Hi Shadzar! I'll address your point for a second, but then I'd like you to do a tangential favor for me.
shadzar wrote:There isn't going to be a system where you can ever min-max a non-combat situation such as skill challenges unless you devote your time to that system, nd just everyone go by the dice.
So there isn't any min maxing of a non combat mechanics... unless they exist and someone min maxes them?
And look, I'm all in favor of arbitrary role played crap as a means of dealing with many of these parts of game play. But you think that can't be exploited?
Amateur dramatics skills aside. You are talking about what essentially is a game of "May I please Sir?" with the GM. And you can totally game that system, the GM is full of exploitable loopholes to negotiate your way through. It's just a mildly different skills set to remembering to pick all your options so they stack up in a large pile.
Now onto my favor...
Phone Lobster's Basket Weaver Survey!
OK so you've expressed an opinion that there are players (presumably like yourself) who
aren't "Min Maxer's", "Munchkins", or Combat obsessed psycho clowns or whatever.
However I have a theory that these players, these "Real Role Players" if you will
do not really exist.
So could you answer these survey questions for me.
1) Do you choose to use an RPG rules system where ~90% of the rules focus on combat?
2) Are ~90% of the rules you actually use in game play combat related rules?
3) How much time would you say you spend resolving combat in your various sessions? 10% or less? 80% or more? Something else?
4) Of the time you don't spend resolving combats how much of it is spent maneuvering to effect combats, such as sneaking, socializing or using other negotiations with the GM to try to effect, apply or avoid combat circumstances, allies, abilities, ambushes, environments, etc... ?
5) Of the events you would deem "Most Important" to the outcome of the "story" of an adventure or campaign (such as defeating the villain who was trying to destroy the world or whatever), how many of those events were combat events? What proportion of such events were instead resolved using Profession(Basket Weaving), or something like it?
5a) If such formalized skills as Profession(Basket Weaving) displease you, how many such events were instead resolved by just negotiating with the GM until he agreed that things just turned out a certain way "Because of Role Play"?
5b) If 5a applies, were the players in your group OK with that happening? Or were some displeased for some reason?
6) Are your characters specialists at Combat? That is, are their classes and professions actually primarily Combat related in nature?
7) Have you ever selected a selectable character ability simply because it made your character better at Combat?
8 ) Do you enjoy resolving combat in RPGs?
9) Do you enjoy resolving Basket Weaving in RPGs?
10) Do you ever try to "Role Play" a situation using no formal rules but disagree with your GMs determination of the results?
11) Are you in fact Big Foot, the Lockness Monster, or a Bunyip?
So anyway I could, and should make a longer quiz, but if you could get me some answers on that some time soon I might start keeping some sort of record of this.
It's all for science. Though I'm afraid if your answers DO indicate you are an actual real life Basket Weaver I will have to send native trackers into the Jungle to shoot you with tranquilizers so we can bring you in to prove your actual existence and start a captive breeding program to save the species.
Just like I would if you answer yes to question 11.