing). I see it all the time -- someone has their character that they think is awesome; then someone else takes the same concept and amps it up to 11. person "a" sees this and is like "how the hell are you doing that better than me"; person "b" explains through instruction and demonstration; person "a" then gets better. The flip side of that (i.e., the under-confident, over-competent person) presents itself as someone who is reticent about "just doing it" ... this is a function of someone actually knowing what they don't know, and letting that get in the way. Again, I've seen it time and time again -- proper encouragement and so forth goes a long way to helping to bring someone out. It's a function of a dynamic social setting.
Let's look at your examples --
In the case of grandma's driving -- this is just an example of someone that assumes that the length of time of experience is all that matters (without ever having actual data put in front of them for honest consideration). This is someone who has been allowed to get way too set in their ways.
In the case of the under-confident engineers ... they have seen their betters in action (often in an environment that excludes certain context), and have set themselves an unrealistic and overly-idealistic standard of achievement. These people are typically going to be sharing a table with those who are lower on the competency scale than them .... and this builds confidence.
Now, if you're sitting in an echo-chamber, then no, nothing is going to change -- and that's a failing of the group. However, on the flip side -- if you have someone who has some "issues" at the table, and you are indeed recognizing those "issues", then it is incumbent upon you to address those issues. So, Dunning-Kruger doesn't really apply so much is you're actually giving/getting real-time, empirical, and useful feed-back.

Bottom line -- your little studies and theories are completely irrelevant, unless you're also willing to discuss confounding factors which happen to weaken the presence of said studies/theories.
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Post by Judging__Eagle »

wotcmaniac,

Have you seriously seen people playing games?

Or even what the "most popular" games are?

They're completely and utterly simple and stupid in their simplicity.

Seriously, WoW is.... a character hitting 5-6 keys (at most) for "normal" encounters; and really.... they're actually using the "same" sort of powers, just spread out across 10 "types" of abilities (at most). Usually characters have 1 or 2 "types" of powers that correspond with their powerset and just hit the same ones over and over; then hit others in specific situations, or when they are "off" of cooldown.

(only PvPers tend towards the 50 ability range, yes it is done, most of it involves mapping the same sets of keys around the WASD grid with Ctrl, Alt and Shift + ]Key]; some people seriously Mouse-Click their powers and play the game).

It's not "complicated" in the slightest for most common play; only as you approach competing with other humans does the difficulty increase exponentially.

An other rather interesting "game" is... League of Legends; where characters quite literally have only 6 moves of doom; a single character to move around; and need to simply be good at positioning, in order to survive long-term.

The case being made that people really can't manage more than 6-10 powers at once is... actually very fair.

Only pan-gamers or super-gamers who cross multiple genres and forms of game (be it AA's FPS, TA's RTS or WoW's PvP) are going to be the sort of person who can seriously manage 40 options effectively.

The case could also be made that games should have more than one mode of player difficulty/skill. Lower skill Mode gives more basic options, but less of them. Higher Skill Mode gives many more options, each with Niche roles.

Because honestly, everyone knows that the new player is not going to get the hang of things right away; and there really needs to be an easy way to get them on-board and most importantly, feeling as if they are effectively contributing to story progression and advancement.


Phonelobster;

Yes, doing it with cards would be ridiculous; but you could reduce the size of the matrix down all the way to 1 per slot type; and add on a new option to a (or some, or every) slot at each "level" (or whatever).

Personally, I'm not saying that WoF is the be all and end all of ability timing mechanics, and have other preferred systems myself, but I do recognize that it has some very effective ways to give players a wider range of options to use and a much more sane way of allowing players to manage them all.
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Post by Username17 »

Wotmanic wrote:Oh, and don't let me forget about the issue of the nature of various goal-oriented behavior. In your little candy bar study, the "goal" is very nebulous. In a RPG setting, goals (at least as we're talking about here) are much more discrete and defined -- which necessarily at least give you a better framework for decision making.
Blow it out your ass. That is the most retardedly pretentious idea paraded around here in years. And this is the gaming den. For the candy studies, the goal is to get the best result from your snack. In an RPG the goal is to get the best result from your imaginary fight with an imaginary group of imaginary trolls. Whatever.

The choice demotivation experiments are mirrored and even harsher when the participants are paid money based on their choices and the goal is to maximize th amount of money received. That is clearer and more defined than any goal in any RPG could ever be. After all, the best story might be had by losing to the imaginary trolls and having to escape from their imaginary cave. Getting more money is just getting more money.

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Post by PhoneLobster »

Judging__Eagle wrote:and a much more sane way of allowing players to manage them all.
Really. Remember that Frank's preferred implementation, as theoretical and absolutely incomplete as basically everything he ever does is, involves 800 abilities.

All of which will be on cards.

And being an indie homebrew thing that means 800 cards that, if you were to even trail this system (let alone edit, or adopt as a mechanic for your own independent system), YOU will have to print out, cut, and organize.

And that's if you don't need to have say, oh I dunno, more than one copy of any given ability.

Even aside from cards, seriously, the discussion of even "small" scale samples with 24 abilities, including no less than a half dozen or so pallete swapped "non-fatal arrow attack!" variants?

Your own argument in support of WoF involves setting up a rather flamboyant strawman of no less than "40+" ability choices ALL of which are somehow inexplicably actual contenders for "best possible action this turn"?

Come back to me when "sane" doesn't involve such ricockulous insanity.
An other rather interesting "game" is... League of Legends
Well, League of Legends is certainly... interesting but to bring it up as an example of anything you should in any way seek to emulate is also... interesting...

...what with general game balance and player "options" being such a tremendously cocked up mess of stupidity. I mean seriously, the guys who design that game are actually generally trolling their own gaming community.

"This month we have realized the community's concerns over the superiority of Jungling, Tanky DPS and AOE stacking teams are all well founded and need to be addressed desperately! We will be nerfing all these clearly over powered roles for the betterment of the game"....

..."Also this month we are releasing a new Champion that is an excellent Tanky DPSer, has incredible Jungling abilities, and some of the best stackable AOEs in the game! Also, that character is an actual honest to god Troll, who's name is honest to god defined by the Urban Dictionary as 'To rhythmically drum on the buttocks of a lover or sexual partner.' "

Let's not even ask the Urban Dictionary about Annie. Or go into LoL too much, you could fill a thread with what's wrong with their game design.

I know I've certainly filled a couple even if they are becoming a little dated what with Patch Fever but they give you some insight into Riot's "game balance" priorities.

So yeah. Let's emulate THOSE guys... :bored:
Frank wrote:Blow it out your ass.
His criticism was quiet valid and your counterargument never got any better than the blow it out your ass bit.
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Post by mean_liar »

I liked the bit about pretentiousness, personally. It was deliciously non-self-aware.
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Post by Orion »

Wow PL, you managed to make less sense than JE. Whether LoL is BALANCED or not is totally irrelevant since the point was that it has engaging gameplay with only 4 activated abilities. That said, your linked rants ARE pretty entertaining. You could improve them by cutting down the repetition a bit but I give you 8 out of 10.

Although--while you will NOT hear me say that LoL is balanced--I am a little perplexed by your choice of evidence. When you said they were "slightly obsoleted," you meant 'Riot listened to my complaints and addressed them," right? Cause, they nerfed Shaco, repeatedly. And they gave Teemo *exactly* what you said he needed, an active mobility skill.

Yi still sucks though.

PS: Argumentum ab Libra Urbanibus does not impress me. I'm relatively certain you can put any english word into Urban Dictionary and get a sex act as the first hit. I've never heard of "trundling" "leblanc" or any of that shit, nor has anyone I know.
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Post by wotmaniac »

I'm not sure how valid it is to compare video games with TT/PnP games. The difference in medium does make things drastically different.
let me know how much detail (if any) I need to go in to on that
FrankTrollman wrote:That is the most retardedly pretentious idea paraded around here in years.
Oh, do tell, Frank. Do tell.

The goal in candy bar selection ...... depends on how you are defining the goal. The goal of "pick a specific candy bar" is actually a secondary goal -- the primary goal is to satisfy a visceral urge, that is only conceptualized as simply "I want a snack". I'd say that is a fairly nebulous thing .... unless, of course, you're idea of snack craving is "I want a snickers" (in which case, the study is inapplicable, because you already decided before you even looked at or considered the selection).
Selecting which power to use in a specific situation for a specific effect is much more defined.

Oh, and as to your "shallow" heuristics .... the way you have described it is indeed shallow -- and anyone using their heuristics in such a short-sighted way is demonstrating a very unimaginative approach to their problem solving.

You know, the more I think about it ...... your retorts/rebuttals to me seem to indicate that maybe I might be hitting a little close to home. :headscratch:
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Post by Username17 »

wotmaniac wrote: Oh, and as to your "shallow" heuristics .... the way you have described it is indeed shallow -- and anyone using their heuristics in such a short-sighted way is demonstrating a very unimaginative approach to their problem solving.
Look: the people who said that you should arrange your character sheet with a series of key words and then eliminate all the ones that didn't have the "right" key words (metaphorical or actual) for the tactical situation at hand were you and hogarth. That was your actual suggestion for how to actually do things and how you two actually described your actual methodology in actual play. Not me. You.

It was hogarth who contended that WoF would necessarily lead to top decking because he decided that he was going to use an area attack before looking at his available powers. Your very own description of tightening your shots based on power keywords sounds like exactly the same procedure.

Deep tactics is to consider the ramifications of each possible option and then using the option with the best predicted result. Shallow tactics is to decide a type of effect you're going to use, eliminate all options that don't produce that kind of effect, and then only give serious consideration to whatever options remain. That is shallow because it does not ever produce out of the box thinking or solutions - the options are limited to inside the box before consideration is granted to any of them.

Your presented solution to option paralysis is to simply make shallow decisions. That... "works". I guess. It's just that since it is completely anathema to the goals I am operating under, I genuinely don't know why you are still talking.

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Post by wotmaniac »

.... so your proposal is the dart board method? yeah, real deep there.

your over-simplification is understood -- I over-simplified it myself .... I was trying to save thread space, given that I was dropping walls o' text to begin with.

but since it doesn't fit your narrative, you're gonna try to make it mean whatever it is you want it to mean anyway.

have fun in your echo-chamber.
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Post by PhoneLobster »

Orion wrote:you meant 'Riot listened to my complaints and addressed them," right?
Reactive balancing once the COMMUNITY notices something is wrong is nice, but it is VERY late. The fact those threads were highly relevant at the time is important. They seriously "remade" Teemo to be "viable"... and did so in a manner that basically did nothing good for him at all, they genuinely made Shaco as a "I'm better at 12 different specialist roles than a bunch of 1 trick pony specialists" and thought that was a good idea in the first place and took what? Well over 6 months to cave to community pressure over it.

And there is the troll thing. I mean really that one is pretty blatant. And how long have they been promising to remove Flash for? Etc...

Basically these guys don't even come CLOSE to balance on their own and only ever seem to get arm twisted into it by the community. And even then reluctantly.
I've never heard of "trundling" "leblanc" or any of that shit, nor has anyone I know.
And yet when I heard their little girl going on about her bear tibbers I somehow knew EXACTLY what I would get when I looked up Tibbers on urban dictionary.

Not cool Riot, not funny.
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Post by hogarth »

FrankTrollman wrote:
Look: the people who said that you should arrange your character sheet with a series of key words and then eliminate all the ones that didn't have the "right" key words (metaphorical or actual) for the tactical situation at hand were you and hogarth. That was your actual suggestion for how to actually do things and how you two actually described your actual methodology in actual play. Not me. You.
Frank, I don't know whether you're being a moron or a bald-faced liar, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and use smaller words.

I was discussing your Green Arrow example, because that's the only example you've given us.

The matrix you showed us is full of slight variants on a single power (e.g. Damage, Entangle, Blind, etc.). You're the one who designed it that way, not me.

Presumably in some situations, Damage is the optimal choice to make. Otherwise you're a fuckwit to put Damage powers in there in the first place.

In my experience, in the majority of situations where Damage is the optimal choice, the player really doesn't give a shit whether it's electric damage or punching damage or sonic damage. So those variations just add cosmetic variety most of the time.

You even implicitly acknowledge that you should be able to pick Damage or Entangle most of the time by putting a Damage or Entangle option in each row. So there isn't really any additional tactical depth using Winds of Fate here; instead of the player choosing his favourite Damage or Entangle power (whichever is optimal), he chooses whatever Damage or Entangle power happens to be in row #4 (e.g.). That's the most superficial kind of variety humanly possible.
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Post by Swordslinger »

FrankTrollman wrote: It was hogarth who contended that WoF would necessarily lead to top decking because he decided that he was going to use an area attack before looking at his available powers. Your very own description of tightening your shots based on power keywords sounds like exactly the same procedure.
This is because the nature of the battle itself may dictates your tactics. If you're facing a bunch of weak enemies, you're looking for something that attacks multiple foes. If you're fighting a single big foe, then you want an attack optimized at dealing with a single target.

That should be blatantly obvious to anyone with a bit of strategic thinking.

If you want strategic depth, you're much better off having variant win conditions, different terrain and unique enemy abilities for the fight, which will get people to use different stuff.

WoF wont' change base strategic principles. All it will do is mean that sometimes you wanted to grapple an escaping enemy, but you can't because you got unlucky on your roll.
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Post by mean_liar »

hogarth wrote: You even implicitly acknowledge that you should be able to pick Damage or Entangle most of the time by putting a Damage or Entangle option in each row. So there isn't really any additional tactical depth using Winds of Fate here; instead of the player choosing his favourite Damage or Entangle power (whichever is optimal), he chooses whatever Damage or Entangle power happens to be in row #4 (e.g.). That's the most superficial kind of variety humanly possible.
Honestly I feel like a better way to do WoF is to have the matrix column determined by something like CAN rather than a dieroll, and have the matrix a series of ramping-up powers.

Then, you only have your 5MoD - its just that most of those don't default to their full power unless you've beat on your opponent.
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Post by Lago PARANOIA »

wotmaniac wrote: .... so your proposal is the dart board method? yeah, real deep there.
Uh, no, it's not just a dart board method. The dart board method would be if WoF only dictated one power you could use for the round.
hogarth wrote: In my experience, in the majority of situations where Damage is the optimal choice, the player really doesn't give a shit whether it's electric damage or punching damage or sonic damage. So those variations just add cosmetic variety most of the time.
:facepalm:

There's no reason for powers to have to be 5 flavors of 'elemental arrow'. As we've seen from 3E and 4E D&D these are really bad ideas. Green Arrow having a row of Sonic / Fire / Lightning / Armor Piercing Arrow is really shallow. Green Arrow having a row of Armor Piercing / Ricochet / Willie Pete / Grappling Hook Arrow need not be depending on how the powers are constructed.

I don't even think that there should be vanilla-damage arrow, because it's really tactically shallow and a lot of people are going to hit that button because they don't have to think about it. 4E had a good idea in its idea of having powers come with a side order of status effect or extra manuever, they just didn't take it far enough.
You even implicitly acknowledge that you should be able to pick Damage or Entangle most of the time by putting a Damage or Entangle option in each row.
There's a difference between 'should be able to' and 'should'. I should be able to use the entangling option every round if that's what I want, but that doesn't mean that I should.

If you have a game where you can figure out that you want to use without Net Arrow over the other five arrows off of such a simple description as 'four mooks bunched up in the hallway' then you either have a really simple game or you're a lazy dumbass who is a perfect example of the DK effect. Considering that not even 4E D&D is that consistently shallow then guess what I'm going to call this 'strategy'?
mean_liar wrote: Then, you only have your 5MoD - its just that most of those don't default to their full power unless you've beat on your opponent.
Why is it that every one of your and PL alternate suggestions are some flavor of 'pretend the previous criticisms don't exist and go ahead with it anyway'?
Josh Kablack wrote:Your freedom to make rulings up on the fly is in direct conflict with my freedom to interact with an internally consistent narrative. Your freedom to run/play a game without needing to understand a complex rule system is in direct conflict with my freedom to play a character whose abilities and flaws function as I intended within that ruleset. Your freedom to add and change rules in the middle of the game is in direct conflict with my ability to understand that rules system before I decided whether or not to join your game.

In short, your entire post is dismissive of not merely my intelligence, but my agency. And I don't mean agency as a player within one of your games, I mean my agency as a person. You do not want me to be informed when I make the fundamental decisions of deciding whether to join your game or buying your rules system.
Lago PARANOIA
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Post by Lago PARANOIA »

Swordslinger wrote: This is because the nature of the battle itself may dictates your tactics. If you're facing a bunch of weak enemies, you're looking for something that attacks multiple foes. If you're fighting a single big foe, then you want an attack optimized at dealing with a single target.

That should be blatantly obvious to anyone with a bit of strategic thinking.
No, that's really shallow. If the multiple weak enemies are doing something like synching their auras to create a fuckoff shield, then an AoE might not be the best tactic. If the multiple weak enemies are like the Psycho Rangers where one of the team members have a disproportionately powerful tactic like healing or mezzing, you might want to target that particular mobile first. If the multiple weak enemies are cowards that flee after 1/4th of their members go down, then you want to unload everyone on the weakest-looking member. Even doing something like 'there's a high-level troll with class levels, unleash the acid arrows and fireballs!' shouldn't be a go-to tactic, because that troll may have covered their basis with a resist elements spell--then your best option would be something else

You can't just pick out a general strategy ahead of time and then say 'this is what I would always do!' You have to evaluate things on a round-by-round and combat-by-combat basis or you're going to pick some suboptimal tactics. All of those situations I've mentioned are not only common spanners but they're all stuff that D&D coined. D&D totally has morale checks. D&D totally invented the 'shoot the medic first' tactic. How could anyone who plays D&D, any edition of it, and say what you said with any confidence? D&D is not that shallow, D&D was never that shallow.

So no, it's only blatantly obvious to a dumbfuck who thinks that they're a strategic Mary Tzu badass but has had their brains turned to mush by jRPGs. Again, perfect example of the Dunning-Krueger effect.
Josh Kablack wrote:Your freedom to make rulings up on the fly is in direct conflict with my freedom to interact with an internally consistent narrative. Your freedom to run/play a game without needing to understand a complex rule system is in direct conflict with my freedom to play a character whose abilities and flaws function as I intended within that ruleset. Your freedom to add and change rules in the middle of the game is in direct conflict with my ability to understand that rules system before I decided whether or not to join your game.

In short, your entire post is dismissive of not merely my intelligence, but my agency. And I don't mean agency as a player within one of your games, I mean my agency as a person. You do not want me to be informed when I make the fundamental decisions of deciding whether to join your game or buying your rules system.
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