Dreamscarred Press Can Climb a Wall of Dicks

Meikle641 · Post by **Meikle641** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:53 am

So, the year is 2008, and the relatively new company Dreamscarred Press has branched out into patronage projects, where we supply money and ideas/goals, and they do what they can to write a working product. In late 2008 they successfully make a product for me, and I loved it so much I arranged to have two more products made. Indeed, several of us arranged for systems or products to be made or adapted for use with 3.5 psionics.

So, initially things seem to be going well. I get some fluff and some rough mechanics done on one of them... And then Pathfinder comes into play. Basically, Dreamscarred Press stopped development on everything but their new project: updating psionics to Pathfinder. Several years go by, with a yearly PM or two from myself, where I get given some empty words and apologies with assurances that projects will be finished.

So, on Friday I made another public post asking whether they're finally going to finish the fucking work assignments from five fucking years ago. As of yet, no response. I don't particularly expect them to, but I can't let this pass uncontested.

Should I start making posts on their Facebook and such to finally force a response? Hilariously, the designer to blame for this keeps asking me to join him on LinkedIn. Nope.

OgreBattle · Post by **OgreBattle** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:16 am

Join him on Linkedin and ask him there

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:23 am

Actually, that's a good idea. Especially if you can ask him publicly. Linkedin in a professional networking site, so if such a question goes unaddressed, he would look unprofessional.

icyshadowlord · Post by **icyshadowlord** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:02 pm

Prak_Anima wrote:Actually, that's a good idea. Especially if you can ask him publicly. Linkedin in a professional networking site, so if such a question goes unaddressed, he would look unprofessional.

Pretty much what I'd say as well.

hogarth · Post by **hogarth** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:13 pm

Did you pay them money to publish something? Or did they promise you some money? What does your contract say?

If they're in breach of contract, sue them (although it probably wouldn't be worth it). If they're not, suck it up and find someone else to publish your stuff.

ishy · Post by **ishy** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:55 pm

If you gave them money to develop an idea you had (like say mass battle rules, though probably something psionic). You could probably just ask for a refund? Seeing as how their priorities are elsewhere.

JigokuBosatsu · Post by **JigokuBosatsu** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:19 pm

Yeah, if you're out to reclaim any sort of IP or anything, I'd say hound them publicly. If it's about the money... does Canada have small claims court?

Meikle641 · Post by **Meikle641** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:41 pm

It's not so much about the money as it is the principle. There were about 5 or 6 projects left to hang when they pounced on Pathfinder. To be fair, they are the de-facto psionics system for PF now, so at least that has worked out for them.

Their 3.5 work was fairly good, btw. I particularly liked their one class, the Worldthought Medic. It has a list of powers it chooses daily like a cleric, has offensive healing (touch and ranged touch) attacks, and can even transfer healing from party members at range. A healer that didn't feel like a gimp.

Hogarth: I paid them them to develop a supplement of flying castles, since it is a fantasy staple to have flying landmasses and castles. The other was four ripoffs of the Chaos gods with a 5-level class for servants of said gods. No contracts were signed, however.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:27 pm

Depending on how much you paid, I'd ask for a refund anyway, assuming public hounding on LinkedIn doesn't work, better money and nothing, than no money and nothing.

hogarth · Post by **hogarth** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:43 pm

Meikle641 wrote:Hogarth: I paid them them to develop a supplement of flying castles, since it is a fantasy staple to have flying landmasses and castles. The other was four ripoffs of the Chaos gods with a 5-level class for servants of said gods. No contracts were signed, however.

My apologies: I didn't read the original post carefully enough; you were fairly clear that it was a patronage, "Kickstarter" kind of thing.

In that case, I would keep asking for my money back via their message boards and via email. That kind of strategy eventually worked for Nic Logue's Razor Coast patronage project, which also fell into a black hole for years and years.

Asking them to put out a product that they're not interested in producing sounds doomed to failure, though.

infected slut princess · Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:01 am

As a general rule, you should never pay writers in advance of the product being made. Most writers are notoriously lazy dreamers with delusions of self-importance who suffer from a serious problem -- the lack of ability to actually get work done. If you pay only upon the completion of work, or better yet offer a share of profits, you automatically screen out the losers and get the motivated, productive writers on your side.

EDIT:

miekle641 wrote:It's not so much about the money as it is the principle.

That attitude sucks. Did you give them money for them to produce something for you? Or did you give them money out of charity, and say, "Hey, if you get a chance, maybe make this thing for me?" They sound like assholes. You should email or call the person in charge of your project. If you can't deal with them, call the person who runs the company.

Hicks · Post by **Hicks** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:16 am

Hey Meikle641, I could totally write you a supplement on flying castles, for cheap or even free depending on how involved you want the project to be. My wife is an expert at Microsoft Office and a professional desktop publisher for ~15 years, and depending on how far you wanted to go I could do pencil and pen artwork/drafting as well. PM me what you want accomplished in the document, and we can negotiate payment before I start, and it will be due when the work is finished. First up: I totally want a cut of the profit.

Meikle641 · Post by **Meikle641** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:31 am

Okay, so I made myself a LinkedIn account and am all set up. How would I go about doing this? Posting facebook style and somehow tagging him and the company?

infected slut princess: It's been almost 5 years, and the money wasn't too large in quantity. But dicking over several clients with nobody making a stink? I can't abide by that.

Hicks: I did ask the Den in my Floating Rocks thread if anybody would do it for pay, but I don't recall any takers. I'll keep you in mind, but I'm a bit short of cash right now as I'm having a labour dispute with my employer.

Stubbazubba · Post by **Stubbazubba** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:37 am

Get the several clients together, then, and call yourselves a class and throw in the word class-action every now and then. No, you can't sue them, but it'll put just a little more pressure on them, if individual inquiries are being ignored.

Wulf · Post by **Wulf** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:06 am

I applied for several projects as well. A class and a joined project that I share with Meikle (Soul fusion or something it was called).

They gave me an apology and my money back, and also promised to give me updates how far the progress is (so I would still get the subsystem and my money). Sadly, after that email, I never heard anything from them again.

Hicks · Post by **Hicks** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:35 pm

So, yeah; I'm doing this. Right now I'm in the research phase, examining material mass, volume, and hardness, slightly expanding what information is available in the 3.5 SRD. So far it appears that the rules support that Airships would be able to be owned and built by level 6, and the Kingdom of Zeal can be pulled off by level 11. The Outline is as follows:

Table of Contents
Introduction
Why Flying Castles?
Modes of Lift
Modes Mobility
Construction
Administration
Siegecraft in the Sky
Index

fectin · Post by **fectin** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:05 pm

Stubbazubba wrote:Get the several clients together, then, and call yourselves a class and throw in the word class-action every now and then. No, you can't sue them, but it'll put just a little more pressure on them, if individual inquiries are being ignored.

Calling it class-action is nothing but bluster, because you're pretty unlikely (IMHO) to get cert as a class.

There is no reason you can't sue though. Small claims costs ~$10 to file, at least stateside. Look around and find a how-to, or chat with a lawyer friend.

If you do that (or would like to threaten credibly), type up a letter laying out (factually! leave your feelings out) a timeline and summary of the contract as you understood it. Include copies of any receipts, records of payment, or email agreements and clearly reference them in your letter. Do not include anything you don't reference. Be sure to close with a (polite) demand for the remedy you want and a reasonable deadline. Use small words and simple sentance constructions (it's more persuasive. It's also easier to write well that way, and you want this as straightforward as possible).

Make an exact copy of everything in the envelope and save it. Send the letter by certified mail.